| SpeedEvil | I suspect you may have trouble getting below ~30mA doing that. | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| SpeedEvil | But that's still ~30h or so. | 00:00 |
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| qwazix_ | actually the backlight is not a problem, uses very little power in lowest setting | 00:01 |
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| SpeedEvil | The top backlight setting should be avoided. | 00:01 |
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| SpeedEvil | But even a quarter on isn't a noticable power draw | 00:02 |
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| Juozapas | hi n900 doesnt work with my local dns. I few topics about it but no real solution.. can u help me? | 00:03 |
| SpeedEvil | How have you set the local DNS? | 00:03 |
| Juozapas | yep | 00:03 |
| qwazix_ | how costly is it to poll the accelerometer? | 00:03 |
| Juozapas | its in /var/run/resolv... | 00:03 |
| qwazix_ | I'm thinking to have the screen show the time for a few seconds when the device is moved, and the proximity sensor is not covered | 00:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | qwazix: It actually has an interrupt mode. | 00:05 |
| SpeedEvil | qwazix: you can set thresholds at which it will interrupt - in hardware - and then go to sleep | 00:05 |
| qwazix_ | that's cool, I'll check it out -- or I'll check out fcam-examples for the N9 | 00:06 |
| qwazix_ | don't know yet | 00:06 |
| Juozapas | SpeedEvil: dns works for all my other computers.. this problem exist only on n900 | 00:07 |
| SpeedEvil | qwazix: Unfortunately, the software stack does not support this. | 00:09 |
| SpeedEvil | Juozapas: how are you setting the DNS? | 00:09 |
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| qwazix_ | SpeedEvil, this? meaning the interrupts you mentioned earlier? | 00:13 |
| SpeedEvil | qwazix: yes | 00:14 |
| Juozapas | SpeedEvil: it gets it by dhcp | 00:14 |
| SpeedEvil | http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_accelerometer | 00:17 |
| SpeedEvil | afk | 00:17 |
| Sicelo | Juozapas: local dns .. so what is it N900 can't resolve? is it hosts on your network, or everything, including Internet? | 00:18 |
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| Juozapas | Sicelo: n900 resolvs it (at least it's in resolv.conf.wlan) but nslookup some-local-hostname doesnt work | 00:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, I think I saw that in the press release. | 00:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: :-D | 00:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | there's been any press release? | 00:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer, yes, let me find it. | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | No website sucks. | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://nokiainnovation.com/2012/07/first-official-jolla-press-release/ | 00:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | twitter sucks | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | DocScrutinizer05, ah "revealed this year". | 00:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | My reading comprehension needs help. | 00:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yay, better! I already thought they are beyond the stage where hw bugs could get fixed | 00:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wouldn't like to see another hostmode desaster | 00:42 |
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| Sicelo | Juozapas: can the N900 evn reach the dns server? | 00:48 |
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| * SpeedEvil wonders where the Jolla fundin is coming from. | 00:49 | |
| Sicelo | good question SpeedEvil :\ | 00:49 |
| SpeedEvil | ^g | 00:50 |
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| Juozapas | Sicelo: yes, at least i can ping to it | 01:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Anybody got an executive summary of the PR1.3 update improvements? | 01:28 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | well, we'll not get to know who's the venture capital behind jolla. I already asked and appreciated the answer there actually ARE sponsors anyway | 01:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: err, ECHAN? | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, probably | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | But this one is closer to where my eyes happen to be looking right now | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | and I'm tired. | 01:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hehe | 01:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | so let me answer: as far as I know there's jusr a community supported listing, and a fuzzy statement about "1000 fixes" | 01:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | rather "1000 improvements" | 01:32 |
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| RST38h | Objective-C Overtakes C++ | 01:43 |
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| qwazix_ | GeneralAntilles, none, they just bumped the version strings | 01:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Magic! | 01:53 |
| qwazix_ | No seriously, I had spotted 4 serious bugs of which 3 were not fixed and the other one I'm not sure yes as it's not always reproducible | 01:54 |
| qwazix_ | s/No/Now | 01:54 |
| RiD | you can cry | 01:55 |
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| * qwazix_ cries | 01:56 | |
| RiD | see, don't you feel more relaxed as now you released all your angers and issues into tears? | 01:57 |
| RiD | it won't fix anything anyways, HA | 01:57 |
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| * qwazix_ changed status to bug 3485 (user cries) to WONTFIX | 01:58 | |
| povbot_ | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/3485 Downloads' "updated" date not updating | 01:58 |
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| qwazix_ | lol | 01:58 |
| qwazix_ | everybody have a good night (ugt) | 02:01 |
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| RST38h | Meanwhile: Internet Explorer Market Share Drops To Almost 15% | 03:38 |
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| Ken-Young | Gosh - I hadn't heard it had dropped anywhere near that low. | 03:45 |
| RiD | just get rid of IE already | 03:45 |
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| LaoLang_cool | Can I rearrange the contacts by company name? | 03:46 |
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| iluminator105 | i guess my question got answered | 04:09 |
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| Pali | new u-boot version 2012.04-2 which can generate omap atag, see: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 | 11:27 |
| vi__ | ...excellant. | 11:32 |
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| vi__ | freemangordon: ping | 11:35 |
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| freemangordon | vi__:pong | 12:21 |
| RiD | goofy´ | 12:22 |
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| vi__ | email? | 12:27 |
| vi__ | also what is this microb engine thumb2 you have compiled? | 12:28 |
| vi__ | Is that browserd? | 12:28 |
| RiD | http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/278/550/82f.jpg | 12:29 |
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| _freemangordon | damn, stupid inet | 12:30 |
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| _freemangordon | [12:25] <freemangordon> vi__: no | 12:30 |
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| Hurrian | Pali, just built it with GCC 4.7 under e-d, and it is nice. | 12:44 |
| Hurrian | one question, why is kernel name for first entry static "2.6.28-omap1"? | 12:45 |
| Hurrian | I think it should read attached kernel's name, as appended in uImage | 12:45 |
| Pali | Hurrian, for compiling u-boot I'm using arm-linux-gnueabi-gcc (Ubuntu/Linaro 4.6.3-1ubuntu5) | 12:46 |
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| Pali | default first entry is attached kernel image to u-boot which is default pr13 | 12:47 |
| vi__ | freemangordon: You mentioned on the forum you have compiled microb engine with thumb2. | 12:47 |
| freemangordon | yep | 12:47 |
| vi__ | I assume you mean browserd? | 12:47 |
| freemangordon | no, microb-engine | 12:47 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm trying to recover a SIP password from the device - http://forums.internettablettalk.com/showthread.php?t=82855 refers to a tool called mc-tool - this is not on my device - and apt-get doesn't work | 12:47 |
| vi__ | oh, I thought they were one and the same. | 12:47 |
| freemangordon | vi__: browsed itself is some 100k, but it loads libxul.so, that is a part of microb-engine | 12:48 |
| vi__ | I thought browserd was the rendering engine and messaging, microb etc were the clients, as it were. | 12:48 |
| freemangordon | so in that regard they are one and the same | 12:48 |
| SpeedEvil | ah - nvm | 12:49 |
| SpeedEvil | apt-get install libmissioncontrol-utils | 12:49 |
| freemangordon | the real browser is microb-engine | 12:49 |
| freemangordon | vi__: you can check /usr/lib/microb-engine | 12:49 |
| vi__ | ty | 12:50 |
| vi__ | also, how does camera-ui2 work? Where is the binary? | 12:50 |
| freemangordon | browserd is just a user of libgtkmozembed, which wraps libxul | 12:50 |
| freemangordon | "/usr/bin" | 12:50 |
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| vi__ | so camera-ui IS in fact camera-ui2? | 12:51 |
| freemangordon | yep | 12:51 |
| vi__ | ah hah! | 12:51 |
| freemangordon | (assuming you have CSSU-testing or CSSU-thumb installed :P) | 12:52 |
| vi__ | ofc! | 12:52 |
