IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2012-10-01

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kerio	free	00:11
kerio	ah fuck	00:11
kerio	freemangordon: your fucking extkbd fucked up my layout	00:11
kerio	is rx-51 actually used by the bt keyboard?	00:14
kerio	i restored it now	00:14
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DocScrutinizer05	speech!	00:21
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DocScrutinizer05	3 times is probably too much, even for me	00:22
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vi__	freemangordon: ping	00:27
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MrOpposite	How do I allow microb (or webpages) to access my GPS?	00:34
SpeedEvil	hmm	00:34
SpeedEvil	I vaguely remember something inatallable	00:34
SpeedEvil	search location. in ham	00:34
MrOpposite	Some time ago I got the question if I wanted to allow a certain site to use the GPS when I navigated to it	00:34
MrOpposite	But that site changed design, and it's now a javascripted button, which gives me an error message saying permission denied	00:35
MrOpposite	SpeedEvil ham?	00:35
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SpeedEvil	hildon application manager	00:37
MrOpposite	ah, that slow thing :P	00:38
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MrOpposite	I mainly use the terminal for package installation...	00:38
SpeedEvil	well apt-cache death location	00:40
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SpeedEvil	search, not death	00:40
vi__	search repos for microb geolocation	00:41
vi__	I have NFC as to how it actually does it though.	00:41
MrOpposite	yea I did	00:42
MrOpposite	Looking at the microb-geolocation package atm	00:42
MrOpposite	Trying to figure out whenever it's IP based or GPS based	00:42
SpeedEvil	go	00:42
SpeedEvil	GOS	00:42
SpeedEvil	GPS	00:42
vi__	obviously it is GPS based but how??	00:43
DocScrutinizer51	liblocation based	00:43
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DocScrutinizer51	search wiki for liblocation	00:44
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DocScrutinizer51	liblocation0 and maemo-geolocation, I'd guess	00:46
DocScrutinizer51	liblocation does at least GPS based rough location, GPS and AGPS	00:48
DocScrutinizer51	s/GPS/GSM/	00:48
infobot	DocScrutinizer51 meant: liblocation does at least GSM based rough location, GPS and AGPS	00:48
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DocScrutinizer51	it's unclear if it does wifi location as well, ala skyhook	00:49
DocScrutinizer51	we're all very happy it's another piece of software put by okia into FOSS... NOT	00:50
MrOpposite	whei!	00:52
MrOpposite	anyway	00:52
MrOpposite	I take it is the super-mega-awesome geolocation extension for microb I need	00:53
MrOpposite	and had installed	00:53
MrOpposite	now to the fun part	00:53
MrOpposite	where do I manage it's permissions?	00:53
MrOpposite	its*	00:53
DocScrutinizer51	NFC	00:53
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DocScrutinizer51	about:settings?	00:54
MrOpposite	horray for easily cofigurable free software!	00:54
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MrOpposite	configurable*	00:54
DocScrutinizer51	what's free in this POS?	00:55
vi__	free?	00:55
vi__	LOLLINNGTONS	00:55
DocScrutinizer51	webkit engine?	00:55
vi__	you are free to GTFO.	00:55
vi__	accordingm to nokia.	00:55
DocScrutinizer51	vi__: please!	00:55
MrOpposite	I was being sarcastic at the lack of documentation for the geolocation	00:55
MrOpposite	oh right	00:56
vi__	I am unaware of there being any settings for geolocation for microb.	00:56
DocScrutinizer51	oooh, it HAS quite a bit of docs in wiki	00:56
MrOpposite	really?	00:56
DocScrutinizer51	like 3 screens full	00:56
vi__	DocScrutinizer51: geolocation for microb?	00:56
DocScrutinizer51	liblocation that is	00:57
vi__	DocScrutinizer51: do you use a BT KB?	00:57
DocScrutinizer51	no	00:57
MrOpposite	anyway	00:57
vi__	have you ever?	00:57
MrOpposite	I've tried cofiguring the about:config page in microb once before	00:57
MrOpposite	it involved xforwarding to a desktop in order to use right-click	00:57
MrOpposite	is there an easier way?	00:57
DocScrutinizer51	it's tricky	00:57
DocScrutinizer51	nah, I recall I found a trick	00:58
vi__	I got this one!	00:58
vi__	~vibinds	00:58
vi__	~vi_binds	00:58
vi__	god dammit	00:58
vi__	~vi_bind	00:58
vi__	~vibind	00:58
vi__	-_-	00:59
DocScrutinizer51	was like typing name of parameter to top search	00:59
vi__	how to search?	00:59
DocScrutinizer51	where?	00:59
vi__	list key thing	00:59
vi__	here in irc	00:59
DocScrutinizer51	~listkeys xy	00:59
infobot	Factoid search of 'xy' by key (21 of 103): airport yxy ;; aproxy ;; cgiproxy ;; galeon proxy ;; iaxy ;; load-balancing-mod_proxy ;; log-proxy ;; micro_proxy ;; mod_proxy_ajp ;; mr sexy pants ;; noxy ;; open proxy ;; oxyd ;; png2jpg proxy ;; proxy ftp ;; proxyarp ;; proxytalk ;; sexy ;; sexygeek ;; sexyken ;; simpleproxy.	00:59
vi__	~listkeys vi	01:00
infobot	Factoid search of 'vi' by key (15 of 1074): cmd: viking (.*?) ;; debian 2.2. review ;; djview ;; dont be evil ;; evil_alex jtag ;; example html <marquee behavior> ;; gfontview ;; gtview ;; jargon virtual reality2 ;; jargon visionary ;; modules r evil ;; nvidia guide ;; nvidia-install ;; pogovina ;; problem i'm having.	01:00
vi__	someone deleted it?	01:00
vi__	~listkeys vi-	01:01
infobot	Factoid search of 'vi-' by key (3): vi-kbd ;; vi-is-better ;; poor man's vi-mode.	01:01
DocScrutinizer51	deleted what?	01:01
vi__	~vi-kbd	01:01
infobot	i heard vi-kbd is http://wiki.maemo.org/Remapping_keyboard/user_vis_awesome_kbdmapping	01:01
vi__	BOOYAH	01:01
vi__	who wanted right click?	01:01
DocScrutinizer51	there's also listvalues	01:01
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vi__	MrOpposite: ~vi-kbd	01:02
MrOpposite	thank you	01:02
DocScrutinizer51	and something like author	01:02
MrOpposite	can I use the mouse-thingie without the actual keymap?	01:02
vi__	MrOpposite: yes.	01:02
DocScrutinizer51	~author vi_	01:03
MrOpposite	goodie	01:03
vi__	you need xdotool and xbindkeys though.	01:03
DocScrutinizer51	meh, there's ~help	01:03
vi__	lets you use ctrl+click on screen to right click.	01:03
