IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2011-01-25

MohammadAG	I won't send a controller	00:00
*** diegohcg has quit IRC		00:00
alterego	Hah,	00:00
alterego	I'll need to code to get it working then :P	00:00
javispedro	morning	00:01
*** aloisiojr has quit IRC		00:01
*** peregrin has joined #maemo		00:01
OkropNick	does someone know where can I change CPU speed limits in N900? I don't want to overclock, I'd rather to underclock during idle time	00:03
*** NIN101 has quit IRC		00:03
nox-	isnt that already what it does?	00:05
*** baraujo has quit IRC		00:05
ieatlint	yes, it does underclock as much as possible when idle	00:05
nidO	the device already does exactly that	00:05
derf	It also works just like normal Linux.	00:05
derf	See /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/	00:06
OkropNick	yes, but I want limits 125 ~ 600 MHz rather than 250 ~ 600 MHz	00:06
MohammadAG	125 is highly unstable	00:06
nidO	you need the power kernel then	00:06
*** range has quit IRC		00:06
*** range has joined #maemo		00:06
MohammadAG	reduces battery life and such	00:06
nidO	and 125 will almost certainly cause problems	00:06
OkropNick	ok, so I don't want it...	00:06
GAN900	OkropNick, no you don't. ;)	00:08
*** crashanddie has quit IRC		00:08
OkropNick	:)	00:08
GAN900	OkropNick, reading up on the term "Race to Idle" may be instructive as well.	00:08
*** droidbittin has quit IRC		00:09
benno2	any idea why: osso_hw_set_event_cb(m_pOssoContext, &hw_state, onHwEvent, &myvar); triggers my callback onHwEvent() only when the app starts ? when the display goes off or the device is inactive for some time the callback is not called. is this a bug in maemo ?	00:09
alterego	What is this obsession with OCing and UCing :)	00:09
OkropNick	GAN900: I'll check it, thx	00:09
ieatlint	people want it to be faster or have more battery life	00:09
GAN900	alterego, rice it up, baby.	00:09
alterego	Heh	00:09
alterego	more battery: get bigger battery	00:09
ieatlint	the bigger issue is ram though, or so knowledgeable people here insist	00:10
alterego	bbl	00:10
GAN900	I hear if you put a park bench on the boot it'll go faster.	00:10
ieatlint	GAN900: just use paper mache	00:10
ieatlint	it's what i used, and thanks to the excellent drag created by this horribly large wing on the back of the car, i'm not only even more of a douche, but i've reduced my fuel efficiency	00:11
ieatlint	it's awesome	00:11
GAN900	Yes, but now you can't burn rubber in third.	00:12
GAN900	Lame.	00:12
MohammadAG	alterego, remind me which bigger battery works well with the N900?	00:12
MohammadAG	I got my 4th battery today	00:12
ieatlint	i drive a honda civic, it took a lot of effort to burn rubber in third anyway	00:12
GAN900	Hehe	00:13
GAN900	I know the feeling.	00:13
*** nox- has quit IRC		00:13
*** lbt has quit IRC		00:13
GAN900	Friend of mine has an E36 M3 he tuned up. Keeps the spoiler off because he can't burn rubber in 3rd with it on.	00:14
*** onen\|openBmap has quit IRC		00:14
*** nox- has joined #maemo		00:14
ieatlint	i drive a low end manual... i got it for ease of repair, and to freak people out on hills	00:15
ieatlint	it accomplishes both	00:15
* javispedro doesn't drive, he crashes things instead		00:15
makulkar	when I run my app which loads my dll on phone i dont get qDebug()s on terminal	00:15
*** jevin_ has quit IRC		00:16
makulkar	is there something on my device i have to enable to get qDebug() on terminal?	00:17
pupnik	< CasperN> whin i connected my usb cup warmer to the panora, it started to sound wierd	00:17
* MohammadAG wants to start driving		00:18
*** linuxplatform has quit IRC		00:18
javispedro	makulkar: if your app is a libmeegotouch one, you might need to run it with "-output-level debug" as a command line argument	00:18
*** millenomi has quit IRC		00:20
makulkar	javispedro, yes it loads libmeegotouch. does it like creates a debug as file or prints msgs on terminal?	00:20
mikhas	usually prints on terminal	00:20
mikhas	there is also a -log-console param which you might need to add	00:21
makulkar	mikhas, javispedro, nope, giving "$> appname -output-level debug" still doesnt give anything	00:21
mikhas	try -output-level debug -log-console then	00:21
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		00:22
*** BabelO has quit IRC		00:22
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		00:22
makulkar	mikhas, "$> appname -output-level debug -log-console" still the same	00:22
makulkar	mikhas, running as user btw, does it make any difference?	00:22
mikhas	no, shouldnt	00:23
*** me\|kor has quit IRC		00:26
makulkar	mikhas, looks like qml apps suppress logs. Normal qt app shows qDebugs	00:33
*** Ryback_ has quit IRC		00:34
mikhas	you said you were using libmeegotouch apps	00:34
*** messerting has quit IRC		00:35
*** javispedro has quit IRC		00:36
MohammadAG	alterego, portrait keyboard foss'd :	00:38
MohammadAG	)	00:38
mikhas	makulkar, have you tried using warnings instead of debug?	00:38
mikhas	might be some overaggressive error handler filtering ...	00:39
makulkar	mikhas, warnings nope doesnt work	00:39
*** jrocha has quit IRC		00:40
*** trbs has quit IRC		00:40
* mikhas is out of ideas		00:40
*** OkropNick has quit IRC		00:40
benno2	do libosso functions like osso_hw_set_event_cb need that the g_main_loop is running with g_main_loop_run() ?	00:42
*** ToJa92-ubuntu_ has quit IRC		00:46
*** nze` has quit IRC		00:47
alterego	makulkar: invoke app with -output-level debug	00:47
makulkar	alterego, did that. No difference	00:48
makulkar	$>appname -output-level debug	00:48
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		00:48
makulkar	alterego, ^^ is this what you mean?	00:48
alterego	yes	00:49
alterego	Interesting	00:49
alterego	What is the app? Is it a Qt executable?	00:49
makulkar	alterego, yes. but its qml based	00:50
makulkar	alterego, when I run normal qt app, without any option, i see logs	00:50
alterego	Oh, so it's an app that loads a qml file?	00:51
makulkar	its called declarative app.. yes	00:51
*** zap has quit IRC		00:51
*** trem_ has quit IRC		00:51
alterego	Hrm, not sure then, you're probably better off asking in #meego with your odd platform :P	00:51
*** davyg has quit IRC		00:52
makulkar	alterego, hehe.. alright	00:52
*** zap has joined #maemo		00:53
*** florian has quit IRC		00:53
*** piggz has quit IRC		00:54
*** mikhas has quit IRC		00:59
*** b-man has quit IRC		00:59
*** b-man has joined #maemo		01:00
*** Mousey has joined #maemo		01:00
*** GNUton-BNC has quit IRC		01:02
*** johnsq has quit IRC		01:03
*** renatofilho has quit IRC		01:05
*** Suiseiseki has joined #maemo		01:05
*** BabelO has quit IRC		01:08
*** Juozapas has quit IRC		01:08
*** Juozapas has joined #maemo		01:10
*** jonwil has joined #maemo		01:12
*** jacktheripper has quit IRC		01:12
*** habmala has quit IRC		01:15
*** franz_ has joined #maemo		01:15
*** Juozapas has quit IRC		01:17
*** Juozapas has joined #maemo		01:17
*** Wamanuz2 has quit IRC		01:17
*** scoobertron has quit IRC		01:18
*** FireFly has quit IRC		01:18
*** Wamanuz has joined #maemo		01:20
*** wirelessdreamer has quit IRC		01:20
*** rblank has quit IRC		01:24
*** eichi has joined #maemo		01:27
*** eichi has left #maemo		01:27
*** FIQ\|n900 has joined #maemo		01:29
*** perolsen has quit IRC		01:30
*** Diod has quit IRC		01:31
*** edisson has quit IRC		01:32
*** etrunko has quit IRC		01:35
*** toniher has quit IRC		01:37
*** nox- has quit IRC		01:37
*** rcg1 has quit IRC		01:38
*** Carneque has quit IRC		01:39
*** hurbu has joined #maemo		01:42
*** BCMM has quit IRC		01:46
*** mikki-kun has quit IRC		01:46
*** mikki-kun has joined #maemo		01:46
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		01:48
*** BCMM has quit IRC		01:50
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		01:51
*** BCMM has quit IRC		01:51
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		01:52
*** BCMM has quit IRC		01:52
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		01:53
*** PhonicUK has quit IRC		01:54
*** wjt has joined #maemo		01:54
*** mikki-kun has quit IRC		01:56
*** mikki-kun has joined #maemo		01:56
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		01:57
*** BabelO has quit IRC		01:57
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		01:57
*** pH5 has quit IRC		01:57
wjt	any hints as to why my application's icon isn't being picked up by the launcher? it's in /usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/hildon/ and /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/hildon/; it's spelled correctly in my application's .desktop file; if i change the Icon= line in the .desktop file to 'hermes', that icon is picked up. I've cargo-culted running `gtk-update-icon-cache -f /usr/share/icons/hicolor` in postinst (from Hermes): no dice. is there something non-obvious	01:58
*** benno2 has quit IRC		01:58
franz_	tried restarting? :P	01:58
*** Natunen has quit IRC		01:59
wjt	i tried that before, but let's try it again ;-)	01:59
Robot101	wjt: ask marcoil? :)	01:59
wjt	haha	01:59
*** hannesw_ has quit IRC		02:02
wjt	buh. well. restarting helped. which is not really good news :D	02:03
franz_	hildon-desktop is crazy like that	02:04
*** vanadismobile has joined #maemo		02:05
wjt	yeah, but this is unsatisfactory because I don't know what I did right :D	02:05
Proteous	heh	02:05
lcuk	wjt, this bug has been cycled around Maemo for a long time. The Fremantle AF team attempted numerous fixes and every time a new kitten popped out of a hole. congratulations on your new kitten :P http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_udqEp_YR4	02:06
*** BCMM has quit IRC		02:07
MrBawb	wjt: I think the current workaround is to run "touch /usr/share/icons/hicolor" after installing a new icon	02:07
*** BabelO has quit IRC		02:07
MrBawb	or reboot, of course	02:08
wjt	well. let's tidy up all the stuff i've been poking at and feed this package to the autobuilder and come back to this another day :)	02:09