| vi__ | I roll with all the wacky testing shit! | 12:52 |
| freemangordon | man, you're brave :D | 12:53 |
| vi__ | Well I find in general I have the linuxz skillz to troubleshoot my own system. | 12:53 |
| vi__ | mostly... | 12:54 |
| * freemangordon is going afk | 12:54 | |
| freemangordon | bbl, bye | 12:54 |
| vi__ | ~bbl | 12:54 |
| infobot | hmm... bbl is be back later | 12:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | SpeedEvil: nice | 12:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | SpeedEvil: I just wonder wtf it stores the password | 12:55 |
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| Hurrian | freemangordon, all the wacky testing shit is stable enough for me ;) | 12:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | SpeedEvil: btw your URL is another instance of evidence that this DNS setup is evil - how comes even in 2012 we still refer to http://forums.internettablettalk.com/ rather than tmo | 12:57 |
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| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05, pretty soon iirc we're going to have to refer to ITT again | 12:58 |
| Hurrian | that's if the maemo.org domain isn't transfered | 12:58 |
| vi__ | did anyone else notice nokia suite is a colossal pile of shit? | 13:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Hurrian: I still fail to see why anything regarding tmo should change | 13:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: ORLY? ;-P | 13:03 |
| Hurrian | money, etc. | 13:03 |
| Hurrian | vi__, no shit? | 13:03 |
| Hurrian | it's pretty basic and non-power-user and BUGGY with the custom skinning | 13:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | what's wrong with money? | 13:04 |
| vi__ | It has no logs. | 13:04 |
| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05: a shortage in the near future, the way M.O's running | 13:04 |
| Pali | IPv6 support thread: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85357 | 13:04 |
| Pali | with ICD2 ipv6 plugin | 13:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I don't mind whether council collects funding for Reggie/tmo or for any new server somebody hires somewhere | 13:04 |
| vi__ | easy, auction 5 N950s. | 13:04 |
| vi__ | prune the shite. | 13:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | actually I'd prefer to pay Reggie for his expense to run tmo the way it is, to migrating everything to new location and infra | 13:05 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | and for domain I'd hope Nokia either keeps it and keeps it functional, or will free it so e.g. council can grab the domain for like 10$/year | 13:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | Things I hate #494 - Configuration dialogs with noncanonical names for fields. | 13:08 |
| SpeedEvil | SIP has been especial fun for this. | 13:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I haven't heard sound reasoning why anything regarding talk.maemo.org must change | 13:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | except who's paying | 13:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | SpeedEvil: wait til you eneter something to "display name" - you never again delete that | 13:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | only way to recover: delete whole account and redo from scratch | 13:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nice bug | 13:10 |
| SpeedEvil | This is basically to use my free SIP connection from my ISP, and to drop to 'low user' on my phone. | 13:10 |
| SpeedEvil | Which saves some pounds a year. | 13:11 |
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| * DocScrutinizer05 idly wonders how lazy one can get, hasn't ever opened a ticket against that "SIP configuration dialog: can't delete content of 'display name' field" | 13:13 | |
| Pali | kernel-power v51 for testing: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1234313&postcount=445 | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: \o/ | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: is this already with switchable thumb workaround? | 13:14 |
| Pali | yes | 13:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | cooool | 13:14 |
| Pali | thumb is from cssu-kernel | 13:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | default? | 13:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on or off? | 13:14 |
| Pali | default should be on | 13:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep, I think so too | 13:16 |
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| Pali | there was no problem in cssu-kernel | 13:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | otherwise you might face problems with booting a massively thumbified system | 13:16 |
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| Hurrian | oh wow, that's nice. time to reuse builder.py again, it seems | 13:19 |
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| vi__ | wait, is kp51 compatable with thumb2 binaries? | 13:34 |
| vi__ | And does this new bq2415x module finally allow us to eliminate bme for charging? | 13:35 |
| SpeedEvil | BME does more than charging. | 13:36 |
| SpeedEvil | It also has various interfaces tot he rest of the stack that tell it about battery state | 13:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you'll also nee hald-addon-bme to use that bq2415x module | 13:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | need* | 13:37 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm sure the product brief had somewhere in it 'make the OS dependant on an interrelated tightly coupled mesh of binaries, talking over undefined interfaces, for muddy reasons'. | 13:37 |
| vi__ | So I still cannot get away without bme? | 13:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | until then you're no way better regarding substitution of bme than you were with charge21.sh | 13:38 |
| vi__ | -_- | 13:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | charging will work but system has no clue about battery state etc | 13:39 |
| vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: that is irrelevant to me. | 13:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, then you could've get rid of bme since.... 2 years already | 13:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | since charging worked since very first POC for bq24150 charging mode of ShadowJK&me | 13:41 |
| vi__ | what I want is charging when I plug in the charger and NO bme. | 13:41 |
| vi__ | System knowing battery level is irrelevant. | 13:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's exactly what charge21.sh does since 2 years | 13:41 |
| vi__ | But it runs relentlessly in the background chewing up CPU cycles. | 13:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ShadowJK never used bme since as long | 13:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | pfff, guess what bme does! | 13:42 |
| vi__ | thats why I want rid of BME! | 13:43 |
| vi__ | I want somthing that does not spam the I2C bus like a douche. | 13:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, desolder the bq24150 then, replace it by a linear regulator | 13:43 |
| freemangordon | vi__: found someone with some C skills to complete my FOSS replacement | 13:44 |
| freemangordon | *find | 13:44 |
| * freemangordon is afk again | 13:45 | |
| SpeedEvil | vi__: it's really not a big issue. | 13:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: during charging the bq24150 *needs* service every ~10s | 13:45 |
| SpeedEvil | vi__: the power usage is almost zero on discharge. | 13:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that's utterly lightweight | 13:45 |
| SpeedEvil | vi__: I'd guesstimate at perhaps an extra half milliamp. | 13:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: during unplugged from charger you need to listen to sysfs node signalling vbus = 1 | 13:46 |
| SpeedEvil | Perhaps 10% more standby battery life - approaching 7 days not 6 in the ideal case. | 13:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: you *might* find a way so kernel signals this state change and thus your script/process may sleep all the time | 13:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: ...or you simply accept that checking sys/*/*/*/vbus every 10 or 30s is not a big deal even when done in a while sleep 30; do... loop | 13:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | regrarding this particular detail the bq2415x.ko might actually be better than charge21.sh | 13:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | since it's already kernel, so might easily get to know about state changes in vbus | 13:49 |
| kerio | what's this charger thing? | 13:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: you don't wanna know ;-D | 13:52 |
| kerio | ...no | 13:53 |
| kerio | i want to know | 13:53 |
| kerio | that's why i asked, "what's this charger thing?" | 13:53 |
| kerio | anything that removes the need for BME is good | 13:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which it evidently fails to accomplish yet | 13:53 |
| kerio | (also, how do you completely remove bme without tripping the watchdog?) | 13:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ??? | 13:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | stop bme | 13:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or what do you mean by "completely remove"? | 13:54 |
| kerio | won't the watchdog freak out if there's no running bme? | 13:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 13:55 |
| kerio | ...what does watchdog even do? | 13:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as bme or initctl/upstart tells watchdog to no longer monitor bme, when you run "stop bme" | 13:56 |