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vi__	the keymap is also thouroughly recommended	01:04
DocScrutinizer51	indeed, though I didn't manage to deal with it yet	01:06
vi__	gtg bb	01:08
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int_ua	maemo.org down	02:30
SpeedEvil	:'(	02:31
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FIQ\|n900	hm..	03:13
FIQ\|n900	HAM is weird	03:13
FIQ\|n900	I'm proceeding to install CSSU, and HAM, apart from looking like not doing anything at all (no dialog or "waiting" symbol or anything) to show CSSU enabler install dialog. Then it just prompts "Could not install Community SSU enabler."	03:15
FIQ\|n900	OK - awesome error reporting	03:15
FIQ\|n900	Is there a way to	03:15
FIQ\|n900	check why it didn't install?	03:16
FIQ\|n900	huh	03:17
FIQ\|n900	there seems to be a Community SSU button in the application menu even though HAM said it failed...	03:17
FIQ\|n900	HAM is confusing :<	03:17
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Skry	HAM is bad	03:34
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FIQ\|n900	hmm	03:45
FIQ\|n900	also, "(null) Install anyway" dialogs doesn't help either :p	03:45
FIQ\|n900	also, "(null) Install anyway?" dialogs doesn't help either :p	03:46
Skry	very useful feedback indeed	03:47
FIQ\|n900	oh god why are you doing this to me, HAM :(	03:48
FIQ\|n900	how am I supposed to install coreutils-gnu in devel when I can't even activate the repo (because the list somehow is empty)	03:49
FIQ\|n900	After my last reflash, I decided to only activate devel when needed	03:50
FIQ\|n900	What a bad idea that was... as it requires me to actually use HAM (to disable/enable devel)	03:50
FIQ\|n900	hmm	03:53
FIQ\|n900	which files does busybox source?	03:53
FIQ\|n900	get "ls: unrecognized option `--color=none'" when I start busybox, would like to know where it's used	03:54
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merlin1991	FIQ\|n900: regarding ham empty list	04:50
merlin1991	fire up ham, then fire up console and run top, ham is ready for you when apt-worker* process don't clog your system anymore	04:50
merlin1991	FIQ\|n900: also the source for busybox is a "busybox" source pkg	04:51
merlin1991	ah wait	04:51
* merlin1991 headdesks		04:52
merlin1991	check you .profile and stuff busybox checks a few of them	04:52
FIQ\|n900	thanks	05:02
FIQ\|n900	but I can't see apt-worker in top at all	05:03
FIQ\|n900	and repo list is still empty	05:04
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robbiethe1st	Wait... people use graphical package managers?	05:11
FIQ\|n900	solved the source issue though	05:11
robbiethe1st	I always just used apt-get etc... Faster, more responsive, and no hidden errors.	05:11
FIQ\|n900	robbiethe1st: do you have another suggestion on enabling/disabling extras-devel?	05:11
FIQ\|n900	indeed	05:11
FIQ\|n900	but if I want to manage repositories	05:11
FIQ\|n900	people in here recommend me to use HAM	05:12
FIQ\|n900	as doing it commandline apparently breaks things	05:12
robbiethe1st	Edit the maemo-whatever file in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/	05:12
FIQ\|n900	ty	05:12
robbiethe1st	And then apt-get update etc.	05:12
robbiethe1st	works great	05:12
FIQ\|n900	now i can stop use this POS	05:12
robbiethe1st	Yeah.	05:13
FIQ\|n900	huh	05:15
FIQ\|n900	hm	05:15
robbiethe1st	?	05:15
FIQ\|n900	what does "Inactivate" do from HAM exactly?	05:15
robbiethe1st	Comment it out?	05:15
FIQ\|n900	seems that the extras-devel repo simply disappeared instead of being commented out	05:15
FIQ\|n900	oh well, it's not that hard to create	05:16
robbiethe1st	yeah	05:16
robbiethe1st	To be fair, though, I'm one of those people who turns to the command like first in most cases, so I don't know if it could possibly break the graphical managers somehow; if you have trouble, though, you can always just undo it. And I've never had an issue with the command-line tools, or(that I can remember) breaking either the official package manager or FAM	05:16
FIQ\|n900	by the way, do you know anything about a broken cssu-enabler?	05:17
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robbiethe1st	No; I've not installed CSSU.	05:18
FIQ\|n900	installing it earlier today didn't succeed properly from dpkg's point of view, though it was installed	05:18
robbiethe1st	I use kernel-power, and OC and such.	05:18
FIQ\|n900	hmm ok	05:18
robbiethe1st	but no cssu	05:18
robbiethe1st	I've found that often you have to manually mess with things when dpkg gets in a snit	05:18
robbiethe1st	Like errors about some pre-remove script not working required me to edit the aforementioned file and add an 'exit 0' so dpkg installs the next version	05:19
robbiethe1st	annoying, but it's the price I pay for having full control over my phone. :P	05:20
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FIQ\|n900	MohammadAG: ping	05:23
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FIQ\|n900	there we go.. usable shell environment	05:33
FIQ\|n900	well, almost.. no dejavu sans mono until reboot	05:33
robbiethe1st	What, no Courier New?	05:36
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FIQ\|n900	courier new is a nice font in editors	05:38
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FIQ\|n900	but I don't like it for the terminal	05:38
FIQ\|n900	granted, you can use editors in terminals	05:39
FIQ\|n900	but imo, courier new is hard to read in n900 because it's thin	05:39
robbiethe1st	Eh, that's your opinion	05:51
robbiethe1st	actually	05:51
robbiethe1st	I'm using Monospace Bold 12pt myself	05:52
robbiethe1st	On 100-dpi screens, I always use courier new	05:52
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robbiethe1st	Problem is, in order to make a thin font like that work, you can't have anti-aliasing enabled. Clear, sharp pixel lines	05:53
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internetishard	lmfao!	07:12
internetishard	http://hackertyper.com/	07:12
internetishard	sdflkjjlkjsdflkjsdf	07:13
internetishard	sorry got too excited	07:13
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Hurrian	whoa, apparently someone gathered all the patches and got 3.5 to boot on the N900.	12:23