wjt	one Fosdem schedule coming up!	02:09
lcuk	\o/	02:10
*** lardman\|home has quit IRC		02:11
Gh0sty	hmm anyone can help a bit with some python stuff? :/	02:12
Gh0sty	want to put in a python script the following:	02:12
wjt	MrBawb, franz_, lcuk, Robot101: cheers :)	02:13
MohammadAG	lcuk, would've been more fun if those kittens weren't real o_O	02:13
lcuk	MohammadAG, pssh	02:14
*** droidbittin has joined #maemo		02:14
*** droidbittin has quit IRC		02:14
*** droidbittin has joined #maemo		02:14
Gh0sty	gconftool -s -t bool /system/osso/dsm/locks/devicelock_autolock_enabled false	02:14
MohammadAG	lcuk, what? the way I'd be playing that would be animal cruelty	02:14
Gh0sty	but I see there is already a gconf module inside the python script	02:14
Gh0sty	so I was trying this:	02:14
Gh0sty	c = gconf.client_get_default()	02:15
pupnik	no kittens were hurt in filming Whack-a-Kitty, MohammadAG	02:15
Gh0sty	c.set_value('c = gconf.client_get_default()	02:15
Gh0sty	grmz	02:15
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		02:15
Gh0sty	c.set_value('/system/osso/dsm/locks/devicelock_autolock_enabled', false)	02:16
Gh0sty	rather	02:16
*** mitsutaka has joined #maemo		02:16
*** xkr47 has quit IRC		02:16
Gh0sty	but that does not seem to work either :x	02:16
*** xkr47 has joined #maemo		02:16
*** Vanadis_ has joined #maemo		02:16
*** BCMM has quit IRC		02:16
MrBawb	Gh0sty: you probably want to use set_bool instead of set_value	02:17
Gh0sty	aah there is a set_bool :P	02:17
Gh0sty	lemme try	02:17
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		02:17
* alterego contemplates tolerance in Columbus		02:18
* alterego contemplates bed.		02:19
*** Vanadis has quit IRC		02:19
* MohammadAG contemplates stabbing tracker		02:19
MohammadAG	night alterego	02:20
alterego	Hah	02:20
Gh0sty	hmm still no go :x	02:20
Gh0sty	unless it does not know at that point anymore about c ...	02:20
Gh0sty	lets try that :p	02:20
*** kerio has quit IRC		02:21
MrBawb	oh, is it giving you: "NameError: name 'false' is not defined"?	02:21
*** kerio92 has joined #maemo		02:21
MrBawb	I think the python name is "False"	02:22
*** kerio92 is now known as kerio		02:22
MrBawb	>>> c.set_bool("/system/iamarobot",True)	02:22
MrBawb	$ gconftool-2 -g /system/iamarobot	02:22
MrBawb	true	02:22
*** droidbittin has quit IRC		02:24
Gh0sty	no i think rather that my c is not in scope at that particular point	02:24
*** LjL has quit IRC		02:24
MrBawb	ah	02:24
Gh0sty	the c is created long before I want to use it	02:24
Gh0sty	lemme check that	02:25
Gh0sty	and cant execute the script cause its on toggle event :P	02:25
Gh0sty	can just see the result is changed or not ... :P	02:25
Gh0sty	and it does not change for the moment :)	02:25
*** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo		02:26
Gh0sty	grm	02:26
Gh0sty	nope still no go :/	02:26
*** Tsarpf has joined #maemo		02:28
*** setanta has quit IRC		02:29
Gh0sty	MrBawb: http://pastebin.com/7n8sWcHt	02:32
Gh0sty	if you would mind to check my bad code hack perhaps? :/	02:32
Gh0sty	search for '//' where I now added some comments in the paste	02:32
wjt	Gh0sty: right, 'conf_client' isn't in scope there	02:34
wjt	you define a local variable called conf_client in __init__	02:34
wjt	it's only defined there	02:34
Gh0sty	and a self.conf_client? :/	02:34
Gh0sty	or it does not work that way? :P	02:35
wjt	yeah, if you change all references to conf_client to self.conf_client, you should enjoy better luck	02:35
Gh0sty	tried that	02:35
Gh0sty	no luck either	02:35
Gh0sty	can i see somewhere the output of that script?	02:35
wjt	what's the error if you do that	02:35
Gh0sty	there is no messages logs	02:35
Gh0sty	on n900	02:35
wjt	run it in a terminal	02:35
Gh0sty	or where do i find that?	02:35
Gh0sty	well how can i invoke the toggle event? :P	02:36
Gh0sty	its a desktop widget	02:36
wjt	ohhhh	02:36
Gh0sty	or does a desktop widget code get cached somewhere? :/	02:36
Gh0sty	perhaps thats the problem ...	02:36
Gh0sty	not sure ... never worked with gui stuff and barely worked with python :P	02:37
Gh0sty	i am a hardcore bash scripter :P	02:37
Gh0sty	oh or wait	02:38
Gh0sty	i should also change the conf_client in the init	02:38
Gh0sty	to self.conf_client?	02:38
* Gh0sty thinks he understands ...		02:38
wjt	yes, exactly :)	02:38
*** rm_work has quit IRC		02:40
*** blitz00 has quit IRC		02:40
*** BCMM has quit IRC		02:42
Gh0sty	nope	02:42
Gh0sty	still nothing :(	02:42
Gh0sty	damned	02:42
*** Rarok has quit IRC		02:43
*** robox_ has joined #maemo		02:44
*** robox_ has left #maemo		02:45
*** Venemo has quit IRC		02:46
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		02:47
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		02:51
MrBawb	Gh0sty: to grab the output, just wrap it in a shell script	02:52
*** madalu has joined #maemo		02:52
MrBawb	program.orig >/tmp/log 2>&1	02:52
Gh0sty	MrBawb: and how the hell do i add a shellscripts as a DESKTOP widget? :p	02:54
Gh0sty	just rebooting	02:54
Gh0sty	it should work now my idea	02:54
pupnik	there is an application for that	02:54
pupnik	forgot the name	02:55
Gh0sty	think its caching the script or something	02:55
MrBawb	Gh0sty: the program is already registered as a widget, just rename it and have the shellscript execute it	02:55
*** Openfree` has joined #maemo		02:55
Gh0sty	hmm good point! :P	02:55
Gh0sty	see	02:56
Gh0sty	it caches the widget code :P	02:56
Gh0sty	it actually works ... :P	02:56
Gh0sty	a reboot was enough :)	02:56
Gh0sty	I knew it ... :P	02:56
MrBawb	ah	02:56
Gh0sty	now it works	02:57
Gh0sty	well its not exactly the way it should be but as a hack it'll do ...	02:57
Gh0sty	only problem is if I don't turn off my bluetooth myself but for example autodisconnect kills it	02:57
Gh0sty	my device will never lock ...	02:57
Gh0sty	but it's safer then trying to unlock it one handed while driving on the highway ...	02:58
Gh0sty	a small hack for man a giant hack for safety or something :P	02:59
*** BCMM_ has joined #maemo		03:00
Gh0sty	thx MrBawb and wjt you've been a great help ... and now off to bed (its 2am here :x)	03:01
Gh0sty	g'nite	03:01
MrBawb	goodnight	03:02
*** Venemo_N900 has joined #maemo		03:04
*** Plnt_ is now known as Plnt		03:05
wjt	Gh0sty: .o/	03:07
*** Venemo_N900 has quit IRC		03:09
*** zap has quit IRC		03:09
*** kthomas_vh has quit IRC		03:13
*** Mousey has quit IRC		03:23
*** MadViking has quit IRC		03:29
*** Per_n900 has quit IRC		03:38
*** beford has joined #maemo		03:38
*** beford has quit IRC		03:38
*** beford has joined #maemo		03:38
*** mw22 has quit IRC		03:41
Venemo	good evening guys	03:42
*** Venemo has quit IRC		03:43
*** lcuk has quit IRC		03:46
*** felipec has quit IRC		03:52
*** swc\|666 has quit IRC		03:55
*** Termana has joined #maemo		04:05
Termana	good morning	04:06
*** crs has quit IRC		04:06
*** Tsarpf has quit IRC		04:19
*** silanus has joined #maemo		04:27
*** silanus_ has quit IRC		04:28
*** Malin_ has quit IRC		04:31
*** sid_ has joined #maemo		04:35
*** sid_on has quit IRC		04:39
*** manaru has quit IRC		04:39
*** vanadismobile has quit IRC		04:41
*** mardi has quit IRC		04:42
*** vanadismobile has joined #maemo		04:44
*** BCMM_ has quit IRC		04:44
*** robzob has joined #maemo		04:45
*** sid_on has joined #maemo		04:50
*** chx_zzz is now known as chx		04:52
*** swc\|666 has joined #maemo		04:55
*** Termana has quit IRC		05:02
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		05:13
*** BCMM has quit IRC		05:22
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		05:26
*** maybeHere has joined #maemo		05:30
*** maybeArgh has quit IRC		05:33
*** pcfe has quit IRC		05:37
*** pcfe has joined #maemo		05:37
*** pcfe has quit IRC		05:37
*** pcfe has joined #maemo		05:37
*** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo		05:45
*** chx is now known as chx_zzz		05:49
*** kthomas_vh has quit IRC		05:50
*** Termana has joined #maemo		05:51
*** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo		05:56
*** RobbieThe1st has joined #maemo		05:56
*** dockane has quit IRC		06:03
*** kuuntelija has joined #maemo		06:05
*** dockane has joined #maemo		06:06
*** kuuntelija has quit IRC		06:13
*** Natunen has joined #maemo		06:22
*** chx_zzz is now known as chx		06:28
*** NishanthMenon has joined #maemo		06:31
*** trupheenix has joined #maemo		06:34
*** radic has quit IRC		06:36
*** radic_ has joined #maemo		06:36
*** mardi has joined #maemo		06:39
*** maswan has quit IRC		06:39
*** psycho_oreos has quit IRC		06:44
Termana	Jesus christ I'm an idiot. Just took a test for Uni and it asked what CDs were originally made for. I accidentally selected the one that said ANALOG high quality sound rather than DIGITAL high quality sound :\ Still 9/10 isn't bad and luckily it's only 3% of the units grade :p	06:45
*** radec has joined #maemo		06:46
*** pupnik_ has joined #maemo		06:49
*** febb_ has joined #maemo		06:51
*** pupnik has quit IRC		06:52
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		06:54
*** febb_ has quit IRC		06:54
*** maswan has joined #maemo		06:55
*** moshee has quit IRC		06:58
*** moshee has joined #maemo		06:59
* Termana hears the crickets		06:59
*** GNUton-BNC has joined #maemo		06:59
pupnik_	moinin	06:59
*** febb has quit IRC		07:01
*** pupnik_ is now known as pupnik		07:01
*** maswan has quit IRC		07:02
*** maswan has joined #maemo		07:03
*** Termana has quit IRC		07:06
*** madalu has quit IRC		07:08
*** maswan has quit IRC		07:08
*** maswan has joined #maemo		07:10
*** radec has quit IRC		07:10
*** kthomas_vh has quit IRC		07:12
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		07:17
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		07:27
*** DocScrutinizer has quit IRC		07:31
*** DocScrutinizer has joined #maemo		07:31
*** comawhite has quit IRC		07:31
*** _llll_ has quit IRC		07:31
DocScrutinizer	monoin	07:32
*** _llll_ has joined #maemo		07:33
DocScrutinizer	mtd4/initfs/initrd anyone?	07:33
DocScrutinizer	is it really empty and void - and unused?	07:35