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| kerio | oic | 13:57 |
| kerio | what happens if you don't run watchdog? | 13:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | nothing | 13:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | modulo I don't really know what you mean by "don't run watchdog" | 13:59 |
| vi__ | kerio: lol, wtf r u on abut? | 13:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: usual | 14:00 |
| vi__ | watchdog is an utube app. It is for making tweets on ur facebook pag. | 14:00 |
| kerio | vi__: idk, my bff jill | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | stop that, gives me nausea | 14:00 |
| kerio | hm, does backupmenu run bme? | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 14:00 |
| kerio | i mean, can you use it to charge the battery? | 14:00 |
| kerio | aww :( | 14:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it runs charge21.sh | 14:00 |
| vi__ | kerio: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watchdog_timer | 14:01 |
| kerio | oh so you can, neat | 14:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | so yes, it charges battery ;-) | 14:01 |
| kerio | does charge21.sh do the same things bme does? | 14:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 14:01 |
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| vi__ | kerio: however the prefered maemo term is 'tickling' the watchdog. | 14:01 |
| kerio | i thought bme also reported shit to the kernel wrt charge status and stuff like that | 14:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it doesn't talk to hald-addon-bme | 14:01 |
| kerio | vi__: it makes it sound much cuter than it is | 14:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see above | 14:02 |
| kerio | i see | 14:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | a DOG? I prefer the term "kick the watchdog" | 14:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ;-P | 14:04 |
| kerio | that makes it sound much more violent than it is | 14:04 |
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| vi__ | kerio: no | 14:06 |
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| kerio | ced117[-]: FYI, your hostname cloak didn't work properly - you joined channels before the cloak was applied | 14:06 |
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| kerio | if the purpose of the cloak is to hide your IP, you should fix it | 14:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hehe, quite usual | 14:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | use server password auth | 14:08 |
| kerio | indeed | 14:08 |
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| MrPingu | How to migrate from kernel-cssu2 to kp51 in a clean way? | 14:15 |
| MrPingu | I mean normally I would use the remove kp in launcher then apt-get remove the kernel packages | 14:16 |
| Pali | MrPingu, if you are using u-boot with bootmenu just install -bootimg package | 14:16 |
| vi__ | MrPingu: You mean kp51-so fucking hot it is not even in a repo-alpha-0.001? | 14:16 |
| MrPingu | Nah I don't use uboot ;) | 14:17 |
| vi__ | Pali: Does kp51 have FMG thumb patches? | 14:17 |
| MrPingu | yes it has ;) | 14:17 |
| kerio | MrPingu: i think you have to wait for freemangordon, because kernel-cssu is pulled in by some deps | 14:18 |
| kerio | at least, i think it is | 14:18 |
| vi__ | So, in short, if you have installed a bunch of thumb binaries, they should work with kp51. | 14:18 |
| MrPingu | Vi__, I guess that's why I wanted to migrate to kp ;) | 14:19 |
| MrPingu | Anyway, removing kernel-cssu2 first and then to kp51 didn't seem very well because of thumb :P | 14:20 |
| MrPingu | That's why I asked here, just to be sure ;) | 14:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | removing a kernel seems a silly idea anyway | 14:20 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: you don't remove a kernel, you remove its installer | 14:21 |
| kerio | but yeah, modules should stay until you booted the new kernel | 14:21 |
| kerio | MrPingu: it's not like you uninstall kernel-cssu2 and you're suddenly without a kernel | 14:21 |
| Hurrian | PSA: cssu-thumb depends on kernel-cssu in apt | 14:21 |
| kerio | that's silly :c | 14:21 |
| Hurrian | anyone mind making a dummy kernel-cssu-modules and kernel-cssu-flasher package? | 14:22 |
| kerio | Hurrian: are you sure it depends on kernel-cssu? | 14:22 |
| Hurrian | trying to remove it removes fremantle-pr | 14:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: just because we had no kernel-feature-errata-430973-workaround | 14:22 |
| kerio | and not on kernel-feature-errdammit DocScrutinizer | 14:22 |
| Hurrian | hmm, it should probably depend on kernel-feature-errate-omgtimessedupbigtime | 14:22 |
| kerio | how does apt choose a package depending on Provides metapackages? | 14:23 |
| kerio | no, how are they called? | 14:23 |
| MrPingu | I guess it will be better if we wait for SSU-thumb update from FMG and then migrate to kp51 :) (atleast for me) | 14:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | somebody recently mentioned in here he's always editing the dependency-database of apt manually ;-D | 14:24 |
| Hurrian | MrPingu, kp51's running nice here for me | 14:24 |
| MrPingu | Hmm I guess i want to learn to use u-boot | 14:25 |
| kerio | is NOLO open? | 14:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | of course if you simply rm kernel-thumb and force KP51 to install, apt will think kernel-cssu feature still satisfied | 14:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: no | 14:26 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: oh, so it depends on the errata feature, not the actual package at least - phew | 14:26 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: why the fuck not? :( | 14:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nfc :-( | 14:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | probably because there's some gfx init stuff in there that's not free | 14:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | or maybe it's for same reason as flasher-3.5 also being a blob | 14:28 |
| vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: becasue no one can be assed going through the legal hoops to open it. | 14:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | whatever that reason might be then | 14:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: probably | 14:28 |
| MrPingu | I am a bit confused,: how to install u-boot (with bootmenu safely) | 14:28 |
| vi__ | As I have said. Nokia, just dump the source on megaupload (or whatever) anonomously and we will take it from there. | 14:29 |
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| MrPingu | There's a thread on TMO from Pali, and there's a version in the repositories | 14:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 14:29 |
| chem|st | DocScrutinizer05: http://www.rebuy.de/i,1845826/handy/nokia-n900-black | 14:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | chem|st: thanks | 14:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but used and a tad too expensive | 14:30 |
| Hurrian | MrPingu, Pali's one in post is newer | 14:30 |
| Hurrian | I'm running it right now, and it works just fine. | 14:30 |
| MrPingu | I see :) | 14:30 |
| FallenWarlock | vi__: megaupload?! | 14:30 |
| chem|st | DocScrutinizer05: 18month warranty | 14:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 14:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | whatever that means | 14:31 |
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| Hurrian | If you have kp51, I can send you a combined.bin ready to flash via softupd --local && flasher -f -k combined.bin --local | 14:31 |
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| FallenWarlock | DocScrutinizer05: afaik megaupload doesn't exist anymore | 14:31 |
| kerio | wtf is softupd? | 14:31 |
| MrPingu | I am also reading here that pali's uboot will overwrite my kernel in NAND, so I need to have kp51 bootimage first, right? | 14:31 |
| FallenWarlock | (whops wrong person) | 14:32 |
| Hurrian | MrPingu, not really | 14:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nah, ok | 14:32 |
| vi__ | FallenWarlock: megaupload==<any number of advert ridden, piracy infested crap sites> | 14:32 |
| Hurrian | if your /home is ext3 it's fine | 14:32 |
| Hurrian | if not, it'll be slightly annoying to select new kernel on boot | 14:32 |
| Pali | kerio, softupd is nokia proprierary daemon for flashing nand on n900 | 14:32 |
| Pali | it also flash emmc image | 14:32 |
| kerio | wait, *on* the n900? | 14:32 |
| Pali | MrPingu, install u-boot and then -bootimg kernel package and then reboot | 14:33 |
| MrPingu | Hurrian, I am on thumb so I need errata workarounds in kernel ;) | 14:33 |
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| Pali | kerio, yes on n900 | 14:33 |
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| Pali | kerio: you can flash kernel or nolo directly on n900 without pc | 14:33 |
| kerio | isn't the nand kinda... used? | 14:33 |
| kerio | oh, kernel and nolo | 14:33 |
| kerio | i see | 14:33 |
| Hurrian | MrPingu, use a kernel-power attached uboot on n900 | 14:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | MrPingu: uBoot is a patch attached to default kernel in NAND kernel partition. NOLO thinks it loads kernel but in fact loads uBoot first | 14:33 |
| Hurrian | u-boot does not replace nolo! | 14:34 |
| Pali | and if you want to flash eMMC, flasher-3.5 will tell n900 to boot into flashing mode and n900 start softupd | 14:34 |