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NIN101	cool but no real practical use unfortunately.	12:28
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Hurrian	if it boots to a tty, then it's fine	12:45
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NIN101	and what practical use is this still?	12:50
NIN101	I mean, I can also boot into a tty with 2.6.28...	12:51
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grammoboy	I can't transmit my mp3 playing to the radio via the fm transmitter?	13:26
grammoboy	only internet radio?	13:26
Hurrian	grammoboy, all audio is piped to the FMTX	13:27
Hurrian	check your settings	13:27
grammoboy	Hurrian, so it is possible?	13:27
grammoboy	hmm	13:27
Hurrian	it's how it normally works	13:28
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grammoboy	can it be any frequency?	13:30
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grammoboy	or pick one which doesn't belong to a real radio station?	13:32
grammoboy	eg a uncommon freq?	13:33
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vi__	how do I stop extkb from hosing my keyboard geometry?	13:34
Hurrian	grammoboy, yeah	13:34
Hurrian	actually, that's what's recommended, because the FMTX antenna has piss poor TX power	13:35
vi__	when I disconnect my BT KB by unfriendly means my N900 KB goes bananas	13:35
vi__	Hurrian: not just that, it is of piss poor design as well.	13:35
Hurrian	vi__, a script to reload the N900's KB config?	13:35
Hurrian	no idea how to watch for that though	13:35
Hurrian	a QBW button/	13:36
vi__	ever notice that it works nicely on low freqs but sucks utter monkey nuts at high freqs?	13:36
Hurrian	vi__, antenna problems?	13:36
vi__	Hurrian: what do I have to do to reload rx-51 geometry?	13:36
Hurrian	never noticed that, freqs < 90MHz are all filled up.	13:36
vi__	setxkbmap only loads leymap.	13:37
vi__	which is no use if the n900 thinks the n900 keyboard is the same physical layout of my external kb.	13:37
Hurrian	I was going to suggest that, but didn't realize there was a diff bet geometry and layout.	13:37
vi__	kerio: ping	13:38
vi__	the joys of having an spp kb and not a hal one.	13:39
vi__	that coupled with a totally broken implementation of kbdd and bluetoothd	13:39
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vi__	kerio: ping	13:40
vi__	kerio: ping	13:40
vi__	kerio: ping	13:40
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grammoboy	Hurrian, ok it works, but only if you keep the n900 real close to the tuner	14:02
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vi__	stupid nospam junk	14:12
vi__	sonassbitch	14:13
vi__	kerio: ping	14:13
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vi__	has anyone here got a bluetooth keyboard?	14:16
vi__	can you give me some:	14:17
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vi__	cat /var/lib/bluetooth/<your mac>/profiles	14:17
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pavi_	Hi I am getting the telephony functions disabled error after using N900 for like a year ! I didnt even touch the sim , what might have happened ?	14:29
vi__	pavi_: your n900 has died.	14:33
edheldil	pavi_: happened to me a month ago. Quite possibly dead phone in the phone	14:33
vi__	pavi_: did you buy your n900 new?	14:34
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pavi_	No I dont have warranty if thats what you are asking	14:34
pavi_	so there is no solution?	14:34
vi__	depends what the issue is.	14:34
edheldil	pavi_: try to run 'pnatd' command when it disables the 'phony' functions and issue blind type 'AT'	14:35
sixwheeledbeast	hammer solution?....lol	14:35
edheldil	or AT+CFUN? (iirc)	14:35
vi__	six	14:35
vi__	sixwheeledbeast: you have a BT KB?	14:35
sixwheeledbeast	yes	14:35
pavi_	sixwheeledbeast, yeah seen the hammer solution :(	14:36
sixwheeledbeast	looks a bit scary IMO	14:36
edheldil	mine gets stuck without output after AT, phic presumably is dead phone	14:36
edheldil	s/phic/which/	14:36
infobot	edheldil meant: mine gets stuck without output after AT, which presumably is dead phone	14:36
edheldil	somebody recommended reflash, haven't tried it yet	14:37
pavi_	edheldil, what does issue blind type mean? does it ask for it ?	14:37
pavi_	I am running pnatd as root but no response	14:37
edheldil	no, run pnatd command as root from a terminal and then blind type (because it does not echo by default) AT	14:38
edheldil	and enter	14:38
edheldil	when rapuyama is working, it replies 'OK'	14:39
pavi_	ohh ok .	14:39
sixwheeledbeast	vi_: I have what's your problem?	14:40
pavi_	edheldil, tried that no response from the terminal .	14:40
edheldil	well, then see above	14:41
* pavi_ is sad to have a dead N900 :(		14:41
edheldil	for some time it helped to reboot or powercycle the phone, but now it does not work anymore	14:42
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pavi_	edheldil, same here it started with me selecting 3G ( normally its on GSM) . later only reboot helped .. guess it will become worse	14:43
edheldil	try reflash :)	14:45
vi__	sixwheeledbeast: is it an hid KB?	14:45
sixwheeledbeast	pavi_: I have had it once, months ago and it hasn't reoccured. I took it apart and blew the dust out the battery /sim tray.	14:45
vi__	or an spp kb?	14:46
sixwheeledbeast	hid me thinks	14:46
vi__	ok	14:46
vi__	when you go to bluetooth in menu, do you get the option to 'connect'	14:46
vi__	or is the button greyed out?	14:47
sixwheeledbeast	just released I haven't reinstalled extkbd or my kbd after the last reflash	14:47
vi__	have you paired the KB?	14:48
Chiku\|dc	hi which port gmail talk user on meamo?	14:48
Chiku\|dc	use*	14:48
Chiku\|dc	443?	14:48
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sixwheeledbeast	yes a while ago	14:48
vi__	Chiku\|dc: the standard one	14:49
vi__	sixwheeledbeast: then you can still check, you do not need extkb installed etc.	14:49
vi__	also, what 'profiles' does it list as supported?	14:49
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sixwheeledbeast	i do have extkdb, but it shows a hildon-banner error and borks the settings app.	14:52
sixwheeledbeast	not used since the reflash tbh	14:52