DocScrutinizer	HELL - unused????	07:35
DocScrutinizer	and we headdesk where to place uBoot?!?	07:35
*** Termana has joined #maemo		07:36
*** Sicelo has quit IRC		07:36
DocScrutinizer	it's twice the size of mtd0/bootloader	07:36
DocScrutinizer	AM I WRONG?	07:37
*** Necc has joined #maemo		07:38
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		07:39
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: how hard can it be to patch start_of_code of NOLO (much in a virus alike way) to call a subroutine in mtd4, and there (let's call that "uBoot") first check if slide is open (one GPIO to test) and if not, execute the missing 4 bytes code from start of NOLO, then return from subroutine?	07:41
DocScrutinizer	if however slide is open, do not return from subroutine, but rather start up uBoot, with menu and all - fullfeatured as we got plenty of storage, TWICE the size of whole NOLO partition	07:43
DocScrutinizer	that should suffice even for uBoot, with watchdog kicking, proper (local?) env storage, plenty of room for bootmenu config in env, plus battery charging	07:45
DocScrutinizer	darn, we probably even could add memtest-armel :-P	07:46
Termana	DocScrutinizer - Umm, doesn't NOLO not boot if it changed in anyway? It would change NOLO's checksum	07:46
Termana	it's*	07:46
DocScrutinizer	Nope	07:46
*** lbt has joined #maemo		07:46
DocScrutinizer	http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2011-01-15.log.html#t2011-01-15T04:09:40	07:46
DocScrutinizer	NOLO isn't checksummed by current xloader	07:47
DocScrutinizer	hail jacekowski for educating me about that fact	07:49
* DocScrutinizer wonders anyway WhereTF the NAND "partition table" might be - whether this is a mtdparts.h that simply is #include'd to everything that deals with NAND, like flasher, libcal/sysinfo, kernel...		07:51
DocScrutinizer	NOLO, of course :-D	07:52
*** franz_ has quit IRC		07:53
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		07:53
DocScrutinizer	Termana: comments?	07:54
Termana	comments on?	07:54
DocScrutinizer	the whole brainburst above	07:54
Termana	NOLO still has to be correctly signed though right?	07:54
DocScrutinizer	Nope	07:55
DocScrutinizer	http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2011-01-15.log.html#t2011-01-15T04:09:40	07:55
DocScrutinizer	NOLO isn't checksummed by current xloader	07:55
Termana	So you can stick anything into NOLO?	07:55
DocScrutinizer	hail jacekowski for educating me about that fact	07:55
Termana	NOLO's partition rather	07:55
Termana	Like, say u-boot if you made it so it initialised everything properly	07:55
DocScrutinizer	see chanlog link, obviously yes, at least patched NOLO - so probably anything else as well	07:55
DocScrutinizer	Termana: darn, read backscroll, we just need to change first 4 bytes of NOLO	07:56
DocScrutinizer	uBoot is too large for NOLO partition, but it will fit easily into mtd4/initfs	07:57
Termana	Remind me of the practical benefits of this over the current solution again?	07:58
DocScrutinizer	standard untweaked kernel	07:59
DocScrutinizer	lots of space for uBoot	07:59
DocScrutinizer	really simple install and uninstall	07:59
DocScrutinizer	well at least compared to what it's now	08:00
Termana	You forgot one thing though	08:00
Termana	A gazillion whine arses on tmo	08:00
*** Necc has quit IRC		08:00
DocScrutinizer	eh?	08:00
Termana	Nothing :p	08:00
DocScrutinizer	you think we shouldn't make it TOO easy for that gazillion?	08:01
Termana	No, what I'm saying is, it doesn't matter what you do, they'll whine about it	08:02
Termana	and no matter how easy you make it, they will stuff it up	08:02
DocScrutinizer	guess how much I'm concerned	08:02
Termana	My rough guess would be, none.	08:02
Termana	:p	08:02
DocScrutinizer	a bit overoptimistic, but close X-P	08:03
RobbieThe1st	That would be -damn- cool	08:03
DocScrutinizer	Termana: actually I care even less	08:03
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		08:03
Termana	:P	08:03
DocScrutinizer	just one thing bothers me: WHY has _nobody_ seen this before? Am I wrong on initrd/mtd4 being unused?	08:07
RobbieThe1st	I don't think so	08:08
DocScrutinizer	(<Termana> Like, say u-boot if you made it so it initialised everything properly ) that's what I was about to walk gnutoo thru the basics last night, in #openmoko-cdevel	08:09
DocScrutinizer	gnutoo wants to do a 'little' fancy and make uBoot fit for primetime on N900	08:09
SpeedEvil	Haha. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/01/24/apple_10_billionth_customer_prank_call/ 10 billionth customer gets $10K. Of ... non-transferrible itunes gift vouchers.	08:09
DocScrutinizer	FUCKIIIIIIIIIT	08:10
DocScrutinizer	moin SpeedEvil :-D	08:10
*** Termana_ has joined #maemo		08:10
SpeedEvil	Morning.	08:10
Termana_	darn internet	08:10
Termana_	morning SpeedEvil	08:10
*** Termana has quit IRC		08:10
DocScrutinizer	$10k of itunes - enough to overkill every single synapse of my brain	08:10
*** Termana_ is now known as Termana		08:10
*** ludens has quit IRC		08:10
DocScrutinizer	I guess we need to report this threat to Geneva	08:11
*** Cy8aer has joined #maemo		08:12
DocScrutinizer	or even DenHaag	08:12
Termana	Gees I disconnect for 2 seconds from talking about NOLO and the empty initfs partition to reporting threats to Geneva	08:12
*** larsivi has quit IRC		08:12
*** beford has quit IRC		08:13
*** jacktheripper has joined #maemo		08:14
*** philipl has quit IRC		08:14
Termana	DocScrutinizer - I don't think it's that no one has noticed the partition before, it's just we never had a use for it.	08:14
DocScrutinizer	Termana: haha, yeah we're fast	08:14
Termana	Besides the whole /opt thing I suppose	08:14
DocScrutinizer	it's just too small for /opt I guess :-)	08:14
DocScrutinizer	SpeedEvil: please read 60min backscroll	08:15
DocScrutinizer	RFC	08:15
*** razzloss has quit IRC		08:18
*** KMFDM has quit IRC		08:22
*** Natunen has quit IRC		08:24
DocScrutinizer	ERRATUM: in above scenario, do NOT make uBoot check for slide open! Check for sth different rather, like cam-button pressed means "boot to NOLO" (or "U" or "N" pressed on keyboard) - rationale: see <-- "U" key, for flashing with NOLO	08:29
*** razzloss has joined #maemo		08:29
DocScrutinizer	in epic version: We want both NOLO and uBoot to be able to gain control during boot, with open kbd slider. Otherwise we couldn't hold 'U' on bootup, for flashing via NOLO	08:31
DocScrutinizer	probably cam-door is best: open means NOLO, closed means uBoot	08:33
DocScrutinizer	or even better: battery cover removed: NOLO. Boot with battery cover in place: uBoot. Now that pleases my sense of ergonomics	08:34
*** beford has joined #maemo		08:35
DocScrutinizer	as for most foolproof flashing procedure, you will find yourself in front of a device booting without battery cover anyway (start flasher, plug in to PC, insert battery :-D )	08:36
*** hardaker has quit IRC		08:36
DocScrutinizer	nice :-D	08:37
RobbieThe1st	Out of curiosity, why do we even -need- to hold U? it always works for me just to have the flasher ready and plugged in during boot; never had to press U.	08:42
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		08:43
*** MadViking has quit IRC		08:44
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		08:44
SpeedEvil	DocScrutinizer: above sounds fine - parched nolo	08:44
DocScrutinizer	"U" is the emergency brake, when PC is too slow to answer N900 "pings" on USB, so N900 would time out	08:44
DocScrutinizer	hehe, guess what - stskeeps hates it. Just suggested it in #meego-arm	08:45
DocScrutinizer	well, I don't mind	08:45
fellu	From where is best to get better battery for n900 o.o	08:45
SpeedEvil	fellu: Narnia.	08:46
DocScrutinizer	from repos and wiki ;-D	08:46
fellu	How much Mah is max, hmm	08:46
DocScrutinizer	there's some aps that magically improve your battery on simply uninstalling them	08:46
fellu	Yea	08:46
*** CutMeOwnThroat has quit IRC		08:47
*** CutMeOwnThroat has joined #maemo		08:47
DocScrutinizer	well, a flock of ~250 Mah is probably max for one shepherd	08:48
RobbieThe1st	...Why does Stskeeps hate it?	08:48
DocScrutinizer	[2011-01-25 07:17:50] <Stskeeps> you don't see a problem in regular users having their nolo modded and being in a state they can't get out of by simple flashing?	08:49
DocScrutinizer	[2011-01-25 07:18:29] * Stskeeps makes a note to not fly any planes where DocScrutinizer contributed code	08:49
RobbieThe1st	Speaking of which, I've got to ask him about bootmenu-n900; his new version seems to be broken.	08:49
DocScrutinizer	lol	08:50
RobbieThe1st	Y'know, that -is- a point; I'd look at rebuilding nolo so that all the code needed to check for the back cover is in that partition	08:50
RobbieThe1st	That way the "recovery" boot only requires the one partition	08:50
fellu	Hmm	08:51
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: sounds good, yeah	08:51
DocScrutinizer	and it's irrelevant if we change 4 bytes or 200bytes at start of NOLO	08:52
*** beford has quit IRC		08:52
RobbieThe1st	Yea	08:52
DocScrutinizer	well, it's maybe hard to keep NOLO functional at all, with 200bytes missing :-D	08:52
RobbieThe1st	Out of curiosity, what would need to be done to reflash a broken nolo?	08:52
DocScrutinizer	coldflash	08:53
DocScrutinizer	~coldflash	08:53
infobot	i heard coldflash is http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-10-31.log.html#t2010-10-31T23:09:54 and next ~200 posts, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware/Cold_Flashing	08:53
*** Rarok has joined #maemo		08:53
RobbieThe1st	Go for it. That's not hard.	08:53
RobbieThe1st	I see no problem in alpha-testing it.	08:53
RobbieThe1st	Now, if it required a custom serial cable and soldering to the pads under the battery... I'd be slightly worried. Cold-flashing? No.	08:55
DocScrutinizer	I see no problem for meego endusers either - but meh, that's stskeeps	08:55
*** hurbu_ has joined #maemo		08:55
RobbieThe1st	Let me know if/when you get it working. I'd love to test it.	08:56