| Pali | and then flasher will send eMMC image to softupd and softupd will write it to eMMC | 14:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | MrPingu: uBoot in turn either starts the adjacent kernel (stock nokia kernel afaik) or any of the additional kernel images sitting somewhere in /home or whatever location | 14:34 |
| * MrPingu is learning, thanks guys :D | 14:35 | |
| Pali | ping lxp | 14:36 |
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| lxp | hi | 14:36 |
| Pali | lxp, kernel-power v51 has packet injection modules included in /opt/... | 14:36 |
| kerio | Pali: only wifi though, right? | 14:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | MrPingu: with a thumb system you shouldn't probably use uBoot as you need the thumb workaround in kernel. No use in booting any other kernel | 14:37 |
| Pali | only wifi | 14:37 |
| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, u-boot can boot other systems like ubuntu | 14:37 |
| kerio | Pali: linux-backports-modules-power has the whole of compat-wireless | 14:37 |
| kerio | including bluetooth | 14:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: ack, forgot | 14:37 |
| Pali | kerio, but bluetooth modules which is not for rx51 hw :-) | 14:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway the stock kernel attached to uBoot is basically useless | 14:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if you got thumb system | 14:38 |
| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, more people report that their MyDocs (where are stored kernels) are no readable by u-boot | 14:39 |
| Pali | problems was with BAD formating (maybe windows) | 14:39 |
| Pali | after mkfs.vfat all was ok | 14:39 |
| MrPingu | DocScrutinizer05, I know but actually I am tempted to try nemo-mobile too ;) | 14:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: (softupd) it's also used to 'loopback' USB to 127.0.0.1 on N900, for flashing kernels on board | 14:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as kernel-falsher also uses flasher-3.5 maemo build version afaik | 14:40 |
| Pali | DocScrutinizer05, so if you erase MyDocs, you have no bootable kernel - so fallback attached kernel is usefull | 14:41 |
| lxp | pali: you know that i don't consider the injection driver final, but it's probably the best thing to do as it looks like i won't have enough time to get the packet injection patches into official kernel... | 14:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali: not if it doesn't work with your thumbified system | 14:41 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: it only has to work with backupmenu :) | 14:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed | 14:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: good point | 14:42 |
| kerio | freemangordon: does cssu-thumb thumbify stuff that's used by backupmenu? | 14:42 |
| Pali | backupmenu will work and can export eMMC via USB | 14:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | damn, I hope NOT | 14:42 |
| Pali | so you can copy here kernels and u-boot can boot it | 14:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fine | 14:43 |
| Hurrian | DocScrutinizer05, fix is easy: make "Backupmenu OS" | 14:43 |
| Pali | also backupmenu is started by fanoush bootmenu | 14:43 |
| Pali | and fanoush bootmenu has support for mass storage mode too | 14:43 |
| Pali | lxp, you sent some patches to mailinglist last year | 14:44 |
| Pali | was something upstreamed? | 14:44 |
| lxp | pali: yes but only the bugfixes and some feature ports, but no packet injection patches | 14:45 |
| Pali | ok | 14:45 |
| kerio | what's wrong with the injection drivers, btw? | 14:45 |
| Pali | lxp, what was problems with packet injection patches? | 14:46 |
| kerio | why aren't they good enough for normal use too? | 14:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lxp: I just an hour ago wondered how things ended for your unpaid work on injection | 14:46 |
| lxp | after sending the patches to the kernel mailing list i invested much time to rewrite the packet injection part, but i haven't finished it | 14:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lxp: did you finally get fair payment from users buying the packet? | 14:47 |
| lxp | yes my previous development for neopwn was financed by the users | 14:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or was it a big fail when you did your ballance at end of year? | 14:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | aah, good to hear it turned out to be ok in the end for you :-) | 14:48 |
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| lxp | yeah i was glad that it worked, but it also was a hard decision for me to go that way, because i think it should have been publicly available from the start | 14:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I never had problems with the approach you've chosen | 14:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I think it been as fair as it could get | 14:54 |
| Pali | lxp, is wl1251-cal tool working with packet-injection driver? | 14:54 |
| Pali | or is ifconfig wlan0 hw ether <mac-address> needed for setting correct mac address? | 14:55 |
| lxp | the binary version of wl1251-cal should work with the driver version 0.2 | 14:55 |
| lxp | this is the major change between 0.1 and 0.2 | 14:56 |
| Pali | nice | 14:56 |
| Pali | lxp, and other question: can be packet injection driver used for normal everyday wifi work? | 14:56 |
| Pali | or is there some known problems? | 14:56 |
| lxp | i am not aware of any problems, but i don't use the 0.2 driver myself | 14:57 |
| lxp | i wouldn't recommend it, because it is based on some old wireless-testing | 14:57 |
| lxp | so there may be unfixed bugs in the wireless stack | 14:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | guess how many bugfixes are in stock drivers ;-) | 14:58 |
| Pali | also maemo wl1251 is based on old wireless stack from kernel 2.6.28 | 14:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or that ^^^ | 14:58 |
| lxp | yeah but it is at least from an official kernel release, the driver is based on the development branch | 14:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mhm | 14:59 |
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| lxp | i am personally using a version of the driver based on a little bit newer wireless-testing with some rewritten patches i made after submitting the patches to the kernel mailinglist, but it doesn't contain the injection patches | 15:01 |
| grammoboy | does jolly meego mean, we'll install jollymeego on our n900 at the end of the year? | 15:01 |
| kerio | grammoboy: hell naw | 15:03 |
| grammoboy | kerio, sorry? | 15:03 |
| grammoboy | it's jollamobile | 15:04 |
| SpeedEvil | I, for one, would be prepared to pay for a useful upgrade to n900 software. | 15:04 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: practical issue is that hw blobs say 'not for commercial redistribution' | 15:05 |
| Pali | Now I'm writing shell script for loading packet injection drivers | 15:06 |
| * vi__ waves to Stskeeps | 15:06 | |
| Stskeeps | m00. | 15:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: Yeah - I meant a blob free solution | 15:06 |
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| grammoboy | "Jolla has confirmed that it will not handle maintenance or further development of Maemo/MeeGo devices released by Nokia such as the aforementioned N900/N9/N950" | 15:08 |
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| SpeedEvil | And yes. That too. | 15:09 |
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| grammoboy | ok that's doesn't seems to be good news for the n900 users, good news but not practical for them | 15:11 |
| vi__ | ...another tablet. | 15:12 |
| vi__ | boring. | 15:12 |
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| Stskeeps | tablet, what | 15:13 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 15:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:13 |
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| Macer | vi__: ms showed their tablets | 15:14 |
| Macer | wonder if foxxxconn makes them | 15:14 |
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| vi__ | I know you know something Stskeeps. | 15:14 |
| vi__ | But I also know that now you know that I know you Know somthing you won't tell. | 15:15 |
| Stskeeps | jolla isn't tablet | 15:15 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:15 |
| vi__ | Stskeeps: it is an OS right? | 15:15 |
| Stskeeps | no, it's a company | 15:16 |
| Stskeeps | go read the press release | 15:16 |
| vi__ | My point still stands. Tablets suck and are for noobz. | 15:16 |
| vi__ | Macer: tablets have been on offer for over a decade. They still suck. | 15:18 |
| vi__ | You just cannot enter data in an efficient way. | 15:19 |
| StyXman | vi__: not one uses the ubiquitous calendar interface? | 15:19 |
| StyXman | (the n900 doesn't :( ) | 15:20 |
| SpeedEvil | vi__: voice can in some cases be OK | 15:20 |
| chem|st | vi__: I saw a customs-taskforce documentary yesterday, they made good use of tablets in briefings... and I know some other usecases I'd want a tablet for but a 3.6GHzquadcore with dedicated SOTA graphics... | 15:21 |
| RiD | vi__ tablets do not suck. They don't have a mouth | 15:21 |
| vi__ | ~gentoosmite RiD | 15:22 |
| * infobot spends 6 days recompiling RiD, and when it's all done, RiD runs no faster than previously | 15:22 | |
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| Macer | vi__: heh... guess that's a fair point | 15:22 |
| Macer | thumb keyboards make it easier but you're right. they still suck | 15:23 |
| Macer | i have a transformer and it spends its time in the keyboard dock 90% of the time | 15:23 |