sixwheeledbeast	/opt/usr/bin/extkbd --parent 100% in top	14:53
vi__	I just want you to click on the status menu, bluetooth, devices, your KB, edit and tell me what the supported profiles are.	14:53
sixwheeledbeast	HID only	14:54
vi__	there we go	14:54
vi__	is the 'connect' button greyed out?	14:54
sixwheeledbeast	no	14:54
vi__	good	14:54
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vi__	I think I shall have to write a QBW to make a BT KB on/off toggle anyway.	14:56
vi__	I get the feeling SPP KB is 'dumb' compared to HID.	14:56
vi__	That coupled with the fact bluetoothd is totally fucking broken.	14:56
narcos	Does anyone know how a script can determine its location?	14:57
vi__	and kbdd from the repos relies on bluetoothd working means it is also totally fucking broken.	14:57
narcos	(bash script)	14:57
vi__	the location of what?	14:57
narcos	i.e. regardless of the directory I call it from, it knows where it is	14:57
vi__	pwd command	14:58
narcos	vi__: The location of itself on the filesystem	14:58
narcos	Like pwd, but working regardless of where I call the script from	14:58
vi__	not the current working directory?	14:58
vi__	uh...locate?	14:59
vi__	find?	14:59
narcos	vi__: No, the location of the script. So if the script is /foo/bar/script.sh, and I call it from /foo/ - I want the result '/foo/bar/'	14:59
narcos	vi__: That's not very efficient each time the script runs, and there may be other copies of it lying around	14:59
vi__	scripts only think in terms of current working directory.	15:00
vi__	they have no knowledge of where they live.	15:00
narcos	i've found this solution - DIR="$( cd "$( dirname "${BASH_SOURCE[0]}" )" && pwd )"	15:00
narcos	But it doesn't seem to work on BusyBox	15:00
narcos	It works on Ubuntu	15:00
vi__	probably because BB uses ASH	15:00
vi__	why cant you use bash?	15:01
narcos	Hm, I am using bash	15:01
vi__	Then it is not a problem with busybox.	15:01
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vi__	perhaps it is something to do with environmental variables.	15:03
vi__	What does your script return?	15:03
pavi_	sixwheeledbeast, edheldil vi__ I changed the SIM card with a new one , and I am yet to face the telephony issue .	15:05
vi__	pavi_: you are lucky then!	15:05
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vi__	Involuntary CMT death is permanent.	15:06
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pavi_	vi__, but it was also random ... previously .. dunno whats going to happen now	15:06
vi__	pavi_: treasure the last few months with your n900.	15:06
pavi_	vi__, :) maybe , should I be looking on ebay for N9 .. ?	15:08
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vi__	pavi_: you will also need a lobotamy.	15:10
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pavi_	vi__, edheldil The issue has now repeated with the new sim after like 30 minutes :(	15:17
edheldil	:(	15:18
edheldil	time to get a new phone	15:18
Lava_Croft	http://mbeta.slashdot.org/	15:18
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edheldil	I now use an old one I dug from the bottom of a drawer, and I am positively surprised that it goes more than a week without recharge, even on a several years old battery and bluetooth on	15:19
pavi_	ohh a reboot is not working now :(	15:20
edheldil	well, it was fast in your case :(	15:21
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edheldil	pavi_: if you try reflash, tell me whether it worked	15:29
Hurrian	vi__, fortunately, after a few years, most people would prefer to use the N900 as a UMPC, and not as a phone anymore.	15:30
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Hurrian	still sucks that the chip gets loose/breaks/whatever, but for an aging device with numerous hardware faults, it's not surprising.	15:30
pavi_	edheldil, yeah sure , thats what I am doing .. just a small hope :( after all its my most favourite device :(	15:30
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* pavi_ wishes he could afford N9 now :(		15:33
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Lava_Croft	get a used N9, like I did	15:39
edheldil	still would be too expensive for me, I am afraid	15:41
Lava_Croft	i paid 250e	15:42
Lava_Croft	which was easy after selling that wretched galaxy nexus, after 2 weeks of torture	15:42
edheldil	hmm n9 has 2 sims????	15:43
* edheldil is doubtful		15:44
Lava_Croft	n9 is not dual sim	15:48
edheldil	I thought so .. so the first one is a chinese fake as I suspected :)	15:48
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Lava_Croft	:D	15:52
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Lava_Croft	you can leave out the 'chinese' part, since wether its real or fake, its still a healthy percentage chinese! :)	15:52
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edheldil	hehe. True	15:59
edheldil	but I meant that chinese (made for China/Sold from China) have often dual sims, unlike the european' ones	16:00
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Lava_Croft	i know, just teasing	16:05
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DocScrutinizer51	damn, I LOVE this 'phone'	17:46
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DocScrutinizer51	had to swap battery since I was too silly to lock screen when putting it into pouch	17:47
kerio	which "phone"?	17:47
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DocScrutinizer51	(15 ays uptime ?-/ )	17:48
kerio	why didn't you charge it?	17:48
DocScrutinizer51	on reboot hildon-desktop acted up	17:48
DocScrutinizer51	but I got CSSU5 with my miniminifix	17:48
DocScrutinizer51	so ctrl-shift-x, killall hildon-desktop. all fine again	17:49
kerio	?	17:49
kerio	which minifix?	17:49
DocScrutinizer51	CSSU-T	17:49
kerio	and why did hildon-desktop act up?	17:49
kerio	and why did you have to swap batteries?	17:50
DocScrutinizer51	the 'don't reboot on hildon-desktop bork'	17:50
kerio	i don't have that one :c	17:50
DocScrutinizer51	because screen on for 8h	17:50
kerio	so? charge it	17:50
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DocScrutinizer51	no charger around	17:50
kerio	also my only battery survived about 4 hours of wifi monitor mode	17:51