DocScrutinizer	well, it's for sure not me getting it to work. I'm always only the mentor. It's probably GNUtoo and maybe mrmoku who will implement it	08:56
DocScrutinizer	so odds are you'll see it in SHR-N900 first	08:58
RobbieThe1st	Oh well	08:58
*** hurbu has quit IRC		08:58
DocScrutinizer	it's distro agnostic, so who cares	08:58
*** SpeedEvil has quit IRC		08:58
*** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo		08:59
DocScrutinizer	btw that's another advantage of this concept over what we got now for uBoot-kernel-hybrid	08:59
*** johnx has quit IRC		08:59
DocScrutinizer	plus it won't break SSU nor will it break on a kernel SSU	09:00
DocScrutinizer	and no more conflicts with the deprecated obsolete multiboot \o/	09:01
*** johnx has joined #maemo		09:02
RobbieThe1st	Yay!	09:03
RobbieThe1st	Oh, btw -Thanks for the bme-replacement charge script; I got it working! ^_^	09:04
*** larsivi has joined #maemo		09:08
*** sejo has quit IRC		09:12
*** tekojo has joined #maemo		09:12
*** sejo has joined #maemo		09:12
*** mece has joined #maemo		09:15
*** ab has quit IRC		09:15
*** eMHa_ has quit IRC		09:19
*** ab has joined #maemo		09:19
DocScrutinizer	[2011-01-25 08:17:21] <DocScrutinizer> bad block in initrd uBoot -yes, that's the first killer I heard so far	09:19
DocScrutinizer	[2011-01-25 08:18:11] <DocScrutinizer> check for magic and skip block if not found. Magic = starting 4 bytes of uBoot	09:19
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: yw	09:20
*** ppenz has joined #maemo		09:20
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: hoping for a backup-menu update :-D	09:21
RobbieThe1st	I've got it almost ready. Right now, I'm trying to figure WTF is wrong with bootmenu-1.9	09:21
RobbieThe1st	I've just found out that text2screen is returning "Unable to get screen dimensions, Unable to initialize. Exiting"	09:22
*** Rarok has quit IRC		09:23
*** vanadismobile has quit IRC		09:23
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		09:34
*** reeniginEesreveR has joined #maemo		09:34
*** geaaru has joined #maemo		09:34
reeniginEesreveR	can i connect to two multiple internet connections at once and have separate routing tables for both of them?	09:35
*** valeriusN has quit IRC		09:35
*** tekojo has quit IRC		09:36
*** chx has quit IRC		09:37
*** valeriusN has joined #maemo		09:39
*** zz_comawhite has joined #maemo		09:40
*** mhlavink has joined #maemo		09:41
*** andre900 has quit IRC		09:42
*** hannesw_ has joined #maemo		09:44
*** MadViking has quit IRC		09:46
*** delphi has joined #maemo		09:46
*** delphi is now known as trx2		09:46
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		09:46
*** MadViking has quit IRC		09:47
*** valeriusN has quit IRC		09:47
*** valeriusN has joined #maemo		09:48
*** kwek has joined #maemo		09:48
SpeedEvil	reeniginEesreveR: not with the stock software	09:49
*** OkropNick has joined #maemo		09:49
reeniginEesreveR	can i do it in pretty much the same we i do it on linux?	09:49
reeniginEesreveR	* normal linux	09:50
SpeedEvil	In principle, yes.	09:50
SpeedEvil	In practice, it's awkward.	09:50
SpeedEvil	For example, the wlan network picker will not work, asit's integrated into Internet Connection Daemon (ICD)	09:51
*** vanadis has joined #maemo		09:51
SpeedEvil	And you have to work out how to make most of the stack think it's 'online' - which is another thing ICD does	09:51
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		09:51
reeniginEesreveR	hmmm....	09:52
reeniginEesreveR	is there any network-manager like thing on maemo?	09:52
SpeedEvil	Yes, closed source.	09:52
*** Mozillion has quit IRC		09:52
*** Mozillion has joined #maemo		09:54
*** mairas has joined #maemo		09:54
*** MacDrunk has joined #maemo		09:54
mece	o/	09:54
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		09:56
*** robzob has quit IRC		09:57
*** FauxFaux has quit IRC		09:58
*** tekojo has joined #maemo		09:58
* RST38h yawns		10:00
reeniginEesreveR	SpeedEvil, whats its name?	10:01
*** t0h has quit IRC		10:01
* pupnik puts a hot bubbling cauldron of chicken-feet on the table. Breakfast!		10:02
*** t0h has joined #maemo		10:02
*** amigadave has joined #maemo		10:05
*** bergie has joined #maemo		10:05
*** croppa has quit IRC		10:06
*** dazo_afk is now known as dazo		10:07
*** Wikier has joined #maemo		10:07
*** Rarok has joined #maemo		10:08
RobbieThe1st	Version 0.60 of BackupMenu's been uploaded and is building. You can grab an early copy here: http://robbiethe1st.afraid.org/BackupMenu/backupmenu_0.60-1_all.deb	10:08
*** kuuntelija has joined #maemo		10:09
*** FIQ\|n900 has quit IRC		10:09
*** MadViking has quit IRC		10:11
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		10:12
MohammadAG	morning	10:14
*** MadViking has quit IRC		10:15
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		10:17
*** andrenarchy has joined #maemo		10:17
*** fiferboy has quit IRC		10:18
fellu	VNC client disconnect all the time :S	10:18
*** Per_n900 has joined #maemo		10:18
MohammadAG	I use presence VNC	10:18
MohammadAG	its ui is awesome-ish	10:18
*** fiferboy has joined #maemo		10:19
*** buntfalke has joined #maemo		10:19
*** Natunen has joined #maemo		10:21
*** Rarok has quit IRC		10:22
*** villev has joined #maemo		10:23
*** pupnik has quit IRC		10:24
*** pupnik has joined #maemo		10:24
*** psycho_oreos has joined #maemo		10:25
*** FauxFaux has joined #maemo		10:25
*** nicu has joined #maemo		10:25
*** jrocha has joined #maemo		10:25
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: not very hard	10:26
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: nokia logo would have to go	10:26
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: and possibly all pictures	10:26
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: :-D well that's bearable	10:26
*** FIQ\|n900 has joined #maemo		10:27
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: that would give 16K of space	10:27
jacekowski	in which you can fit pretty much anything	10:27
DocScrutinizer	hmm, why do we need that much space?	10:27
*** jpe_ has joined #maemo		10:27
jacekowski	we don't	10:27
jacekowski	but that's how much pictures take	10:27
jacekowski	you probably need hmm	10:28
*** crashanddie has joined #maemo		10:28
*** calvaris has joined #maemo		10:28
*** toadpole has joined #maemo		10:28
*** hannesw_ is now known as hannesw		10:28
jacekowski	what is in mtd4?	10:28
toadpole	someone help me fix an sd card that's showing wrong size? its a 16 gig showing size as 1.5 gig	10:29
psycho_oreos	maybe its showing you free space?	10:29
toadpole	nope total space	10:29
*** andrenarchy has left #maemo		10:29
psycho_oreos	which program did you use, and did you check it with df -h?	10:29
jacekowski	toadpole: how do you know it's 16G?	10:29
toadpole	it was 16 gig yesterday	10:29
toadpole	i wrote meego on it with windiskimager	10:30
toadpole	then formatted	10:30
toadpole	now it shows size as 1.5 gigs	10:30
jacekowski	hmm	10:30
jacekowski	wipe it	10:30
jacekowski	easiest to do with pc	10:30
toadpole	is wipe in any way different from formatting?	10:30
jacekowski	yes	10:31
flux	toadpole, repartition it? (not sure if windows lets you)	10:31
jacekowski	formats just formats first partition	10:31
jacekowski	and that partition is probably 1.5G now	10:31
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: I thought of changing first ~30bytes to a ""mv r1, startaddr_of_initrd; loop: cmp @r1, MAGIC; jmpz r1; add r1, NANDBLOCKSIZE; jmp loop;	10:31
*** thresh has joined #maemo		10:31
thresh	moo	10:31
*** svillar has joined #maemo		10:31
thresh	any ideas on how or where can I get a chroot for fremantle?	10:31
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: you have to load stuff from nand	10:31
jacekowski	and nand isn't xip	10:31
toadpole	brb, lunch, 10 mins	10:31
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: mtd4 is initrd	10:31
jacekowski	hmm	10:31
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: yep, of course	10:32
thresh	I dont need an abomination that is scratchbox, qemu-arm+binfmt magic are fine for me	10:32
psycho_oreos	thresh, have you looked at something like MADDE?	10:32
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: I wasn't suggesting that's valid assembler code. Just a sketch	10:32
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: so basicaly there would be normal initrd there and after that u-boot?	10:32
DocScrutinizer	there's nothing right now	10:33
jacekowski	there is no initrd?	10:33
thresh	psycho_oreos: yeah, MADDE allows one to launch a full virtual machine, which I don't need as well	10:33
DocScrutinizer	nope	10:33
*** Sicelo has left #maemo		10:33
DocScrutinizer	afaik maemo5 has no initrd	10:33
psycho_oreos	thresh, well apart from those two, I don't know of anything else	10:33
MohammadAG	it's initfs	10:33
DocScrutinizer	whatever	10:33
MohammadAG	and preinit shows "no initfs \o/"	10:34
MohammadAG	so what, it's just empty?	10:34
thresh	psycho_oreos: well yeah I was hoping of some 'debootstrap'-like recipe to have a chroot	10:34
DocScrutinizer	yes, <FF> <FF>	10:34
MohammadAG	It's the same size as the kernel partition	10:34
DocScrutinizer	yes	10:34
DocScrutinizer	pretty huge	10:34
DocScrutinizer	compared to what we got now	10:34
MohammadAG	we can fit pr0^H^H^H u-boot on it!	10:35
*** swc\|666 has quit IRC		10:35
thresh	the best idea I came up yet is to mount qemu image used by MADDE and just copy the files	10:35
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer: i think nolo isn't configured to load initrd at all	10:35
*** vanadis has quit IRC		10:35
DocScrutinizer	we don't want initrd	10:35
MohammadAG	jacekowski, read /sbin/preinit	10:35
DocScrutinizer	we want uBoot in there	10:35
jacekowski	yeah but i mean it won't load anything from mtd4	10:36
MohammadAG	it simply says "no initfs"	10:36
MohammadAG	it should	10:36
MohammadAG	it did for the N8x0 didn't it?	10:36
