| DocScrutinizer | mgedmin: I'd be interested in how to get e.g. alt on toolbar | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| DocScrutinizer | seem you can put any arbitrary key there, except qualifier keys other than ctrl | 00:00 |
| mgedmin | on a n9? no clue | 00:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | which is especially silly as ctrl is available on hw kbd | 00:01 |
| DocScrutinizer | on N900/N810 | 00:01 |
| mgedmin | sorry, I meant n900 | 00:01 |
| mgedmin | on the n9 it's possible, I believe -- maliit is more advanced than the old osso-xterm toolbar | 00:02 |
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| trumee | _freemangordon, ping | 00:41 |
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| fastlane` | hello everybody \o/ | 10:05 |
| fastlane` | i want to ask a lil question about flashing if ppl are still awake n reading :o | 10:05 |
| fastlane` | well the q is | 10:06 |
| fastlane` | i have kp48 installed along with multiboot and android | 10:06 |
| fastlane` | not last night i tried my best to flash my device, but nothing worked, the flasher always wud get stuck in "waiting for device" msg | 10:06 |
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| fastlane` | flashing from ubuntu 32 bits btw | 10:07 |
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| fastlane` | now rebooted n900, flashed the stock kernel from n900, through the removal command of kp | 10:08 |
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| fastlane` | and then turned off n900 and then flashed again and the flashing worked | 10:08 |
| fastlane` | so my question is, that can a combination of multiboot and kp on n900 prevent device from getting flashed from the pc? | 10:09 |
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| Sicelo | anything is possible with multiboot, afaik | 10:22 |
| Sicelo | ~multiboot | 10:22 |
| Sicelo | ~multi-boot | 10:22 |
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| fastlane` | ty Sicelo | 10:22 |
| fastlane` | what my concern is | 10:23 |
| Sicelo | ah, infobot's away | 10:23 |
| fastlane` | that if i somehow mess up the device in such a way that its not booting up, and multiboot is still installed | 10:23 |
| fastlane` | so i wont be able to flash like ever? so its stuck? | 10:23 |
| fastlane` | but i thought that through the flasher, no matter what problem occured in the software, you shud be able to flash the device back to the reset state | 10:24 |
| fastlane` | boot loaders etc shud not be able to stop the flash process | 10:24 |
| Sicelo | i do think it should still flash.. but multiboot is, from what i can gather, a dangerous tool to use | 10:25 |
| fastlane` | hmm yea, cuz i also think that the device's flash process shud be hardwired, and shud take priority over everything, no matter what is there or what is not or what has been overrided | 10:27 |
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| Pali | ping X-Fade | 12:35 |
| X-Fade | Pali: pong | 12:36 |
| Pali | X-Fade, there is problem with package kernel-power-settings | 12:37 |
| Pali | bad md5 hash | 12:37 |
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| X-Fade | Pali: Then it got uploaded twice? | 12:37 |
| Pali | There was missed last version v13 in extras-devel, so I uploaded it | 12:37 |
| Pali | and seems that in repository is old md5 hash for that package | 12:38 |
| X-Fade | You should never ever ever ever ever upload the same file with different content. | 12:39 |
| Pali | I uploaded same file | 12:39 |
| Pali | same tar.gz | 12:39 |
| X-Fade | Then the md5 can't change | 12:39 |
| Pali | same diff | 12:39 |
| Pali | but autobuilder builded new deb | 12:39 |
| Pali | and deb has new md5 | 12:39 |
| Pali | problem is with builded deb package | 12:39 |
| X-Fade | But you must always increase version number | 12:39 |
| X-Fade | Anyway, the way to fix this now is to just increase version number and upload again. | 12:40 |
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| Pali | will it work? | 12:40 |
| X-Fade | of course | 12:40 |
| Pali | ok I will try | 12:41 |
| X-Fade | As long as you don't change numbering scheme or something else weird with the numbering. | 12:41 |
| X-Fade | just +1 should work fine. | 12:41 |
| Pali | actual version is 0.13 | 12:41 |
| Pali | should I upload 0.13.1 | 12:42 |
| Pali | ? | 12:42 |
| X-Fade | 0.14 is fine? | 12:42 |
| X-Fade | Numbers are free, don't complicate things too much :) | 12:42 |
| Pali | ok | 12:42 |
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| Pali | so I push 0.14 | 12:42 |
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| RST38h | Canonical is pulling funding for in-house developers to work on the KDE-based Kubuntu flavor. Canonical now seems committed to its single vision of a GNOME-based Unity as a desktop and other Ubuntu flavors will now have to rely on community support and some infrastructure from Canonical. | 12:44 |