| SpeedEvil | I've been wondering about hacks. | 15:23 |
| SpeedEvil | Tablet + screen cover made as a fake keyboard + internal camera on the tablet watching the fingers. | 15:24 |
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| RiD | the tablet needs to hold itself in the air so you could type on the keyboard with all your fingers | 15:24 |
| RiD | i hate being limited to 70wpm on tablets | 15:24 |
| SpeedEvil | RiD: Quadcopter. | 15:24 |
| RiD | haha | 15:25 |
| SpeedEvil | That would also solve the problem of accidental drops. | 15:25 |
| flux | speedevil, as a replacement to touch-screen kbd? | 15:25 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 15:26 |
| RiD | SpeedEvil how about the erm, how it is called, propeller? | 15:26 |
| RiD | What* | 15:26 |
| RiD | Accidental hits on it would cause flying eyes | 15:26 |
| flux | I suppose it would have the benefit of not using screen area, but detecting 'presses' reliably might turn out to be quite a trick. | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | RiD: I was not being serious. | 15:26 |
| RiD | SpeedEvil i am | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | RiD: In practice, that would have probably insoluble problems. | 15:26 |
| RiD | ALWAYS | 15:26 |
| flux | probably a more working solution - if you need a 'fake keyboard' in the first place - is to overlay a touch surface to the keyboard | 15:27 |
| flux | of course, not as hacky and cool. | 15:27 |
| RiD | https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1536586/derparound/das/goobytheftauto.png | 15:27 |
| SpeedEvil | RiD: Propellors to provide (say) 250 grams of thust are neither quiet or low power. | 15:27 |
| SpeedEvil | flux: That involves considerable extra hardware. | 15:27 |
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| flux | speedevil, is a capacitive or resistive touch surface really that complicated? | 15:27 |
| RiD | we need holograms :( | 15:28 |
| flux | speedevil, btw, the camera and signal processing would consume consderable amount of energy | 15:28 |
| SpeedEvil | flux: yes. | 15:28 |
| Macer | RiD: LOL. i was about to say the same | 15:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | flux: For making in small quantities. | 15:28 |
| RiD | Macer hell yes. Then all you would have to do is stick a support between your legs and put the hologram device there | 15:28 |
| RiD | and bam, hands free | 15:28 |
| RiD | or on the waist | 15:29 |
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| kerio | how does bootmenu work? | 15:42 |
| freemangordon | Sc0rpius: ping | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | via a hook in initscript | 15:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually in /sbin/preinit iirc | 15:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | which (again iirc) checks for a file /bootmenu.sh | 15:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | if [ x"$SLIDE_STATE" = "xopen" ] ; then | 15:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | echo_g "slide open, attempting to use bootmenu" | 15:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [ -f /bootmenu.sh ] && . /bootmenu.sh | 15:47 |
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| * freemangordon idly wonders where zeq is and hopes its not something with his grandma | 16:00 | |
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| vi__ | if [ x"$SLIDE_STATE" = "xopen" ] ; then | 16:08 |
| vi__ | ^explain this line | 16:08 |
| vi__ | specifically the x in x"$SLIDE_STATE" | 16:09 |
| njsf | old test (ie [ ) versions would not cope well with empty vars | 16:10 |
| njsf | so x before makes sure the argument to test is not empty | 16:10 |
| vi__ | FWIW, it is also worth sticking you insmod fbcon inside a if slide stare = closed. | 16:11 |
| vi__ | This stops FB text from vomiting all over backup menu. | 16:11 |
| Pali | "$SLIDE_STATE" this will be always non empty because of "" | 16:12 |
| njsf | I was explaining the idiom | 16:12 |
| Pali | if [ x$var ] .... | 16:12 |
| njsf | not the accuracy of that line | 16:12 |
| Pali | if [ "$var" ] ... | 16:12 |
| Pali | but using if [ x"$var" ] is really stupid :D | 16:13 |
| Pali | seems like some shell beginer written this into crytical /sbin/preinit script | 16:13 |
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| StyXman | the correct test should be | 16:21 |
| StyXman | if [ -z "$foo" ] | 16:21 |
| StyXman | but I think it's a bashism | 16:21 |
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| _berto_ | StyXman: it's not a bashism | 16:27 |
| Jaffa | Oh dear. Just made the mistake of reading TMO. And a thread about the Council at that ;-) | 16:29 |
| Jaffa | Fortunately it ends with sense from woody14619: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1234448#post1234448 | 16:31 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: feel free to pitch in on my question on how you'd like to see the community around things | 16:32 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Sorry, missed that. URL? | 16:32 |
| Stskeeps | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85315 , http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1233937#post1233937 | 16:33 |
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| StyXman | _berto_: yes, I was just checking that | 16:35 |
| StyXman | dash supports that | 16:35 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Thanks | 16:37 |
| Pali | StyXman, test -z is in posix shell, so should work | 16:38 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Didn't immediately see any sensible answers ;-) | 16:38 |
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| Stskeeps | Jaffa: from my side mostly because i can't say more than what mer can do, and what's in press releases and twitter.. doesn't mean i can't ask people how they feel | 16:40 |
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| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Fair point. | 16:41 |
| Stskeeps | and get proper inspiration on how we can do this | 16:41 |
| Corsac | arf you part of Jolla? | 16:41 |
| Stskeeps | Corsac: :nod: | 16:42 |
| SpeedEvil | Stskeeps: I feel hungry. | 16:44 |
| * SpeedEvil goes and gets an omelette. | 16:44 | |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: me too. and the water isn't working in my apartment. i feel like richard stallman. | 16:44 |
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| vi__ | Stskeeps: what, fat and sassy? | 16:53 |
| Stskeeps | vi__: dancing with ze gnus | 16:53 |
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| vi__ | So has *anyone* received their CA device yet? | 17:08 |
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| * SpeedEvil discovers a handy race condition. | 17:26 | |
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| SpeedEvil | If you start to launch a video, and immediately lock using the switch, the player will play audio with the screen off. | 17:26 |
| SpeedEvil | (otherwise it pauses on lock) | 17:27 |
| ShadowJK | I've sometimes seen the player continue playing after switching away from it | 17:27 |
| ShadowJK | but i dont know the exact timings to accomplish that | 17:27 |
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| kerio | hm, recaller didn't stop a recording when a call ended | 17:28 |
| kerio | that's not nice | 17:28 |
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| ShadowJK | Macer: seems like transformer would be a few magnitudes cooler if yo could run a normal linux on it | 17:36 |
| ShadowJK | though "normal linux" seems to be getting much harder to find these days :) | 17:36 |
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| teotwaki | what the hell is "normal" linux? | 17:37 |
| ShadowJK | like from before gnome/kde/ubuntu became stupid | 17:39 |
| ShadowJK | with their unusable fancy guis :0 | 17:39 |
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| RiD | ShadowJK with jello afks | 17:40 |
| RiD | effects* | 17:40 |
| ShadowJK | It almost works in fremantle, the effects most of the time dont get in the way or distract | 17:41 |
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| teotwaki | ShadowJK: try MATE | 17:43 |
| ShadowJK | On my ancient linux desktop install I have xfce with 9x9 virtual desktops and ctrl-cursor to navigate that grid. it's speedy navigation :) | 17:45 |
| StyXman | ShadowJK: sounds more like a sliding puzzle | 17:49 |
| ShadowJK | It's similar to fremantle, except on fremantle i dont have hotkeys other than the "show grid" hotkey of ctrl-backspace | 17:50 |
| StyXman | 15 puzzle, or more like 81 puzzle | 17:50 |
| ShadowJK | oops I meant 3x3 :) | 17:51 |
| StyXman | jajaja, ok | 17:51 |
| kerio | ShadowJK: and qwerasdfzxcv to select the window, you mean | 17:51 |
| kerio | and QWERASDFZXCV to close the window | 17:51 |
| hiemanshu | ShadowJK: if its ancient, I bet it cant do 9x9 with all occupied without swaping all the time :P | 17:51 |
| ShadowJK | Q9550 and 8G ram | 17:52 |
| hiemanshu | thats not ancient | 17:52 |
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| Lava_Croft | pentiumD | 17:52 |
| ShadowJK | with kde plasma it was too slow to be usable | 17:52 |
| ShadowJK | :P | 17:52 |
| hiemanshu | ShadowJK: thats the GPU probably, Intel GPU? | 17:52 |
| ShadowJK | no | 17:53 |
| ShadowJK | i meant the os is ancient-ish | 17:53 |
| hiemanshu | ah | 17:53 |
| ShadowJK | fedora 9 or 10 or something. | 17:53 |
| hiemanshu | ShadowJK: seriously, upgrade :P | 17:53 |
| ShadowJK | hiemanshu; when I find 2 months spare time | 17:54 |
| hiemanshu | ShadowJK: if you find 2 months spare time, install gentoo/arch linux, rolling distro, forget upgrades :P | 17:54 |