*** flo_lap has joined #maemo		10:36
*** flo_lap has joined #maemo		10:36
jacekowski	but using nolo functions it can be done in ~300bytes	10:36
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: that's what my "code" above was ment for, to patch NOLO	10:36
DocScrutinizer	meant*	10:36
*** eMHa_ has joined #maemo		10:37
jacekowski	yeah i'm just saying it will be little bit more complicated than that	10:37
jacekowski	but possible	10:37
jacekowski	i've done more complicated code caves	10:38
MohammadAG	but if they planned no initfs	10:38
MohammadAG	why did they partition the NAND to have mtd4?	10:38
jacekowski	how big is initrd?	10:38
jacekowski	ehh	10:38
jacekowski	mtd4*	10:38
jacekowski	and other thing	10:38
MohammadAG	same as kernel fs	10:38
jacekowski	2MB?	10:39
DocScrutinizer	so move the first 4 bytes into picture area of NOLO, replace a jump to some additional code, and in that additional code do a test if there's a valid MAGIC number at start of first block in initfs partition, else jump to next block. Once MAGIC is found, jump to that as it's start of uBoot	10:39
MohammadAG	yeah	10:39
jacekowski	can anybody with linux try something for me?	10:39
MohammadAG	we all have linux	10:39
MohammadAG	most of us anyway	10:39
jacekowski	on pcc	10:39
MohammadAG	my point stands	10:39
DocScrutinizer	jacekowski: err, 4MB?	10:39
MohammadAG	2MB	10:39
johnx	I parsed that as ppc first :)	10:40
johnx	but yeah, what's the question?	10:40
* MohammadAG starts planning to install mohammedia player on mtd4 muhahaha		10:40
MohammadAG	johnx, some of us have a PS3	10:40
MohammadAG	:P	10:40
johnx	MohammadAG, I have a powerbook G4 :)	10:40
MohammadAG	pfft, PS3 owns it	10:41
MohammadAG	:P	10:41
thresh	the problem is, that qemu image doesnt have anything kpartx would try :/	10:41
* johnx pictures MohammadAG sitting around with a PS3 on his lap and a TV on the table at the coffee shop		10:41
MohammadAG	johnx, good times	10:41
RST38h	moo johnx, thresh, Mohammad	10:42
johnx	m00f RST38h	10:42
MohammadAG	moo RST38h	10:42
RST38h	johnx: look at the bright side: he can always warm up his coffee	10:42
DocScrutinizer	waaaaaah, the Vogons are tearing down my house	10:42
thresh	hey RST38h	10:42
DocScrutinizer	hi RST38h	10:42
MohammadAG	RST38h, my laptop does a way better job at that	10:42
RST38h	Doc: Use the laser	10:42
RST38h	Mohammad: Than PS3 even? Hm	10:42
jacekowski	but going back to my linux question	10:42
jacekowski	i want to test something	10:42
MohammadAG	RST38h, 85C!	10:42
jacekowski	but it may require coldflash of nolo	10:43
MohammadAG	dd mtd4?	10:43
jacekowski	and i don't have linux here on my work laptop	10:43
jacekowski	so i want somebody else to try it	10:43
DocScrutinizer	hmm	10:43
jacekowski	DocScrutinizer:	10:43
jacekowski	MohammadAG:	10:43
jacekowski	i'm pointing at you	10:43
RST38h	jacekowski: the answer is "no"	10:43
RST38h	(actually, the full answer has been "shit, no!"	10:43
DocScrutinizer	my brain is bouncing in my head	10:43
psycho_oreos	lol	10:43
toadpole	okay, so disk management shows me 13-odd gb as unallocated space	10:43
jacekowski	RST38h: move away, you're stopping progress	10:43
toadpole	but i can't do anything to it	10:43
*** croppa has joined #maemo		10:44
toadpole	can't delete the one existing partition either	10:44
MohammadAG	This feels like a sci-fi movie or something	10:44
MohammadAG	so jacekowski, what do you want?	10:44
jacekowski	just a sec	10:44
DocScrutinizer	toadpole: umount all vlumes, use cfdisk, profit	10:45
*** lbt has quit IRC		10:45
psycho_oreos	dd ftw ;)	10:45
toadpole	( DocScrutinizer ): how about a windows solution?	10:46
DocScrutinizer	yeah, a nice little dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/mmc count=1 bs=10M	10:46
psycho_oreos	or s/zero/urandom/	10:46
DocScrutinizer	tiaNFC. Windows, what's that?	10:46
DocScrutinizer	toadpole: ^^^	10:46
psycho_oreos	non-existant OS ;)	10:46
johnx	toadpole, loading up windows in a VM, hang on a sec.	10:47
psycho_oreos	rawwrite might do it	10:47
thresh	what's the filesystem of RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2.nand ?	10:47
DocScrutinizer	ubifs?	10:48
toadpole	i guess something on maemo, would be fine too, is that possible?	10:48
DocScrutinizer	you mean the / fs?	10:48
thresh	UBIFS error (pid 24902): ubifs_get_sb: cannot open "/dev/loop3", error -22 bleh :)	10:48
thresh	DocScrutinizer: yeah	10:48
psycho_oreos	there's fdisk on maemo but afaik it looks very much like sfdisk which might be somewhat confusing	10:48
DocScrutinizer	should be ubifs for all I know	10:48
johnx	toadpole, I'd just stick with windows for this and google for: "repartition sd card"	10:48
thresh	i converted that qemu image to RAW, but no idea how to mount it properly	10:48
toadpole	i guess that'll help, i'll look around and may trouble you again if i can't find anything useful	10:49
toadpole	thanks guys	10:49
johnx	good luck	10:49
DocScrutinizer	psycho_oreos: cfdisk ftw	10:49
*** buntfalke has quit IRC		10:49
johnx	cfdisk has been my favorite for approximately forever	10:50
*** MadViking has quit IRC		10:50
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		10:50
psycho_oreos	I personally don't think you can do much with a raw file that's been converted from qemu image. The first fair few lines of the file would be just stuff for qemu, bad idea. The second is the rest of the stuff are pre-compiled for ARM stuff	10:50
psycho_oreos	DocScrutinizer, don't know if that's available for maemo :)	10:50
DocScrutinizer	toadpole: IroN900:/home/user# apt-cache policy cfdisk --> Installed: 2.12r-19 500 http://repository.maemo.org fremantle-1.2/free Packages	10:51
*** dneary has joined #maemo		10:51
psycho_oreos	o.O its there	10:51
*** mk8 has joined #maemo		10:52
thresh	ha WIN	10:52
thresh	launched runtime with qemu, apt-get install rsync	10:53
thresh	rsync -e "ssh -p 6666" root@127.0.0.1:	10:53
thresh	ftw	10:53
*** MadViking has quit IRC		10:53
*** tackat has joined #maemo		10:53
jacekowski	MohammadAG: http://maemo.jacekowski.org/binary/nolo/mod_nolo.bin	10:54
jacekowski	MohammadAG: flash that into your phone	10:54
jacekowski	MohammadAG: it's just modified to force nolo prompt to appear	10:54
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		10:55
MohammadAG	jacekowski, chances of a brick?	10:56
MohammadAG	even if recoverable	10:56
johnx	then it's not a brick	10:56
MohammadAG	indeed	10:57
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: your backup-menu is painfully missing a "boot to linux" option, effectively a way to normally boot with kbd open	10:57
RobbieThe1st	I suppose, but I intend to let the underlying loader(boomenu-n900 in this case) handle that	10:58
RobbieThe1st	Unfortunately, bootmenu-1.8 didn't really support booting into Maemo(the option just crashed the system)	10:59
RobbieThe1st	and this new version... I can't get it to display -any- menu.	10:59
DocScrutinizer	ooh	10:59
RST38h	What color do you want your brick to be?	10:59
DocScrutinizer	time for 12648430	11:00
johnx	RST38h, you can have any color you want as long as it's black :D	11:00
*** buntfalke has joined #maemo		11:01
RobbieThe1st	Also, FYI - You can try making it work yourself: Just edit /etc/bootmenu.d/backupmenu.item appropriately, and launch the file refrenced inside	11:01
RST38h	johnx: Xboxes are red, I have heard	11:02
johnx	you said 'brick,' not 'boat anchor'	11:03
jacekowski	MohammadAG: yes, that's why i'm asking if you can coldflash	11:03
MohammadAG	jacekowski, flashed, no problems	11:04
MohammadAG	device booted	11:04
MohammadAG	it's an x-loader image right?	11:05
jacekowski	nope	11:06
jacekowski	nolo image	11:06
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		11:06
*** villev has quit IRC		11:06
*** millenomi has joined #maemo		11:07
*** TheJ has joined #maemo		11:07
MohammadAG	jacekowski, no I meant I should flash it with -x right?	11:07
jacekowski	MohammadAG: no	11:07
jacekowski	let me check	11:07
MohammadAG	uh	11:07
jacekowski	flasher-3.5 -f --flash-only=nolo -s mod_nolo.bin -x xloader.bin-RX-51:2101,2102,2103	11:09
*** TheJ has quit IRC		11:11
*** flo_lap has quit IRC		11:11
MohammadAG	jacekowski, NOLO's on screen atm	11:11
MohammadAG	I'm guessing it "worked"?	11:11
*** otep has quit IRC		11:12
Jaffa	Monrning, all	11:12
jacekowski	hmm, anything happens if you push some buttons	11:12
jacekowski	on keyboard	11:12
jacekowski	try typing boot	11:14
jacekowski	MohammadAG: are you still there or it has exploded?	11:14
MohammadAG	nothing shows up jacekowski	11:14
*** TheJ has joined #maemo		11:14
jacekowski	hmm, so it's probably serial only	11:15
MohammadAG	emergency charging	11:15
MohammadAG	but the battery's full...	11:15
jacekowski	you can flash it back to normal nolo	11:15
*** TheJ has quit IRC		11:15
jacekowski	i'm not sure if normal flash mode will work or you have to coldflash it	11:16
*** otep has joined #maemo		11:17
MohammadAG	nope	11:17
MohammadAG	normal flashing doesn't work	11:17
jacekowski	then coldflash	11:18
MohammadAG	it doesn't seem to want to...	11:18
jacekowski	how are you doing it?	11:19
jacekowski	~coldflash	11:19
infobot	coldflash is, like, http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog/%23maemo.2010-10-31.log.html#t2010-10-31T23:09:54 and next ~200 posts, or http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware/Cold_Flashing	11:19
MohammadAG	done	11:19
jacekowski	ok	11:19
jacekowski	hmm, i'll have to try it on mine when i get back home	11:20
MohammadAG	can't windows cold flash?	11:20
MohammadAG	or is enumeration too slow?	11:20
*** tekojo has quit IRC		11:20
jacekowski	enumeration is too slow	11:21
*** hrw has joined #maemo		11:22
*** reeniginEesreveR has quit IRC		11:23
*** stef_204 has joined #maemo		11:25
*** stef_204 has joined #maemo		11:25
*** avs has joined #maemo		11:25
*** stef_204 has joined #maemo		11:26
*** tekojo has joined #maemo		11:26
*** stef_204 has quit IRC		11:26
*** stef_204 has joined #maemo		11:26
jacekowski	MohammadAG: yeah, that was supposed to give nolo prompt	11:28