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kerio	i noticed because the phone became warm	17:51
kerio	ok, maybe two hours and a half	17:51
DocScrutinizer51	:nod:	17:51
kerio	actually, i noticed because it fucked with my bt headphones	17:51
kerio	i had to restart bluetoothd and pulse to make them work afterwards	17:52
DocScrutinizer51	eventually I should do a test and disable wjan-scan	17:52
kerio	oh right, i don't have automatic wlan anymore	17:53
kerio	because it screws with my bt headphones	17:53
DocScrutinizer51	lol	17:53
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DocScrutinizer51	you got hidden APs configured?	17:54
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kerio	no	17:54
ShadowJK	Whenever it scans, bt drops out	17:54
kerio	yep	17:54
DocScrutinizer51	so I guess it's a problem only when WLAN active?	17:54
DocScrutinizer51	duh	17:55
ShadowJK	But automatic wlan scan seems to fix up occurences of wlan consuming tons of power if you walk out of range of ap	17:55
DocScrutinizer51	drop out means?	17:55
ShadowJK	The music skips	17:55
DocScrutinizer51	how much?	17:56
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DocScrutinizer51	I know 0.5s dropouts	17:56
ShadowJK	Like if you punched an old sony walkman cd player	17:56
ShadowJK	Yeah about that	17:56
DocScrutinizer51	:nod:	17:56
kerio	yep, it's awful	17:57
kerio	so fuck that	17:57
DocScrutinizer51	CSSU!!!!! BUG!!!	17:57
kerio	OH GOD I FORGOT TO ENABLE WLAN ON MY PHONE AND I'M LAYING DOWN	17:57
kerio	HALP	17:57
kerio	someone please come to my house and connect my n900 to the wifi	17:57
ShadowJK	I typically manually switch off wlan scan after I arrive at work (where I use bt headset/ad2p)	17:57
RST38h	ShadowJK: Too much work	17:57
DocScrutinizer51	automate it	17:58
RST38h	Why not keep it on? Does not seem to interfere with bt too much	17:58
ShadowJK	I also check gsm-only mode, and sometimes also enable irc powersave and drop screen brightness a notch	17:58
DocScrutinizer51	read backscroll!	17:58
ShadowJK	It interferes enough that entire words are lost when listening to speech	17:59
RST38h	Does not interfere here	17:59
DocScrutinizer51	bbl, job done for today :)	17:59
RST38h	Only makes a bit of a jump when itactually connects or disconnects fromap	17:59
ShadowJK	it jumps when it scans too for me	18:00
* RST38h sends the purple diarrhea beam towards Toshiba engineering team: how did they manage to make a keyboard where spacebar (!) does not work by design (!!)		18:00
RST38h	ShadowJK:Quiet and peaceful here, I wonder what the difference is	18:01
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ShadowJK	on another topic, gpodder is giving me 403 on youtube :-/	18:01
RST38h	youtube changed url format?	18:02
ShadowJK	dunno, old youtube-dl seems to still work	18:03
ShadowJK	"old" as in before time when gpodder stopped working	18:03
ShadowJK	hm, a new version in -devel :)	18:09
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ShadowJK	hm still no worky :/	18:27
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DocScrutinizer51	RST38h: other BT A2DP codec with your HS?	18:36
DocScrutinizer51	more buffer?	18:37
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DocScrutinizer51	RST38h: has it delays when you start/stop music?	18:37
freemangordon	does anyone know how to strip binutils/gcc while building cross toolchain? not using crosstool-ng ;)	18:39
DocScrutinizer51	hmm?	18:39
DocScrutinizer51	is there no strip?	18:39
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freemangordon	there is, but there are lots of binaries. And I prefer to use configure/make switch if available	18:40
DocScrutinizer51	:nod:	18:40
freemangordon	I build a new toolchain based on linaro gcc 4.7.2 2012.09, but it is huge :D	18:42
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freemangordon	*built	18:42
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kerio	freemangordon: btw, why does extkbd change /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51?	18:51
kerio	and more importantly, why does it overwrite it?	18:51
freemangordon	by design ;)	18:52
kerio	it's a stupid design	18:52
kerio	it doesn't even backup it	18:52
freemangordon	make a better one	18:52
freemangordon	wrong	18:52
freemangordon	there is a backup	18:52
kerio	i don't know why, but my own rx-51 wasn't in the backup	18:52
kerio	i had to recover it from BM	18:52
freemangordon	kerio: noone knows what shape is your device in	18:53
freemangordon	even you	18:53
kerio	yep	18:53
kerio	that's why you should ASK THE USER >:c	18:53
kerio	anyway, now i'm missing some of the symbols on the bt kbd, right?	18:53
freemangordon	kerio: extkbd install newer version of xkb-data	18:54
freemangordon	that is why rx51 is overwritten, as it is upstreamed	18:54
kerio	oh, ok	18:54
kerio	hm, why doesn't it effectively upgrade xkb-data?	18:54
kerio	like, the package	18:54
freemangordon	because of extras	18:55
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kerio	you don't have to put it in extras	18:55
kerio	ship the deb in /opt and install it	18:55
kerio	or something	18:55
kerio	i mean, right now you're shipping a tarball, it's about the same	18:55
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freemangordon	kerio: wan't to be a maintainer of extkbd?	18:56
freemangordon	*want	18:56
kerio	hm	18:56
kerio	i'd have to deal with the autobuilder	18:57
kerio	no ty ;)	18:57
kerio	hrmpf, "€" on the bt kbd doesn't work	18:57
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kerio	i wonder if there's an actual layout for this bt kbd	18:57
freemangordon	there should be	18:58
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freemangordon	you mayu want to play with layout variants	18:58
kerio	freemangordon: no "stowaway" or "igo" :(	19:01
freemangordon	hmm, that is supported iirc	19:02
kerio	yeah, most of the keys work	19:02
kerio	like, pretty much every key works	19:03
kerio	but i'm using the pc105 layout	19:03
kerio	and it's not quite a pc105	19:03
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kerio	meh, i'll live without the eur symbol and the yen symbol	19:05
freemangordon	there are several variants of pc105, check language and variant	19:06