| * ShadowJK remembers the horrors of wrangling notworkmanager into working last time he upgraded :/ | 17:56 | |
| StyXman | you can get the same with debian sid | 17:56 |
| ShadowJK | Though reading the bugzilla where linus torvalds was also flaming because notworkmanager didn't network was amusing :) | 17:56 |
| ShadowJK | Now I've got it behaving pretty nicely, only issue is nfs server dies after hibernate | 17:57 |
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| StyXman | ShadowJK: probably you can upgrade the kernel without much breaking | 17:59 |
| hello | hey all | 17:59 |
| StyXman | not too much, tho | 17:59 |
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| vi__ | what is stdcam_replacer? | 18:05 |
| * freemangordon feels relaxed, no inet drops for the last 15 minutes :D | 18:05 | |
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| vi__ | freemangordon: why would you have inet drops? | 18:06 |
| teotwaki | ShadowJK: seriously nice, simple UI, gnome 2 fork. Task-centric, highly recommended. | 18:06 |
| vi__ | teotwaki: what is? | 18:06 |
| teotwaki | ShadowJK: try MATE | 18:06 |
| ShadowJK | what does task-centric mean? | 18:06 |
| teotwaki | ^ this | 18:06 |
| kerio | ShadowJK: openbox-session or gtfo | 18:06 |
| vi__ | also can someone recmmend a debian based distro that can 'run from ram'? | 18:06 |
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| teotwaki | task-centric means that you don't have to use your mouse to switch between windows (as in, windows in your taskbar aren't organised by application type, but actual window instance) | 18:07 |
| vi__ | aaah. Gnome before it went full retard. | 18:07 |
| teotwaki | the win7, unity and gnome3 window managers are notoriously poor in that regard. | 18:07 |
| ShadowJK | vaguely related, anyone know of any bluetooth trackballs? | 18:08 |
| StyXman | vi__: run from ram as in a hack to a live cd? | 18:09 |
| vi__ | StyXman: more or less | 18:09 |
| teotwaki | vi__: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Linux_distributions_that_run_from_RAM | 18:09 |
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| vi__ | kinda like knoppix before it got bent. | 18:10 |
| StyXman | teotwaki: jojo | 18:10 |
| freemangordon | vi__: there was som problem with my cabling/splitters/taps, a guy from my inet provider came and replace a bunch of devices. He promised it will be ok, but I don't believe such kind of technicians ;) | 18:10 |
| freemangordon | well, it looks ok now, indeed | 18:10 |
| StyXman | vi__: it's not the same from RAM that from CD | 18:10 |
| vi__ | aaah. Nothing worse than 'non-technical' technicians. | 18:10 |
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| FIQ | DocScrutinizer: "I see possible context switches in IRQ and FIQ as well" wut? | 18:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | [\ | 18:37 |
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| jean_brat | Hi i have a silly question.. Why cant meego can be flashed on similar OMAP platform used by nokia such as X6 or N97? are there any attempts made on this? | 18:45 |
| ShadowJK | Nokia probably could | 18:45 |
| ShadowJK | also N97 isn't omap? | 18:46 |
| ShadowJK | But the thing is that those devices are locked, the flashing software for them is secret and not distributed, and the bootloader/cpu will only execute OS that is cryptographically signed by Nokia | 18:47 |
| ShadowJK | in other words they've done everything to prevent you from replacing or modifyig the operatihg system. | 18:47 |
| * RST38h moos at Shadowjk | 18:47 | |
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| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: It would generally require at least porting in addition. There will be unsupported devices that need to be configured. | 18:48 |
| jean_brat | ok.. first of all.. congradulations for every one here involved in the formation of jolla.. and keep the good work :) | 18:48 |
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| SpeedEvil | This may vary from trivial - for example a new accellerometer driver - to very complex - supporting a new soft-modem. | 18:48 |
| SpeedEvil | Which might have issues legally with required IP. | 18:49 |
| jean_brat | i assume all the drivers drivers for N900 is same as for X6.. | 18:49 |
| Corsac | that looks like a very bad assumption | 18:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Umm... | 18:49 |
| jean_brat | because.. all are TI components .. inside the soc but don know sensors may differ | 18:49 |
| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: I assume that you wear a dress, and are 18 feet tall, and smell of elderberries. | 18:50 |
| * ShadowJK 'd assume no drivers from N900 work on X6 | 18:51 | |
| SpeedEvil | If the processor is identical - that means it is likely to work. | 18:51 |
| Venemo_N9 | wat? x6=? | 18:51 |
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| SpeedEvil | Unfortunately, there are well over a dozen other chips onboard that need seperately and accurately configured for the device to work. | 18:52 |
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| SpeedEvil | Simply booting the wrong kernel may in principle even damage stuff, as it turns on the wrong things at the wrong voltage. | 18:52 |
| jean_brat | ok.. lets perhaps all of em reqire little or more modification., in order to do so.. hardware details of x6 is open? | 18:52 |
| SpeedEvil | No. | 18:52 |
| SpeedEvil | Essentially no phones, with very, very few exceptions have published details. | 18:53 |
| SpeedEvil | Phones with android source are sort-of-documented if you can actually get source. | 18:53 |
| Corsac | hmhm, didn't receive any answer to my sources request | 18:54 |
| jean_brat | when TI sells a platform for nokia.. with all the hardware details..and nokia use it on 10 different phones with some variations | 18:54 |
| * ShadowJK thought N97 and X6 were arm11 not cortex 8 based SoC | 18:54 | |
| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: it's not that simple. | 18:55 |
| jean_brat | but basically if we have the datasheet for N900 we should be having stuffs for similar stuffs as well i guess? | 18:55 |
| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: To make a PC analogy - you're looking at the processor. | 18:55 |
| jean_brat | ok lets consider this way | 18:55 |
| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: There are a dozen seperate plug-in cards that may be from different vendors, or different versions that will be required to work. | 18:55 |
| SpeedEvil | And there is no BIOS to help you autoconfigure this. | 18:55 |
| jean_brat | when intel sells a chipset.. Asus uses it on 10 diffenent motherboards | 18:56 |
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| SpeedEvil | It's not a PC. | 18:56 |
| jean_brat | but basically driver is the same correct? | 18:56 |
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| ShadowJK | Or consider N8x0, TI Omap2, but without knowing what Nokia added you'd not even get working mmc/sd storage, no wifi, no bt, no screen, no sound, no usb | 18:57 |
| SpeedEvil | PCs have standard chips - mostly - that are designed to conform to one standard. They have a BIOS that configures the board to a state where it will boot, and stuff like ACPI and friends to inform the OS about the hardware. | 18:57 |
| SpeedEvil | Phones don't. | 18:57 |
| SpeedEvil | Phones are a bunch of hardware that is connected in random ways that was cheapest - that vary even within a model - and there is no BIOS or anything to tell you how it's configured. | 18:57 |
| SpeedEvil | Adding to the fun is that some of the required chips may not have documents available unless you purchase a sizeable fraction of a million of them, and sign a NDA. | 18:58 |
| SpeedEvil | Which NDA may even prohibit you from making open-source drivers using the info. | 18:59 |
| vi__ | I can confirm this. | 18:59 |
| jean_brat | ok i get it SpeedEvil . as for as the SOC is concerned. there are dozens of stuffs inside | 19:00 |
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| jean_brat | but its all TI IP's .. but nokia configures this differently in different mobiles with its boot codes | 19:00 |
| SpeedEvil | The SoC is the CPU essentially, and the chipset - in PC terms. There are _lots_ of external cards hooked in. | 19:00 |
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| SpeedEvil | It's not all the CPU. | 19:00 |
| jean_brat | Translation.. nokia does not use the same vender mostly? | 19:01 |
| SpeedEvil | even if you have a completely standard and supported SoC - if you boot a kernel that does not know about the phone - the display won't work, neither will the touchscreen, phone, ... | 19:01 |
| ShadowJK | On PC you've got autoconfig and discovery on the PCI(e) busses, the cpu can detect the presence and address of a device on the bus, and even get an identification code so that the os knows what device it is, and can pick an appropriate driver. On phones there's no such luxury. :) | 19:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Probing can make stuff explode. | 19:03 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 19:03 |
| SpeedEvil | It's back to the days of ISA - but worse. | 19:03 |
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| ShadowJK | You could have two devices containing the exact same soc, and exact same accelerometer and battery charger (for example), but kernel from one device wont work on the other because the devices are hooked up differently | 19:04 |
| jean_brat | wow.. that was a very convincing explanation.. | 19:04 |
| jean_brat | Thanks for that ShadowJK | 19:05 |