jacekowski	but ihas hoping for on screen prompt	11:28
jacekowski	but it looks like serial prompt	11:28
stef_204	My OS is version V 20.2010.36-2, RX 51, Nokia N900. Is the the latest available? Sorry but I am unable to see which is current version on maemo.org	11:29
jacekowski	hmm, i don't think so	11:29
jacekowski	check	11:29
psycho_oreos	it is	11:29
jacekowski	http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_N900.php	11:29
stef_204	jacekowski: is that link for me?	11:30
jacekowski	yes	11:30
*** arno0ob has joined #maemo		11:31
stef_204	jacekowski: so my OS version is not latest one then?	11:31
jacekowski	i'm not sure	11:31
jacekowski	if you look at that website you can check	11:31
stef_204	ok, lemme check	11:31
jacekowski	i don't remember these numbers	11:31
jacekowski	but psycho_oreos said that it is latest	11:31
psycho_oreos	its PR1.3	11:31
johnx	stef_204, the date in the version number is when that build went into testing, not when it was released to the public	11:31
stef_204	oh, OK, wasn't sure psycho_oreos was replying to me or not.	11:32
psycho_oreos	stef_204, I was :)	11:32
stef_204	psycho_oreos: tx! well if I have the latest, no need to update...	11:32
*** jhb has joined #maemo		11:32
jacekowski	you can always flash it	11:33
stef_204	ok tx guys	11:35
*** msanchez has joined #maemo		11:36
*** MadViking has quit IRC		11:37
*** retro\|cz has joined #maemo		11:40
*** _berto_ has joined #maemo		11:40
*** GNUtoo\|laptop has joined #maemo		11:41
GNUtoo\|laptop	hi jacekowski DocScrutinizer51	11:41
*** amigadave has quit IRC		11:42
DocScrutinizer	hi GNUtoo\|laptop	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	I saw you discussed about porting u-boot	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	in this channel	11:42
DocScrutinizer	yes	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	isn't uboot too big?	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	and too hard?	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	compared to barebox/uboot_v2?	11:42
DocScrutinizer	you seen the chanlog of #openmoko-cdevel and here?	11:42
GNUtoo\|laptop	only here, and part of it, because the logs are long	11:43
*** norayr has quit IRC		11:43
GNUtoo\|laptop	did someone say something important on that mather when I was away in #openmoko-cdevel?	11:43
DocScrutinizer	GNUtoo\|laptop: I don't have any particular notion about uBoot vs alternatives - as long as it's a full featured bootloader that supports config and menu	11:44
*** MacDrunk has quit IRC		11:44
GNUtoo\|laptop	I think the only usable alternatives are uboot or ubootV2	11:44
DocScrutinizer	GNUtoo\|laptop: well, my suggestion was to use mtd4/initfs partition	11:44
*** florian_kc has joined #maemo		11:45
*** florian_kc has quit IRC		11:45
*** florian_kc has joined #maemo		11:45
DocScrutinizer	it's _huge_ and unused	11:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	there is also an mtdlog partition	11:45
*** AD-N770 has joined #maemo		11:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	basically I tried that:	11:45
DocScrutinizer	and getting rid of this uBoot-kernel-hybrid has a lot of benefits	11:45
MohammadAG	uBoot2?	11:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	http://barebox.org/	11:46
*** florian_kc is now known as florian		11:46
DocScrutinizer	GNUtoo\|laptop: log partition is a bad idea. It's actually a partition that gets frequently written to, in normal operation	11:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	it seem a lot easier to work with	11:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:46
fellu	hmh	11:47
MohammadAG	mtd4 is ideal	11:47
fellu	cannot connect to my vnc server on n900 ;I	11:47
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:47
DocScrutinizer	mtd2 is a log of console, when OOPS or PANIC	11:47
fellu	x11vnc	11:47
GNUtoo\|laptop	anyway I can't even coldboot uboot.bin or barebox.bin	11:47
DocScrutinizer	mtd4 is unused	11:47
fellu	where I can find log about vnc server on n900?	11:47
MohammadAG	or we could always make mtd5 smaller :P	11:47
MohammadAG	jk	11:47
GNUtoo\|laptop	also there is a risk of bricking	11:47
GNUtoo\|laptop	for instance if the battery is too low	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	and that it discharge completely	11:48
MohammadAG	that's not a brick	11:48
MohammadAG	just charge it up	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	how?	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	if the bootloader is not ther	11:48
MohammadAG	externally	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:48
MohammadAG	it doesn't qualify as a brick	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:48
kerio	MohammadAG: not everyone has 8 batteries and an external charger like you	11:48
GNUtoo\|laptop	anyway I've an openmoko battery so it should be ok	11:48
MohammadAG	kerio, any 3 pin battery that fits works	11:49
MohammadAG	i charge one of my N900 batteries in an N95	11:49
MohammadAG	it's longer, but the 3 pins reach the contacts	11:49
MohammadAG	and it seems the N95 isn't hardcoded for its own battery	11:50
psycho_oreos	wtf? now that's interesting	11:50
GNUtoo\|laptop	http://pastebin.com/pe4LS2bC	11:50
MohammadAG	yeah, proves that bme is retarded	11:50
DocScrutinizer	no matter, if bootloader would really charge on its own, that's a good thing anyway	11:51
jacekowski	bme can charge differen batteries iirc	11:51
GNUtoo\|laptop	so I've to flash?	11:51
DocScrutinizer	bme actually doesn't care and charges almost everything, at least on N900	11:51
MohammadAG	jacekowski, but the meter's fucked	11:51
MohammadAG	ask ShadowJK, his mugen shows full till depleted	11:52
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: that's more serious	11:52
jacekowski	MohammadAG: because meter has to be calibrated to specific battery	11:52
jacekowski	MohammadAG: and it looks like bme learns battery capacity	11:52
jacekowski	MohammadAG: and it's stored in cal	11:52
MohammadAG	jacekowski, it works fine on an N95	11:52
*** merlin1991 has joined #maemo		11:53
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: what is in barebox.bin?	11:53
GNUtoo\|laptop	jacekowski, something like uboot.bin	11:54
GNUtoo\|laptop	only that's it's barebox = ubootv2 rather than uboot	11:54
GNUtoo\|laptop	and it's small	11:54
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: you're doing it wrong	11:54
GNUtoo\|laptop	smaller than uboot	11:54
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:54
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: first, don't use coldflash	11:54
jacekowski	2nd	11:55
*** achipa has joined #maemo		11:55
jacekowski	flasher-3.5 -f --flash-only=nolo -s barebox.bin -x xloader.bin-RX-51:2101,2102,2103	11:55
jacekowski	using normal flashing procedure	11:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:55
jacekowski	coldflash is only to boot phone with nokia nolo	11:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	so I can't coldflash my own code?	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:56
jacekowski	no	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	I also tried with pusb but failed	11:56
jacekowski	all that coldflash is doing is booting phone over usb	11:56
jacekowski	it's not flashing it	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	I know	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	that's what I want	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	for now	11:56
jacekowski	well, then you just do it that way	11:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	so I could port some sort of bootloader without risk	11:56
jacekowski	well then that's ok	11:57
jacekowski	that command you're using	11:57
*** toadpole has quit IRC		11:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	11:57
jacekowski	and it just shows that your bl isn't behaving like normal nolo would	11:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	so the bootloader somehow runs?	11:57
DocScrutinizer	that would be boring if it worked on first take	11:58
DocScrutinizer	:-)	11:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	somehow....	11:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	I mean that it jumps to bootloader	11:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	and then it has issue in bootloader's code	11:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	or isn't the barebox.bin even executed or sent	11:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	s/sent/sent completely/	11:59
infobot	GNUtoo\|laptop meant: or isn't the barebox.bin even executed or sent completely	11:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	as I've not the code of flasher I can't verify what it's doing	12:00
*** FireFly has joined #maemo		12:00
MohammadAG	why not flash it?	12:00
GNUtoo\|laptop	maybe I should try to replace flasher's coldboot feature with pusb	12:00
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		12:00
MohammadAG	you can coldflash back to Nokia's loader	12:00
GNUtoo\|laptop	if I've enough battery, yes	12:00
crashanddie	back in a few seconds	12:00
*** crashanddie has left #maemo		12:01
*** achipa has quit IRC		12:01
*** crashanddie has joined #maemo		12:01
MohammadAG	then charge up, flash, test, flash back	12:01
GNUtoo\|laptop	indeed so I'll wait for the battery to charge enough	12:02
GNUtoo\|laptop	because for now I've less than 10%	12:02
MohammadAG	ah	12:02
GNUtoo\|laptop	or nearly 10%	12:02
DocScrutinizer	there's quite some tests that won't do proper flashing when battery is low	12:03
DocScrutinizer	I.E. NOLO refuses to enter flashing mode when bat voltage too low	12:03
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	12:03
DocScrutinizer	GNUtoo\|laptop: when you are experimenting with elementary things like rootfs and BL, then I suggest you get a second battery and keep that charged, for recovery purposes	12:05