freemangordon	i.e. play a bit with them, maybe choose UK instead of US	19:06
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kerio	are you kidding? UK is totally different	19:07
kerio	# is on a separate key, for instance	19:07
freemangordon	kerio: well, you have a plenty of keyboard variants, try them	19:08
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freemangordon	you have about 10 different layouts for USA pc105	19:08
kerio	hm, the standard pc105 is the one that appears to work best	19:09
kerio	anyway, extkbd is really neat	19:10
kerio	A+++ would kbd again	19:10
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freemangordon	kerio, which varian do you use?	19:11
kerio	pc105 usa standard	19:11
freemangordon	change to intl	19:11
freemangordon	there is no standard	19:11
kerio	all intl does is fuck up my ' and require me to type something after ~, ' and `	19:12
kerio	because it does automatic accent combination	19:12
kerio	i meant variant None	19:12
kerio	hehe, i wonder how many keys i can push at the same time	19:13
kerio	i should try MAME with this kbd	19:13
kerio	freemangordon: were there any changes to rx-51, btw?	19:14
freemangordon	iirc no	19:14
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kerio	freemangordon: ooh, neat, you do install xkb-data-extkbd	19:19
kerio	which somehow overwrites xkb-data	19:19
freemangordon	yep	19:20
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kerio	sorry for doubting you <3	19:24
kerio	can extkbd also configure usb keyboards?	19:25
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freemangordon	yes	19:25
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kerio	DocScrutinizer05: how much current can you "legally" get via usb without negotiating or checking for fastchargers?	19:26
kerio	and how much current can you pull from something that identifies as a charger?	19:26
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DocScrutinizer05	100	19:27
DocScrutinizer05	usually	19:27
DocScrutinizer05	the latter undefined	19:27
kerio	without negotiating? :o	19:27
kerio	i thought it was like 10	19:27
DocScrutinizer05	nope, 100	19:27
kerio	like, just to power the tiny circuit that negotiates	19:27
DocScrutinizer05	8 for OTG	19:27
kerio	OTG on which side?	19:28
DocScrutinizer05	on the A side obviously	19:28
kerio	i see	19:28
kerio	well, it's still silly	19:28
DocScrutinizer05	why?	19:29
kerio	well, because devices know they can ask for 100 and get it granted	19:29
DocScrutinizer05	not if session suspended	19:29
kerio	except that sometimes they don't	19:29
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kerio	meh, too weird for me :s	19:30
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DocScrutinizer05	kerio: well, you asked "without negotiation", so my answer regarding OTG was incorrect, since the session can suspend only by very special OTG negotiation, and initially I guess any OTG A device is suppoed to also deliver the 100 I quoted before	19:44
kerio	i see	19:44
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DocScrutinizer05	OTG has a whitelist and a blacklist for defining which devices can work with the 150, 200, $whatever, that the OTG A Vbus can deliver	19:46
DocScrutinizer05	We had to neuter that for h-e-n	19:46
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DocScrutinizer05	OTG is actually extremely screwed	19:46
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kerio	what do you mean which devices?	19:47
DocScrutinizer05	e.g. hubs usually don't work with OTG at all	19:47
kerio	hehe, to think that a hub is the only way you can get reliable auto-enumeration and power on the n900...	19:48
DocScrutinizer05	then there are also devices blacklisted since they pull more than they negotiate	19:48
kerio	are we talking about classes of devices?	19:49
kerio	or actual device/model pairs?	19:49
DocScrutinizer05	latter	19:49
kerio	what the fuck	19:49
kerio	in the standard itself? :s	19:49
DocScrutinizer05	per model+driver	19:49
DocScrutinizer05	I think the list is nowhere standarized, it's per manuf/model	19:50
kerio	that's even worse!	19:51
kerio	:S	19:51
kerio	why do you keep telling me these things?	19:51
kerio	and why do i keep asking?	19:51
DocScrutinizer05	musb_hdrc: USB Host mode controller at ffc03800 using PIO, IRQ 59 >http://blackfin.uclinux.org/gf/project/uclinux-dist/forum/?_forum_action=ForumMessageBrowse&thread_id=38739&action=ForumBrowse	19:52
DocScrutinizer05	err	19:52
DocScrutinizer05	musb_hdrc: kernel must blacklist external hubs	19:52
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DocScrutinizer05	https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/ggit/browse.php/?p=h-e-n;a=commit;h=0a5777e676acb4eff0c02762edc5dcde98482702	19:54
DocScrutinizer05	>> Patch with which i had a limited success (my device was rejected during enumeration because i didn't have the whitelist disabled, but the VID/PID was properly read).<<	19:55
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kerio	freemangordon: the enter key doesn't repeat itself	20:06
kerio	how can i see if it's a problem of the keyboard?	20:06
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kerio	heh, this kbd is silly	20:09
kerio	shift+up is mapped to ?	20:09
kerio	so i can't select going up	20:09
kerio	only going down	20:09
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pavi	My telephony error wasnt fixed by flashing	20:42
pavi	but by keeping a paper cusion between battery :O	20:43
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SpeedEvil	that may well only be a very temporary fix	20:45
kerio	to be fair it shows that the SIM has a flaky connection	20:45
SpeedEvil	no, it doesn't	20:47
SpeedEvil	it shows that something does.	20:47
kerio	k	20:48
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DocScrutinizer05	which usually is NOT the sim	20:59
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kerio	reflow all the solderings! _ò/	21:00
* DocScrutinizer05 idly wonders if 'SIM' error might get caused by pressing kbd too hard, thus breaking solder points under BGA chips by bending PCB		21:00
DocScrutinizer05	seems pressing hard on "TYO" keys should kill GAIA instantly	21:04