| X-Fade | Pali: but you can always check yourself with dpkg --compare-versions | 12:45 |
| Pali | ok | 12:45 |
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| Pali | I uploaded 0.14, now waiting for autobuilder... | 12:45 |
| X-Fade | Pali: dpkg --compare-versions 0.14 gt 0.13 && echo true | 12:46 |
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| Pali | is maemo.org down again? | 13:45 |
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| andre__ | Pali, http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/maemo.org | 13:55 |
| Pali | andree__, ok. I think that now I have problems with KDE :D Upgrade needs reboot... | 13:57 |
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| chem|st | DocScrutinizer: o/ | 14:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | at work | 14:10 |
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| jonwil | hi | 15:40 |
| jonwil | Too quiet around here :P | 15:41 |
| Macer | we tired ourselves out bitching about nokia | 15:47 |
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| Gear_ | hey, if I have an ssh connection to my phone, how do I make it take a photo through bash | 15:52 |
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| Gear_ | the cover would already be open obviously, but how would I make it take a photo? and could you make it focus or anything first? | 15:53 |
| Sicelo | phone-control package is the easiest to use | 15:53 |
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| Gear_ | is that in the devel repository | 15:54 |
| Sicelo | i don't remember .. my n900 is off atm.. possibly extras though | 15:55 |
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| Gear_ | do you know the line of sight range of the wifi? | 15:56 |
| Gear_ | if my phone is up in the air attached to a kite and I'm using a netbook to control it | 15:57 |
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| Sicelo | u will have to wait for hardware gurus here :) | 16:03 |
| Sicelo | all i know is that u will be better off disabling power-saving for wifi when u do that | 16:04 |
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| Pali | jonwil: what parts of microb browser did you RE? | 16:40 |
| jonwil | I produced a dev package for browser-neteal | 16:41 |
| jonwil | which is the library used by microb to talk to the browser daemon | 16:41 |
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| jonwil | -dev package produced using a bunch of bits and pieces from around the net (specifically those bits of the N900 browser that are open plus also some stuff from various older SVN repos containing browser code) | 16:43 |
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| jonwil | I also made the microb-eal-dev package (source code for which is available as part of the microb-eal source but binary was not in SDK repos) | 16:44 |
| jonwil | I also took older source code I found for the browserd daemon | 16:45 |
| jonwil | and modified it so it matched the N900 PR1.3 browserd | 16:46 |
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| jonwil | And also I took the browser-neteal-dev package I made and combined it with the tablet-browser-view-dev package and other packages and then proceeded to clone tablet-browser-view-test | 16:48 |
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| jonwil | which is a simple test app that tests out the tablet-browser-view widget | 16:48 |
| jonwil | which IMO is the easiest way to embed the microb browser in your app | 16:49 |
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| jonwil | as it does lots of work for you | 16:49 |
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| jonwil | Thats all I reverse enginereed | 16:49 |
| jonwil | I never reverse engineered much of the browser UI because that was too complex to do | 16:50 |
| jonwil | why did you want to know? | 16:50 |
| jonwil | guess he went AFK :P | 16:53 |
| jonwil | Pali: ping | 16:53 |
| Pali | I'm asking to know how many components has microb closed | 16:54 |
| Pali | and how hard is to rewritre it | 16:54 |
| Pali | and use new upstream gecko engine | 16:54 |
| jonwil | Given that the browserd daemon and all the important bits it links to are open source, replacing Gecko with a new one is in theory possible | 16:56 |
| jonwil | Biggest issue would be the plugins and modules (specifically the Flash plugin and the Nokia Maps bits) | 16:56 |
| jonwil | if the plugin API has changed and those things aren't compatible | 16:57 |
| jonwil | the actual browser UI is still very much closed | 16:58 |
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| jonwil | but that has basically no links to the underlying Gecko engine | 16:58 |
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| Pali | flash plugin using standard NPAPI interface | 17:03 |