Termana	DocScrutinizer - while we're editing NOLO, seems like a good time to implement your "press keyboard button and NOLO will start charging" solution :p	12:05
GNUtoo\|laptop	I just wondered about that, when you buy a battery, is it already charged?	12:06
DocScrutinizer	Termana: that will go to uBoot. It's simply too much hacking to implement it to NOLO	12:06
pupnik	do people use 'booting over USB' to test new kernels and system images?	12:06
DocScrutinizer	GNUtoo\|laptop: usually not 100%	12:06
GNUtoo\|laptop	yes but it could manage to boot right?	12:07
*** amigadave has joined #maemo		12:07
DocScrutinizer	should	12:07
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	12:07
GNUtoo\|laptop	the openmoko battery doesn't seem to fit anyway	12:07
DocScrutinizer	otherwise odds are it got deep discharged and is DOA	12:07
GNUtoo\|laptop	what's the best thing to do:	12:07
GNUtoo\|laptop	*buy the battery before it happens	12:08
GNUtoo\|laptop	or:	12:08
DocScrutinizer	yes	12:08
GNUtoo\|laptop	*buy the battery when it has just happened	12:08
DocScrutinizer	nope, buy now and charge	12:08
DocScrutinizer	recharge every 3 months	12:08
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	12:08
DocScrutinizer	store in a cool place	12:09
*** villev has joined #maemo		12:09
DocScrutinizer	not in freezer though	12:09
psycho_oreos	heh	12:09
*** Aranel has joined #maemo		12:10
psycho_oreos	more like store in a cool, dry place	12:10
MohammadAG	cool oven then?	12:10
RobbieThe1st	<_< Y'know, provided you keep it inside a baggie, a freezer is fine. I left a Nokia spare battery that was fully charged in the freezer for over 6 months, then outside in the shop for at least a year... It got down to -10F there.	12:11
psycho_oreos	humm what about placing it in an airtight bag and then placing that into the fridge :D	12:11
RobbieThe1st	I just found it again, stuck it in a phone, booted it... it was >8-%	12:11
RobbieThe1st	*8	12:11
RobbieThe1st	*80	12:11
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	12:11
MohammadAG	lol	12:11
RobbieThe1st	And it charged fully again. It did surprise me somewhat	12:11
*** mw22 has joined #maemo		12:12
*** Talus_Laptop has joined #maemo		12:15
*** zap has joined #maemo		12:19
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		12:19
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		12:22
DocScrutinizer	rumour has it that LiIon doesn't like freezing	12:24
Venemo	good morning	12:25
DocScrutinizer	and normal fridge is just fine and completely sufficient, you should pack it in a sealed bag though, preferably with a small bag of dryer	12:25
psycho_oreos	I win :P	12:26
psycho_oreos	I guess its one of those same techniques as dealing with recovering data from dying hard drives	12:26
RobbieThe1st	AFAIK, Lion simply doesn't react at lower temps; the colder you keep it, the less capacity/charge you lose. Down to the point at which it actually freezes.	12:32
*** sar3th\|away is now known as sar3th		12:32
*** tekojo has quit IRC		12:33
Venemo	MohammadAG: ping	12:38
MohammadAG	pong	12:38
*** murrayc has joined #maemo		12:41
jacekowski	RobbieThe1st: nope	12:42
RobbieThe1st	?	12:42
jacekowski	RobbieThe1st: freezing batteries kill them	12:43
jacekowski	RobbieThe1st: that's why winter kills batteries	12:44
jacekowski	we service pedestrian counters for some company	12:44
jacekowski	and after every single winter we have to replace all battery packs	12:44
kerio	methinks adding some sealing would help	12:44
RobbieThe1st	Around here, with temps going down to -10F, we haven't had any trouble. This includes lead-acid car batteries(Yes, the water can freeze if it's not acid enough, I suppose), lithium-ion phone batteries, and, of course, Alkaline primary cells (which shouldn't freeze at these temps	12:46
RobbieThe1st	Now, I don't dispute that batteries can freeze... but it's all the temps	12:46
jacekowski	i think your definition of cold is different to mine	12:47
RobbieThe1st	And - provided it's not being used - Below freezing, in the 10f to -10f range for a few weeks doesn't seem to hurt	12:47
kerio	for me cold is 16C° or lower	12:47
kerio	:3	12:47
jacekowski	RobbieThe1st: use SI units	12:47
RobbieThe1st	I don't know em well.	12:48
jacekowski	0 freezing	12:48
RobbieThe1st	32F = freezing. But I'm not exactly sure what -10f is. etc.	12:48
RobbieThe1st	Sure, I could look it up, but meh.	12:48
kerio	-23	12:49
kerio	HOLY FUCK	12:49
DocScrutinizer	yeah exactly, meh	12:49
thresh	-23 is ok	12:49
thresh	celsius	12:49
RobbieThe1st	And I'm saying I have a number of batteries(of several types), which have been at that temperature for quite a while without issue.	12:49
thresh	-30 way way worse	12:49
kerio	where the fuck do you all guys live? D:	12:50
kerio	without heating i'm at 19.5°C at the moment	12:50
DocScrutinizer	there for sure is a reason for LiIon manufs to forbid charging and even discharging at high rate LiIon @ < -20°C	12:50
RobbieThe1st	NE Washington, USA	12:50
MohammadAG	I envy you all	12:50
thresh	Moscow	12:50
MohammadAG	I want subzero temps too	12:50
kerio	rome, italy :3	12:50
RobbieThe1st	Doc: I don't disagree there. Storage on the other hand...	12:50
zutesmog	0°C is cold for me ;-) Two weeks ago it was 44°C and 46°C where I am ;-)	12:50
MohammadAG	mother nature's racist	12:50
* thresh wants his +25 all year long		12:51
*** Openfree` has quit IRC		12:52
jacekowski	RobbieThe1st: so where does water boil on your scale?	12:52
jacekowski	100C on mine	12:52
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: read manuf's datasheet, about allowable and recommended storing temperature. And esp about storage time and temeprature for which they guarantee cell will survive	12:52
RobbieThe1st	200-something.	12:52
BCMM	Fahrenheit is amazing in several ways	12:52
jacekowski	si is so much better	12:52
jacekowski	0 and 100	12:53
jacekowski	kelvin is nice as well	12:53
*** leandrosansilva has joined #maemo		12:53
MohammadAG	F is stupid	12:53
jacekowski	because 0K means 0	12:53
jacekowski	as in you can't go any lower	12:53
BCMM	firstly, IIRC it's calibrated so that 0-100 covers somebody's idea of what sensible outdoors temperatures are possible	12:53
RobbieThe1st	Whatever; I know F for personal temperature. I know C - barely - in the 35-40 range	12:53
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		12:53
BCMM	secondly, it's nonlinear.	12:53
MohammadAG	jacekowski, you can, just reinvent physics	12:53
BCMM	it is a nonlinear temperature scale...	12:53
DocScrutinizer	BCMM: BS	12:54
RobbieThe1st	DocScrutinizer: I assume it's made by Samsung, but I've no clue where to find a datasheet	12:54
BCMM	DocScrutinizer: at what?	12:54
DocScrutinizer	at "nonlinear"	12:54
BCMM	huh, i may be wrong about that	12:55
BCMM	is there another temperature scale people used to use?	12:55
DocScrutinizer	none of the conversation algorithms I used or seen so far had any nonlinear component for Fahrenheit	12:55
jonwil	I prefer Celcius	12:56
Venemo	BCMM: fahrenheit is linear, it's just weird	12:56
trx2	celsius ftw	12:56
Venemo	yes, celsius is sensible	12:56
BCMM	Celsius is a nice compromise between everyday practicality and scientific usefulness	12:57
BCMM	(in that it is SI for temperature-difference calculations)	12:57
alterego	celcius isn't that sensible, they set 0 to the temperature that some liquid solidifies at sea level ll	12:57
jacekowski	to be hones even kelvin is better for everyday use	12:57
BCMM	also, having a very clear idea of when your driveway will be icy is useful	12:58
jacekowski	alterego: the most common liquid on planet	12:58
trx2	kelvin isnt for everyday use, when do you use apsolute zero ?	12:58
alterego	jacekowski: sure, it's just not a "universal" scale though	12:58
*** Openfree` has joined #maemo		12:58
alterego	Kelvin is more, well, "scientific"	12:58
BCMM	yeah, there are actually a fair number of people who live at sufficient altitude that boiling water is substantially cooler than 100C	12:59
alterego	I don't even know where fahr comes from :)	12:59
zutesmog	water freezing and water boiling are good every day comparisons that people can relate too. Kelvin isn't as helpful for everyday use.	12:59
jacekowski	well, at 8000m it goes down to under 90C	12:59
trx2	well then count from -172	13:00
zutesmog	even so 90°C is still in a reasonable range from 0°C	13:00
SpeedEvil	alterego: It's the lowest temperature you can get my mixing ice and salt at 0F, with 100F being the temperature of a dogs arse.	13:00
trx2	doesnt matter..	13:00
jacekowski	zutesmog: 273k for 0C and 373k for 100C	13:00
BCMM	if i recall correctly, freezing point doesn't move so dramatically	13:00
alterego	SpeedEvil: :D	13:00
trx2	SpeedEvil lol	13:00
zutesmog	but people can remember 0 and 100 far more easily	13:00
MohammadAG	K is C+273	13:00
jacekowski	zutesmog: same unit as c just different offset	13:00
BCMM	SpeedEvil: is that literally true? i know 100F is well-known as an attainable but unhealthy internal temperature.	13:00
zutesmog	I know, but explain it to my dad or my wife ;-)	13:01
alterego	celcius is just more "metric" ..	13:01
SpeedEvil	BCMM: I vaguely remember it is. Google does in fact say 100Fish is the body temp of dogs	13:01
*** trx2 has quit IRC		13:01
alterego	I have to say though, this is probably the most boring conversation I've had to wake up to.	13:02
*** lupine_85 has quit IRC		13:02
MohammadAG	you can start with your kids zutesmog	13:02
BCMM	SpeedEvil: that's amazing. i'm creating a competitor to SI, featuring more dogs-arse related measurements	13:02
MohammadAG	so in three generations, they'll be using K	13:02
zutesmog	I have and they will pull me up on everything.	13:02
* alterego thinks it'll be one of those days. even tmo looks boring		13:02
BCMM	the unit of length will be the average distance between a greyhound's arse and the ground	13:02
MohammadAG	of course, in three generations they'll find a way to go lower than 0K, and we'll be idiots	13:02
alterego	BCMM: horse actually :D	13:03
BCMM	alterego: which?	13:03