| jean_brat | and SpeedEvil | 19:05 |
| SpeedEvil | np | 19:05 |
| ShadowJK | And heck, there could be devices in out N900 we don't know about. Docscrutinizer has observed bme accessing an i2c bus/address combination that no known devices are on. Either it's a bme bug, or a device we dont know of sits there, or a device we know of is secretly also listening to that address for some unknown function :) | 19:06 |
| ShadowJK | in our* | 19:06 |
| kerio | hahaha | 19:07 |
| kerio | signs point to BME being a piece of crap | 19:07 |
| jean_brat | bme == ? | 19:07 |
| ShadowJK | battery management | 19:08 |
| kerio | Battery Management Entity or something | 19:08 |
| kerio | a closed-source piece of crap | 19:08 |
| jean_brat | how do you probe all these? | 19:09 |
| ShadowJK | probe the devices? You don't, because it can be misinterpreted as a command, and can do bad things | 19:11 |
| ShadowJK | As for the software bme, you can run it under gdb or strace to try figure out what it does | 19:12 |
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| kerio | or disassemble it | 19:13 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I assume you know it's that the charge meter doesn't actually care about the high bits of the address? :) | 19:13 |
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| ShadowJK | I don't remember the details | 19:16 |
| ShadowJK | but wtf? | 19:16 |
| SpeedEvil | Indeed. | 19:16 |
| ShadowJK | which bits does it care about? | 19:16 |
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| SpeedEvil | It has registers 0-7 from memory - and if you access register 34, it just aliases to those 7 | 19:17 |
| SpeedEvil | 8 | 19:17 |
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| ShadowJK | ah | 19:17 |
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| kerio | is there a way to not get the usb mode dialog? | 19:24 |
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| jean_brat | are you all work for nokia? | 19:41 |
| NIN101 | nope. | 19:42 |
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| jean_brat | sw professionals i assume? ShadowJK SpeedEvil ? | 19:43 |
| ShadowJK | not really | 19:44 |
| ShadowJK | hobbyist | 19:44 |
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| psychologe | have a question.when N900 charge full battery,if use not unplug charger, when battery only half ,N900 can't auto start charge,has some terminal command let it start charge? | 20:14 |
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| psychologe | have a question.when N900 charge full battery,if you are not unplug charger, when battery only half ,N900 can't auto start charge,has some terminal command let it start charge? | 20:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | no such problems known | 20:20 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | with bme your N900 should basically _always_ start charging when you plug in fastcharger, and it shall keep battery at 100% charge as long as plugged to charger. With charge21.sh the bq24150 does all the charging management and restarts charging after stop-on-full only when battery is down to 75% | 20:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | on plugging charger charging is supposed to always start, and unless your battery is actaully 100% full, it will signal amber charging light and icon for a while. Only on 100% full battery it doesn't signal charging when plugging USB fastcharger | 20:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | jean_brat: I'm currently unemployed for health reasons. | 20:29 |
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| jean_brat | ohh.. am sorry SpeedEvil | 20:31 |
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| jean_brat | is it very difficult to get USB keyboard and mouse working on N900 with the help of belkin multiport adopter? | 20:37 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 20:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | moderately difficult, for beginners | 20:41 |
| jean_brat | cool.. i have the belkin adopter. need to buy a spare keyboard and mouse.. | 20:45 |
| jean_brat | DocScrutinizer, you know the steps you can guide me when i am ready? | 20:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's all in talk.maemo.org | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, no precice link atm here | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | thanks to vandalism also the bot has no link anymore | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | say "thanks you, estel!" | 20:48 |
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| kerio | thank you, estel! | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, let's try ... | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~hostmode-powered | 20:50 |
| infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, hostmode-powered is http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=921203#post921203 | 20:50 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | jean_brat: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=866309&postcount=9 you find some useful links to youtube videos and tmo threads | 20:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | particularly http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65570 | 20:55 |
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| kerio | is http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/genuine-samsung-galaxy-s3-s2-note-micro-usb-to-usb-converter-p29425.htm this the cool hostmode adapter for n900? | 20:57 |
| kerio | 15£ is quite expensive | 20:58 |
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| jean_brat | bluetooth keybord mouse are faster then USB connected via HUB ? in N900 | 21:00 |
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| jean_brat | i have a belkin hub which is also powered externally as well | 21:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=872844&postcount=17 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=873530&postcount=27 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=874074&postcount=34 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=875849&postcount=51 http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=883873&postcount=65 ... | 21:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | jean_brat: you'll anyway need a special F-F-adapter or cable with usb B plugs on both ends | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | otherwise your cables won't fit | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or rather, will fit but to the wrong receptacle of hub | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | generally speaking: if you can't plug an external HDD directly to the N900 with your cables, you are missing an adapter. Hub won't help then | 21:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, read the thread I linked you to, that detail is mentioned there in at least 100 posts | 21:16 |
| jean_brat | http://www.belkin.com/in/IWCatProductPage.process?Product_Id=534950 | 21:18 |
| jean_brat | this is what i have | 21:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and that's a hub | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | please re-read my last 5 posts | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jean_brat: special performance just for you: plug your CA-157 cable that comes with N900. On other end you see a flat rectangle plug (A-plug) | 21:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | now try plugging that plug to your belkin hub | 21:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if you succeeded you did it wrong! | 21:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it has to go into the one receptacle at hub where it DOESNT fit | 21:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | thus you neede an adapter | 21:23 |
| jean_brat | i am confused | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | just do what I told you | 21:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I can't see how you get confused by that | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so please ask precise questions when any of the 4(?) steps above turns out to be unclear | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you watched that recommended youtube video? | 21:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | seems my estimation of "moderately complicated, for beginners" been off the point | 21:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | please watch this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkCDyUO0sKQ&NR=1 you won't need any translation ;-) | 21:29 |
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| jean_brat | no English version of this? | 21:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | damn! english version of italian yaggediyagg? what for? ;-P | 21:35 |
| jean_brat | why cant i directly connect the micro usb cable came with the box to the hub? | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | our easern european members wouldn't need more than 4 words to say the same XP | 21:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | because it fits to downstream receptacles of hub | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but N900 is upstream aka host here | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as the name "usb HOSTmode" might make you guess | 21:37 |
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| jean_brat | hmm | 21:37 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on USB you always got ONE host and one or more peripherals | 21:38 |