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| jonwil | yeah true but Nokia Maps is different and is using all sorts of Gecko APIs | 17:08 |
| Pali | should be | 17:09 |
| Pali | jonwil, any success with opened MCE? | 17:11 |
| jonwil | nope | 17:11 |
| jonwil | I tried to take oldest MCE source I could find and then reverse engineer N900 MCE to try and get a match | 17:12 |
| jonwil | but too many changes between N900 Fremantle MCE | 17:12 |
| jonwil | and oldest MCE in MeeGo GIT repo | 17:12 |
| Pali | I think that other app only using dbus for communicating with MCE, so the dbus api was changed? | 17:13 |
| jonwil | it wasn't the DBUS API so much, it was differences in other parts of | 17:14 |
| jonwil | other parts of the system | 17:14 |
| jonwil | in any case it just isnt possible to get open MCE going without Nokia releasing source | 17:14 |
| jonwil | or and ARM guru showing up to reverse engineer things | 17:14 |
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| Pali | and what is problem with opened mce? could not be full fremantle mce replaced by opened? | 17:16 |
| jonwil | nope, as I said, too many differences in important places between Fremantle MCE and published MeeGo MCE source | 17:16 |
| Pali | and what is different? | 17:17 |
| Pali | I know that 3 fremantle mce modules missing in meego mce | 17:17 |
| Pali | mce modules only communicate with kernel or not? | 17:18 |
| jonwil | I dont know exactly what the things that are different do | 17:18 |
| jonwil | but I know they do things that look important | 17:18 |
| jonwil | I actually tested various things built from the open MeeGo MCE source on my N900 PR1.3 phone and nearly bricked it in the process | 17:19 |
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| jonwil | so that;'s why I feel comfortable saying that we cant do it without Nokia or an ARM guru | 17:19 |
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| Gear_ | has anyone here installed ubuntu on an n900? | 17:27 |
| guly | debian | 17:28 |
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| jonwil | so Pali, do you actually plan to do any work on browserd or otherwise or are you just asking for interests stake? | 18:03 |
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| Pali | jonwil, I just asked, because I saw some your emails about RE browserd | 18:04 |
| jonwil | ok | 18:04 |
| jonwil | I did browserd because it was fairly easy and it was the only notable closed-source component in that particular chain. | 18:06 |
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| jonwil | And I did the other stuff because I wanted to make it possible for people to embed the browser widget the same way Nokia does it | 18:07 |
| jonwil | and talk directly to the browser daemon | 18:07 |
| jonwil | instead of needing to pull all of Gecko into their app | 18:08 |
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| jonwil | Anyone here know anything about QT on the N900? | 18:16 |
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| merlin1991 | Pali ping | 19:44 |
| merlin1991 | silly me, he isn't here anymore :D | 19:45 |
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| WereCatf | I am toying around with my N900 and one thing I notice is that all kernels available are at most 2.6.28.. Do the newer kernels lack some essential drivers that would prevent them from working? E.g. would 3.3.0-rc2 not work on N900? | 21:33 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 21:38 |
| WereCatf | Is that "Yes, it would not work" or "Yes, it would"? :D | 21:39 |
| ShadowJK | yes :) | 21:39 |
| ShadowJK | userspace is a problem | 21:39 |
| ShadowJK | In the context of Meego/Mer/Neomobile there's newer kernel | 21:39 |
| WereCatf | I am going to install Gentoo anyways, just for the sake of doing it | 21:39 |
| WereCatf | And I thought to get a modern kernel while at it | 21:40 |
| ShadowJK | but Maemo userspace is kinda locked to 2.6.28 | 21:40 |
| WereCatf | That was kind of short-sighted from Nokia. Then again, they killed Maemo, so.. | 21:42 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | chem|st: 9/ | 21:42 |
| timeless | WereCatf: that's unfair | 21:43 |
| timeless | calling it short-sighted | 21:43 |
| timeless | it's more like 'by-design' | 21:43 |
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| timeless | a device gets certified for a network based on its complete stack (more or less) | 21:43 |
| timeless | changing the kernel could easily leave it w/ an uncertified stack | 21:43 |
| timeless | should nokia have provided a perpetually free certification lab for all future kernels? | 21:44 |
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| timeless | (that's a complete building or payment supply to rent someone else's testing/validation services) | 21:44 |