DocScrutinizer05	while "A" kills eMMC	21:04
DocScrutinizer05	modem chips OTOH are not on backside of any kbd key	21:06
DocScrutinizer05	"U" and "; <up>" are opposite side of SIM-holder solder points	21:09
ShadowJK	hjk was most effective for reproducing crossed-out-sim	21:09
DocScrutinizer05	"J" is actually opposite side of SIM colder points	21:10
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DocScrutinizer05	almost	21:11
DocScrutinizer05	"U" is	21:11
ShadowJK	on the last csualty it doesnt matter, because it's always deadmodem, and simless emergency call doesnt work either	21:11
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kerio	~seen pali	22:00
infobot	pali <~pali@unaffiliated/pali> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo-ssu, 1d 2h 27m 50s ago, saying: 'DocScrutinizer51, see ^^^'.	22:00
kerio	zomg	22:00
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kerio	deepy: how's it going?	22:03
deepy	I keep forgetting to bring it to work	22:04
kerio	D:	22:06
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vi__	how do I stop extkb from hosing my KB geometry?	22:39
freemangordon	vi__: what is wrong with it?	22:39
freemangordon	BTW which KBD? external or internal	22:40
vi__	external BTKB	22:42
vi__	BT KB	22:42
freemangordon	and what is incorrect?	22:42
vi__	using SPP profile instead of hid.	22:42
freemangordon	aaah	22:42
vi__	aaah?	22:42
freemangordon	not supported by extkbd (iirc)	22:43
freemangordon	and you should disable hid BT plugin	22:43
vi__	It kind of worls.	22:43
vi__	It kind of worKs.	22:43
freemangordon	or even better -remove extkbd	22:43
freemangordon	kind of?	22:43
vi__	you can set a shortcut to change keymaps	22:43
freemangordon	but?	22:44
vi__	it works on the external kb	22:44
infobot	kerio: don't highlight my master!	22:45
kerio	infobot: k	22:45
infobot	k is probably okay	22:45
kerio	vi__: ohai	22:45
kerio	vi__: extkbd hoses your /usr/share/X11/xkb/	22:45
kerio	and installs the new upstream version	22:45
kerio	so you have to restore any modification you made to rx-51	22:46
vi__	sorry, I was just connecting the KB.	22:46
kerio	i think kbdd can be configured to use a different layout, can't it?	22:46
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vi__	kerio: I found this out.	22:46
kerio	and SPP KBDs suck lol	22:46
vi__	they certainly do	22:46
vi__	Is there someway I can add my rx-51 to extkb?	22:46
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freemangordon	well, remove extkbd and xkb-data-exkbd (that will restore your xkb data)	22:47
kerio	if you have the backup still there	22:47
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* DocScrutinizer51 beats kerio with a pali doll		22:47
kerio	otherwise, LOL	22:47
kerio	DocScrutinizer51: wtf do you want	22:47
vi__	sometimes when I non-gracefully disconnect my keyboard (go out of range, cut the power etc) my n900 KB becomes completely fucked.	22:47
kerio	also i want my pali	22:47
freemangordon	copy your rx51 to a safe place, install extkbd and copy rx51 back	22:48
freemangordon	vi__: i am not sure it is extkbd to blame	22:48
vi__	After learning the hardway I have several backups of rx-51.	22:48
freemangordon	actually it is just an UI which sets some HAL script and assigns xkb layout to your external keyboard there	22:48
freemangordon	the one that does the real job is hal/X	22:49
freemangordon	using xkb-data	22:49
vi__	freemangordon: can it completely fuck up the n900 kb geometry at all?	22:49
freemangordon	don;t think so	22:49
vi__	to the point where the n900 keyboard is just spamming agrbage and needs rebooted to fix it?	22:50
freemangordon	where did you get kbdd?	22:50
freemangordon	from	22:50
vi__	it is in the repos.	22:50
vi__	it is totally broken.	22:50
vi__	the kbdd binary works though	22:51
freemangordon	vi__: are you sure you don't have some bt-hid-scripts installed?	22:51
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vi__	...I dont think so.	22:51
vi__	only extkb	22:51
vi__	one thing that pisses me off is bluetoothd	22:52
freemangordon	vi__: NFC, but as I told you, all the job is done in a pretty standard way, extkbd is an updated (and full) xkb-data+UI	22:52
esaym153	what is a good music player for n810?	22:53
vi__	if you switch bt off then on again, it does not re-bind as per rfcomm.conf.	22:53
freemangordon	xkb-data comes from...lemme think,, maybe debian lenny	22:53
esaym153	the default one is kind of quirky	22:53
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vi__	esaym153: mplayer!	22:53
kerio	is there a way to make the haptic feedback stronger?	22:53
esaym153	vi__: well I want one that can show my whole library	22:53
vi__	kerio: replacec vibe motor with a solenoid.	22:54
kerio	LOL	22:54
kerio	no	22:54
freemangordon	vi__: it was too long ago, i can;t recall all of the details	22:54
vi__	freemangordon: thats ok.	22:54
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freemangordon	but in general SPP keyboards are never meant to be supported by extkbd	22:55
freemangordon	only HID	22:55
vi__	freemangordon: what is brewing in the thumb branch?	22:55
freemangordon	I even wonder how you are able to setup a layout via extkbd UI	22:55
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freemangordon	vi__: pulseaudio, gstreamer and... te fuck	22:56
freemangordon	kerio: what was the third one?	22:56
vi__	freemangordon: once the kb is attached i doubt it matters if it is hid or spp.	22:56
freemangordon	vi__: it matters, as UI enumerates HD devices	22:56
kerio	freemangordon: idk, tracker?	22:56
freemangordon	aah, yes	22:56
freemangordon	vi__: HID devices even	22:56
vi__	freemangordon: maybe show open media player some thumb lovin'?	22:57
freemangordon	vi__: well, toolchain and setup procedure are on the wiki	22:57
vi__	heh	22:57
vi__	My n900 is my only pc right now.	22:57
freemangordon	and it will be much better to use my time on mafw than on the UI ;)	22:58
vi__	my laptop bit the dust.	22:58
vi__	freemangordon: tru	22:58
* freemangordon is afk for a cigarette		22:58
vi__	kerio, hurry up and set up the toolchain so you can compile trivial stuff for amusement.	22:59
kerio	no u	22:59
vi__	no u	22:59