| jean_brat | since i don understand his language.. what exactly i need here? | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | your N900 CAQ-157 cable is for N900 playing peripheral role when plugging it to PC *HOST* | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on HOST mode the N900 is the HOST | 21:39 |
| jean_brat | i get it DocScrutinizer so how does this conversion happens? | 21:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so you have to plug in the N900 as if it were a PC | 21:40 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | with a F-F adapter as shown http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=fkCDyUO0sKQ#t=40s | 21:41 |
| jean_brat | <microusb N900> slave --- <USB Master> --? ?? <to hub as master> | 21:41 |
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| jean_brat | so F&F will make downstreem device into Upstream device? | 21:44 |
| jean_brat | Even a 3rd party micro usb will not make it as a master(upstream device) >? | 21:46 |
| jean_brat | ohh i am sorry i am asking too many questions.. is there any document which describes this? | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65232 #1 by MohammadAG: "You will need to a female to female USB adapter, and the stock USB cable." ->http://www.dealextreme.com/p/usb-cable-coupler-extension-connector-2646 | 21:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | PRETTY PLEASE read(!) this post | 21:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | even | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=65232 #1 by MohammadAG: "You will need to a <a href=http://www.dealextreme.com/p/usb-cable-coupler-extension-connector-2646> female to female USB adapter, </a>and the stock USB cable." | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ooops, stock nokia cable is CA-101 not CA-157 | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (not that this matters) | 21:51 |
| jean_brat | theoretically how does F&F converter make a master as Slave? | 21:52 |
| jean_brat | or slave as host | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it doesn't | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | h-e-n does that for N900 | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | turning it into a HOST | 21:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | aka master, in your terminology | 21:53 |
| RiD | i ripped the usb thingy from a broken motherboard ;D | 21:54 |
| jean_brat | so h e n detects this bridge and make the device as master | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the whole point is: N900 is designed as peripheral (slave), but with H-E-N we turn it into a host. Alas it still has a usb receptacle that says "I'm a peripheral" so you need the F-F adapter | 21:55 |
| kerio | it doesn't detect shit, actually | 21:55 |
| kerio | it just makes it so | 21:55 |
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| kerio | you need both a strap-on dildo and the willingness to use it | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed | 21:56 |
| kerio | h-e-n is the willingness | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as soon as you start h-e-n (and activate vbus) the N900 turns into a USB host | 21:56 |
| jean_brat | so what does F&F does? | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | except for receptacle which we can't control per software ;-P | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | *sigh* | 21:57 |
| kerio | the F-F adapter is the strap-on dildo | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hehe, exactly | 21:57 |
| kerio | although it's kinda the converse | 21:57 |
| kerio | it's like a double fleshlight | 21:58 |
| kerio | but that's just confusing | 21:58 |
| kerio | jean_brat: you need 1) to make sure your N900 acts like a usb host device | 21:58 |
| kerio | you do that with hen | 21:58 |
| kerio | and 2) you need to actually make stuff fit in the n900 | 21:58 |
| kerio | you do that with the adapter | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | thanks kerio, I'm off | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | need a break | 21:59 |
| kerio | nooooo | 21:59 |
| kerio | i need answers first | 21:59 |
| kerio | where could i buy a F-F adapter? | 21:59 |
| SpeedEvil | ebay | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | DAFAQ, look at dealextreme link above, or use fleabay or aunt google | 21:59 |
| SpeedEvil | Search for double-ended | 21:59 |
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| kerio | SpeedEvil: ¬.¬ | 22:00 |
| kerio | anyway | 22:00 |
| kerio | does anyone know if the galaxys2's usb host adapter was sold separately? | 22:00 |
| kerio | because a friend of mine has one | 22:00 |
| kerio | i might steal it | 22:00 |
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| RiD | kerio do you have a broken motherboard around or so? | 22:01 |
| kerio | RiD: nope | 22:01 |
| RiD | well, then nvm | 22:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: meanwhile those adapters are available in every other electronics shop, also at your hometown | 22:03 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: it's definetely available in my hometown | 22:03 |
| kerio | it's Rome, ffs | 22:03 |
| kerio | but i'm not there | 22:04 |
| kerio | i'm on holiday, and the closest electronics shop is probably... | 22:04 |
| kerio | well, in Rome | 22:04 |
| kerio | so no | 22:04 |
| kerio | but i found an USB A-A adapter for 4.40€ shipped | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, do you think WE know where to get such adapter in the australian outback? | 22:04 |
| kerio | from the netherlands | 22:04 |
| kerio | so yay! | 22:05 |
| kerio | now... should i actually buy it? | 22:05 |
| kerio | is it actually usable without a powered usb HUB? | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | up to 200mA yes | 22:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and with new h-e-n version you even got my awesome warnings if you try to pull more than 200 | 22:07 |
| kerio | so i would only be able to use it for small usb drives and mouses/keyboards | 22:07 |
| kerio | or for self-powered stuff, but where would i find something like that on the go? | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it seems most memory sticks need less than 200 | 22:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: yeah, and how would you intentionally break kernel ABI while on holiday. Honestly sometimes I don't think you really want your questions get answered | 22:08 |
| kerio | i mostly like trolling | 22:09 |
| kerio | it's not my fault :( | 22:09 |
| kerio | well, it is | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: you only got a limited contingent of useless silly questions to ask. If it's used up nobody will answer *any* of your questions anymore | 22:10 |
| kerio | D: | 22:10 |
| kerio | does it recharge with time? | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or at least very very slowly | 22:10 |
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| kerio | hm, can i get some kind of potion to recharge it quickly? | 22:11 |
| kerio | and are these questions draining the question pool? | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | pling, pling, another two off the account | 22:11 |
| kerio | dammit! | 22:11 |
| StyXman | /me see's kerio's silly-question-tokens jar half empty | 22:12 |
| kerio | s/^ // maybe? | 22:12 |
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| luke-jr | StyXman: maybe because he didn't post a bitcoin address for it yet | 22:20 |
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| kerio | hrmpf, qtmobilehotspot requires rootsh | 22:54 |
| kerio | what's up with all this bullshit requirements | 22:55 |
| kerio | why can't developers just find out what's the *good* method of running stuff as root? :/ | 22:55 |
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| kerio | i keep pushing the "upgrade" button but i keep not seeing KP51 :c | 23:05 |
| Sc0rpius | I wonder if anyone here knows why SSL connections always fail in scratchbox | 23:11 |
| Sc0rpius | it's driving me crazy | 23:11 |
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| Macer | http://mobile.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-09/samsung-wins-u-k-apple-ruling-over-not-as-cool-galaxy-tablet.html | 23:30 |
| Macer | samsung isn't as cool as apple? :) | 23:31 |
| nox- | haha | 23:31 |
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| khertan | Does someone can say me if pr1.3 contain an updated pyside package ? (didn't have any n9) | 23:33 |
| kerio | don't you mean n900? | 23:35 |
| khertan | nope just wrong channel :) | 23:35 |
| khertan | i mean n9 on harmattan | 23:35 |
| kerio | oic | 23:35 |
| khertan | i ve an n900 and n950 :) | 23:35 |
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| RiD | khertan i envy you | 23:38 |
| khertan | RiD: to be honest n950 have to much problem to be a phone to use everyday | 23:40 |
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| luke-jr | khertan: want to sell the N950? | 23:43 |
| khertan | luke-jr: i can't | 23:43 |
| luke-jr | lame | 23:43 |
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| Corsac | khertan: what kind of issues? | 23:47 |
| khertan | Corsac: losing network that require a reboot ...and worst today i got, was a nice screen displaying : Cleaning Device, Please wait | 23:48 |
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| Sicelo | :P | 23:49 |
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| Corsac | ouh, nice… | 23:51 |
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| khertan | for the moment i trying to identify what app leak battery when device idle | 23:56 |
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