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| timeless | WereCatf: no modern smart phones are supported for >4 years | 21:46 |
| timeless | you're an Apple user if you get 3 years | 21:46 |
| lofty306 | so how long till i must head either to cssu or another flavor ? | 21:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless: what kinda cert r u talking bout here? | 21:47 |
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| ShadowJK | depends | 21:48 |
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| * ShadowJK is still using stock diablo kernel and OS on N8x0 :P | 21:48 | |
| lofty306 | ok | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | timeless: unlike a@lot of andridiot phones where network/modem and APE kernel share same RAM, on N900 you got a built in USB 3G dongle | 21:49 |
| timeless | DocScrutinizer51: there are things that have to be certified, i didn't get to keep the diagrams, i left nokia :) | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | those 'things' (like abiltiy for 911) apply only for factory state of device | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it's up to the user to deliberately break them with a kernel update | 21:51 |
| lofty306 | :) | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | as long as you can't turn the phone into sth rogue, regarding general public | 21:52 |
| lofty306 | dose the cssu have all the functionality of the stock and far as all chips supported? | 21:54 |
| lofty306 | eeverything workiing? | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | as that'smy domain now ;-) | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | yes | 21:55 |
| lofty306 | kool | 21:56 |
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| lofty306 | i mean like thoes bits that were propriataary and aaall | 21:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | cssu is an update | 21:57 |
| lofty306 | i havent read much on it other than cant go back if i do it so imm just getting all theiinfo i can | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | as the name gives away | 21:58 |
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| lofty306 | k | 21:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | cssu aka maemo1337 | 21:59 |
| lofty306 | thnx DocScrutinizer | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | were you able to go back from maemo13 to 12? | 22:00 |
| lofty306 | ive not been paying attention for a while | 22:00 |
| lofty306 | i geuss i never thought about it b4 | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | you not think about going back from cssu to stock either :) | 22:01 |
| lofty306 | and do you know what pkg the chat feature was a part of so i can deal with the notice that it no longer exists | 22:01 |
| lofty306 | lol | 22:01 |
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| lofty306 | well i just didnt want to go forward to the left and wind up with a papereweight | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ont happen | 22:04 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | wont | 22:05 |
| lofty306 | :))) | 22:05 |
| lofty306 | kool thnx DocScrutinizer | 22:05 |
| lofty306 | you aleviate my fear | 22:05 |
| lofty306 | i just like this soooo much | 22:05 |
| lofty306 | sill | 22:06 |
| lofty306 | still | 22:06 |
| Raimu-X | Yeah, I wouldn't run stock anymore since CSSU is just maemo with things fixed and features added. | 22:08 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | indeed | 22:08 |
| lofty306 | YEAH? | 22:08 |
| Raimu-X | lofty306, it just essentially took over the updating since Nokia obviously wasn't gonna fix everything they left slightly borked. | 22:09 |
| lofty306 | okk | 22:09 |
| lofty306 | so this is what i was waiting for then! | 22:09 |
| lofty306 | get nokia outta the way and things got doone | 22:10 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | as far as we were able | 22:10 |
| lofty306 | so they still holld back some | 22:12 |
| lofty306 | soome of the code | 22:12 |
| lofty306 | ? | 22:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | sure | 22:13 |
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| lofty306 | updates still push the same way ? | 22:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | sure | 22:14 |
| lofty306 | i thinks thats my last q | 22:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | as until you get blue in the face :-D welcome | 22:15 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ask* | 22:15 |
| lofty306 | kool | 22:15 |
| lofty306 | i realy think that is all the cssu i have to install from pc? | 22:17 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | the major pita being the closed PIM+dialer integration, as you can't break out a single block and recode it like moh did with mediaplayer | 22:17 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | lofty306: you don't install cssu from PC | 22:18 |