kerio	anyway, i made the haptic feedback stronger	22:59
kerio	and LOL, it's really stronger	22:59
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vi__	solenoid/?	22:59
kerio	no, /etc/mce/mce.ini	22:59
vi__	?	23:00
vi__	what did you change?	23:00
kerio	PatternTouchscreen	23:00
vi__	of course	23:00
kerio	instead of 23 accel, 0 on, 15 decel, i made it 0 accel, 40 on, 0 decel	23:00
vi__	bzz	23:00
vi__	bzzzzz	23:00
kerio	yep	23:00
vi__	bz	23:00
vi__	pointless waste of battery.	23:01
vi__	have you managed to tame xterm yet?	23:01
vi__	i.e. change font size?	23:02
kerio	to make it 80x24? n	23:02
kerio	no	23:02
vi__	also how the f does hostmode work now?	23:02
vi__	do I STILL HAVE TO USE H>E>N>?	23:03
DocScrutinizer05	WTF IS WRONG WITH H>E>N?	23:03
* Sicelo still uses it.. the new stuff doesn't work so well for me		23:04
vi__	nothing is wrong with it, i am just aware a bunch of sruff was changed.	23:04
kerio	yeah, h-e-n is still somewhat advised	23:04
vi__	so just use hen like before, dont worry about evertything	23:05
kerio	KP52 should work better	23:05
kerio	(not released yet)	23:05
DocScrutinizer05	I'd maybe worry about KP51nnn	23:05
kerio	DocScrutinizer05: how big of a battery drain is the vibrator?	23:07
DocScrutinizer05	considerably	23:07
kerio	D:	23:07
kerio	so should i disable the haptic feedback?	23:07
DocScrutinizer05	only on DutyCycle=100	23:07
DocScrutinizer05	nah	23:07
kerio	i made it a bit stronger, but shorter now	23:07
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DocScrutinizer05	negligible anyway	23:08
DocScrutinizer05	as long as you don't do echo 255 >/sys///*/LED/vibrator	23:08
DocScrutinizer05	rather echo 255 >/sys///*/LED/vibrator/brightness	23:09
DocScrutinizer05	(SIC!)	23:09
kerio	k	23:09
vi__	sa	23:10
vi__	I have just attached an external mouse	23:11
vi__	MIND	23:11
vi__	BLOWN	23:11
vi__	I can click on stuff.	23:11
freemangordon	hehe	23:11
kerio	:O	23:11
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freemangordon	vi__: trow away that SPP keyboard and find some HID, it will make all the difference	23:12
vi__	there were legends of villages in the next valley who had the power of ctrl+right click. THE STORIES ARE REAL.	23:12
DocScrutinizer05	/sys/class/leds/twl4030:vibrator/brightness	23:12
kerio	what does ctrl+right click do?	23:12
kerio	DocScrutinizer05: you suck!	23:12
vi__	it lets you access the font menu in xterm.	23:13
vi__	...	23:13
kerio	anyway, i like this stronger-but-shorter pattern	23:13
freemangordon	btw I am using apple alluminium (short version) works like charm	23:13
kerio	vi__: oh, the actual xterm	23:13
kerio	i see	23:13
vi__	it still does nothing.	23:13
kerio	freemangordon: i'm using a STOWAWAY	23:13
vi__	freemangordon: it was free...	23:13
kerio	it is the shit	23:13
vi__	...and i am cheap.	23:13
kerio	it folds in half	23:13
kerio	and has a stand for the phone	23:13
vi__	so does this one, bitch.	23:14
freemangordon	hmm, don;t you have TV sets around?	23:14
vi__	it even has a bluue function key, THAT BEHVES LIKE THE BLUE KEY ON THE N900 KEYBOARD!!1!	23:15
vi__	...i have no tv.	23:15
* DocScrutinizer05 throws while true; do echo 255 >/sys/class/leds/twl4030:vibrator/brightness; sleep 2; echo 50 >/sys/class/leds/twl4030:vibrator/brightness; sleep 1; done at kerio		23:15
kerio	vi__: why the hell would i want a key to act like the blue key on the n900 keyboard	23:15
kerio	DocScrutinizer05: i don't need an actual vibrator, dude	23:16
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kerio	besides, the n900 isn't exactly ergonomic	23:16
vi__	kerio: dude, it doesnt go in ur ass.	23:16
freemangordon	kerio: compared to n950 it is	23:16
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kerio	vi__: right, it's a "massager"	23:16
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vi__	brb, clicking on stuff	23:18
kerio	haha	23:19
DocScrutinizer05	kerio: anyway ~120mA at 100%	23:19
DocScrutinizer05	off battery	23:20
DocScrutinizer05	@3923mV	23:20
vi__	that is as powerfull as a shit led flashlight.	23:20
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kerio	except that it provides sexual pleasure instead of light	23:20
DocScrutinizer05	and as negligible as the indicator light flashing	23:21
kerio	freemangordon: i'm not getting anything in Settings after installing extmou	23:21
DocScrutinizer05	~power	23:21
infobot	power is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Power_Consumption	23:21
DocScrutinizer05	wtf? this looks like a digest	23:22
DocScrutinizer05	hmm, never been longer than today	23:23
vi__	kerio: there is nothing to show	23:23
DocScrutinizer05	4,462 bytes	23:23
kerio	vi__: but then how will i configure mouse sensitivity? D:	23:23
freemangordon	kerio: and what do you want to set up?	23:23
freemangordon	no way	23:23
kerio	freemangordon: ^	23:23
kerio	ya way	23:23
kerio	gotta set up my mouse correctly if i want to own noobs in quake	23:24
DocScrutinizer05	and MEH, vibrator already been there	23:24
kerio	or something	23:24
freemangordon	kerio: well, edit hal script	23:24
* kerio will most definetely not own noobs in quake from his n900		23:24
kerio	because quake 3 is ballzy hard	23:24
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DocScrutinizer05	anyway, it's "always" been there: Idle, no SIM, wlan off 7 mA@4.1 V T // Wifi on with maximum powersaving. +~2 mA // = 9mA idling on internet via WLAN. Makes for 140h standby	23:29
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DocScrutinizer05	anyway, it's "always" been there: Idle, no SIM, wlan off 7 mA@4.1 V T // 2G connected, good signal, no data or other activity +5 mA // do your math	23:31
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DocScrutinizer05	council: will nomination period be extended now, and council election postponed?	23:38
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DocScrutinizer05	or will we all get eaten by the galactic goat?	23:39
DocScrutinizer05	(in the latter case, let me run to desinfect my phone handset before that happens)	23:42
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vi__	did anyone manage to get one of those usb vga cables to work?	23:58
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