| lofty306 | u dooont? | 22:18 |
| lofty306 | glad i assked | 22:18 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | no, it's an update! | 22:18 |
| * lofty306 looks | 22:19 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ~cssu | 22:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | eeeew infobot gone again | 22:20 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | bitch | 22:20 |
| lofty306 | lol do i gotta grab it via apt-get or zypper it thats still around? | 22:21 |
| Raimu-X | lofty306: Nu-uh. Browse with your N900 to http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_SSU and click on the CSSU flavour you want to install, it'll happen then. | 22:23 |
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| lofty306 | thats what i read that makes sense | 22:24 |
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| lofty306 | thnx Raimu-X , DocScrutinizer maybe after lunch if theppaainters dont drive me out of here | 22:32 |
| lofty306 | thnx Raimu-X , DocScrutinizer maybe after lunch if the painters dont drive me out of here | 22:32 |
| Raimu-X | Take your time, you know. | 22:32 |
| Raimu-X | Read up on it. | 22:32 |
| Raimu-X | Know the difference between "stable" and "testing" and think about it. | 22:33 |
| lofty306 | i do | 22:34 |
| lofty306 | but will read gotta read | 22:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer | I wholeheartedly recommend CSSU-stable | 22:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer | lofty306: ideally you'll wonder if you succeeded at all to update, after you "installed" CSSU-Stable | 22:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | lofty306: as in stable everything should default to "stock alike" settings, so OOTB the experience on CSSU-S should be almost indistinguishable from stock maemo.1.3.1 | 22:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | until you enable some of the enhancements, via gconftool or cssu-tweaker or whatever the names | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | MHD alone is worth it | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | lofty306: (from http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools, too lazy to write it again :-D ) :: | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # set ctl-BS to my preferred operation mode, ''also for CSSU!!'' | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # As it seems I haven't documented it elsewhere, here are the nifty | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # keypress-sequences. | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # (C=control, B=backspace, Cd=control-press-and-hold, Cu=control-release) | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # Cd,Bd = open taskswitcher; Bu,Bd = roll forward; Cu,Cd = roll-backward | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # Bu,Cu = select upper leftmost / Cu,Bu = keep taskswitcher open | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # with taskswitcher open: | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # "q"|"w"|"e"\"a"|"s"|"f"... select app at that pos | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | # Shift+"q"|"w"... close that app | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | gconftool-2 -s \ | 22:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | /apps/osso/hildon-desktop/key-actions/ctrl_backspace_in_tasknav -t int 5 | 22:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer | . | 22:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.screenshots/joerg900.10092 video | 22:52 |
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| DocScrutinizer | so friigin cool that your iPhone friends will get green of envy | 22:53 |
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| trumee | DocScrutinizer: gconftool-2 -s /apps/osso/hildon-desktop/key-actions/ctrl_backspace_in_tasknav -t int 0 to revert back? | 23:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | err sure | 23:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | or delete the whole key | 23:45 |
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| trumee | DocScrutinizer: how? | 23:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | gconftool --help | 23:46 |
| lofty306 | thn DocScrutinizer i see the paste | 23:48 |
| lofty306 | was doing lunch | 23:48 |
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| lofty306 | nice vid | 23:51 |
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| Macer | video? | 23:57 |
| lofty306 | just the outta focus thing of the task switcher | 23:58 |
| lofty306 | http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools that | 23:58 |
| lofty306 | err... that >> http://share.ovi.com/media/joerg900.screenshots/joerg900.10092 | 23:59 |
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