zutesmog	but then you will have popped into an alternate universe.	13:03
alterego	MohammadAG: scientifically impossible, it's absolute vacuum.	13:03
MohammadAG	alterego, they'll find a way around that :P	13:03
alterego	BCMM: imperial units of length, some came from measuring horses.	13:03
MohammadAG	(And I know my physics, but do you know your sarcasm?)	13:03
BCMM	alterego: absolute vacuum?	13:04
*** lupine_85 has joined #maemo		13:04
MohammadAG	at 0K atoms can't move	13:04
BCMM	alterego: did they? i know imperial units of power did	13:04
alterego	BCMM: yeah, hands or something	13:04
alterego	I think a furlong too ..	13:04
BCMM	alterego: definition of a "horsepower" is something like 150% of the power provided by a mine-pony	13:04
*** ptlo has joined #maemo		13:04
MohammadAG	Ponies!	13:04
alterego	Yeah, hp was invented by a marketting firm trying to sell cars over horses :)	13:05
BCMM	alterego: (as determined by G.P.E.=mgh and looking at the loads they carry up from the mine)	13:05
zutesmog	should have been pony power!	13:05
BCMM	* a totally invented factor for how much more power a horse has	13:05
MohammadAG	zutesmog, that's the power provided by a unicorn	13:05
alterego	BCMM: really? I just thoyught the arranged a tug-of-war between cars and horses	13:05
zutesmog	or a sparkly pony with fairy wings	13:06
BCMM	(i don't mean definition, btw - i mean original measurements it's based on)	13:06
SpeedEvil	alterego: Actually, no.	13:07
SpeedEvil	alterego: It was developed by stationary steam engine makers. Way before cars.	13:07
*** thresh has left #maemo		13:07
* SpeedEvil hits alterego with a walking beam.		13:07
*** achipa has joined #maemo		13:07
*** achipa has joined #maemo		13:07
alterego	SpeedEvil: yeah, I actually had a feeling it was steam power that bought the measurement in.	13:08
* alterego contemplates how he can get join tables to work with QSqlTableModel's		13:08
MohammadAG	alterego, paypal?	13:09
*** WellMux_ has joined #maemo		13:09
alterego	MohammadAG: what?	13:09
alterego	MohammadAG: still have 0 donations :)	13:09
MohammadAG	for the paypal app?	13:09
alterego	MohammadAG: no, columbus.	13:10
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/battery/PACK950925.pdf p62 cell spec, p64 >>(4) Long term storage	13:11
DocScrutinizer	: -20 ～ +35℃ within 90 days (Shipped conditions)<< p65 >>6 Operating Temperature (Charge) 0～+45 ℃<< >>2 Operating Temperature (Discharge) -20～+60 ℃<< Also see p69 (1) storage. >>... Storage in unsuitable condition (temperature, humidity, etc.) may reduce initial performance ...<<	13:11
alterego	I'm not sure our paypal app is going to be secure enough to warrant making it :/	13:11
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: it's for sure no good idea to store a battery at limits of allowable storing conditions and far outside of allowable operation conditions	13:12
*** Diod has joined #maemo		13:12
cos^	is there something wrong with vcs.maemo.org's certificates? try git clone https://vcs.maemo.org/git/mardrone	13:12
cos^	at least i get error: server certificate verification failed. CAfile: /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt CRLfile: none while accessing https://vcs.maemo.org/git/mardrone/info/refs	13:13
MohammadAG	alterego, keep in mind the community isn't smart enough to change paypal addresses	13:13
MohammadAG	And the part of it which is, would only do it as a PoC	13:13
DocScrutinizer	also very remarkable: >>Do not storage the battery as fully charge state.<<	13:13
RobbieThe1st	So, it's rated for -20C. This further proves my point that storing it in a residential freezer(inside a bag) is safe	13:13
SpeedEvil	Speaking personally - I strore all my li-ions in the freezer.	13:14
alterego	MohammadAG: It's something that needs to be properly thought out, and DocScrutinizer ripped the idea appart yesterdat :)	13:14
RobbieThe1st	Admittedly, what happened to one of mine(leaving it at -25C, outside) wasn't optimal... but it still worked. Which is good.	13:14
SpeedEvil	They have very, very little (measured) degradation when I do this.	13:14
MohammadAG	alterego, just make it closed source	13:15
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: BS, see my comment last posts	13:15
MohammadAG	encrypt the binary	13:15
RobbieThe1st	0C is at the limits of storable condition?	13:15
MohammadAG	then load it through another encrypted binary	13:15
RobbieThe1st	I thought it was about the middle...	13:16
alterego	MohammadAG: that's a possibility, but nothing is fool proof.	13:16
SpeedEvil	RobbieThe1st: that's at the liits for charging.	13:16
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: it's "rated" for 90days @ -20°C, where the damage done to cell is 'only' some 20%	13:16
*** merlin1991 has quit IRC		13:16
MohammadAG	alterego, then how does the paypal app on the iPhone work?	13:16
RobbieThe1st	SpeedEvil: According to the PDF, it's -20c for long-term storage	13:16
*** merlin1991 has joined #maemo		13:17
RobbieThe1st	DocScrutinizer: Real-world tests say different.	13:17
DocScrutinizer	uhuh	13:17
kerio	i want a battery that works at 0K	13:17
SpeedEvil	I actually do want a rechargable battery that is safe for 140C.	13:18
MohammadAG	kerio, here, have mine	13:18
RobbieThe1st	I think leaving a battery for over a year and still having quite a bit of charge left over is good enough.	13:18
BCMM	chemistry doesn't work at 0K.	13:18
BCMM	(no collisions == reactions basically do no occur)	13:18
*** moshee has quit IRC		13:18
kerio	MohammadAG: yay	13:19
*** moshee has joined #maemo		13:19
*** moshee has joined #maemo		13:19
kerio	is it safe at 15000K too?	13:19
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: sure - go ahead. Store your cells at abs min temp allowed for 90 days. Drive always at exact abs max alcohol level allowed. always smoke exactly the number of cigarettes that statistically shorten your live no more than 10 years	13:19
alterego	MohammadAG: I'll spend some time on it this weekend :)	13:20
MohammadAG	kerio, yeah sure	13:20
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: WTF?? ""aving quite a bit of charge left over is good enough"" ?	13:20
GNUtoo\|laptop	http://pastebin.com/2vhb9uF8	13:20
MohammadAG	alterego, :)	13:20
RobbieThe1st	DocScrutinizer: Do you have any proof that storing it at 40F is less dangerous than 32F?	13:20
kerio	MohammadAG: is it infinite?	13:20
GNUtoo\|laptop	is there a header?	13:20
MohammadAG	kerio, more infinite than the eye can see	13:21
alterego	shower, bbiab	13:21
MohammadAG	kerio, you just got mindraped	13:21
RobbieThe1st	DocScrutinizer: I grabbed the battery out of the unheated section of our shop/garage. Put it in a phone. Turned it on, and it showed maximum battery bars.	13:21
DocScrutinizer	meh, sorry. This discussion gets about as annoying as has been the argueing with Andy about "why do we need OVP? USB chargers are rated @max 6V and this chip has a limit of 6.5V where it emits smoke""	13:22
RobbieThe1st	This was after at least 2 years of not being charged, and being stored in the freezer for a year.	13:22
kerio	MohammadAG: but... i can't see the energy in my battery with my eyes...	13:22
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: that's absolutely irrelevant	13:22
alterego	kerio: multimeter	13:22
DocScrutinizer	and I really CBA to explain to you why	13:22
* alterego wanders off.		13:22
GNUtoo\|laptop	jacekowski, ^^^ ( http://pastebin.com/2vhb9uF8 )	13:23
RobbieThe1st	What it means is that: 1. It hasn't self-discharged. 2. It hasn't shorted.	13:23
RobbieThe1st	In addition, SpeedEvil puts them in his freezer without issue.	13:23
RobbieThe1st	And he says that they have very little measured degradation.	13:24
* DocScrutinizer picks out a 2year old completely sucked empty alkaline from his waste box and probes voltage - ""see, it still has 1.45V""		13:24
RobbieThe1st	But, in this case, we are running a load off it - so it's not just phantom charge. I could, I suppose, do some tests to it..	13:25
*** Rhoruns has quit IRC		13:25
*** setanta has joined #maemo		13:25
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: go to matsuhita and tell them you know how they canimprove their cells, with ZERO effort, you'll tell them if they pay you say $20k	13:25
*** etrunko has joined #maemo		13:26
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: ekhm	13:26
DocScrutinizer	I bet they are pleased to hear all their tests they did to do proper specifications were just BS, and you were better with your garage and freezer	13:26
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: your secondary image can only be 110kb long	13:26
RobbieThe1st	I'm not saying anything of the sort. All I'm saying is that it appears to work, I'm going to do it, and I can't see any proof that it's not working.	13:26
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah ok too bad	13:27
RobbieThe1st	You seem to forget that the manual itself agrees with me :\	13:27
GNUtoo\|laptop	I'm obligated to go barebox instead of uboot then	13:27
RobbieThe1st	Their tests say it's fine.	13:27
*** jonwil has quit IRC		13:27
GNUtoo\|laptop	or could uboot fit in 110k?	13:27
RobbieThe1st	Of course, we don't know what the optimum temperature(within that range) is.	13:27
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: nope	13:27
GNUtoo\|laptop	with USB console	13:27
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	13:27
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: uboot is almost twice that size	13:27
RobbieThe1st	But it's probably near the low end.	13:27
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: with nothing on	13:27
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: please stop telling BS! I explained to you in epic lemgth that the spec in manual is for NINETY DAYS	13:27
*** tackat has quit IRC		13:27
GNUtoo\|laptop	barebox is a lot smaller	13:28
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: but it's not working, isn't it?	13:28
DocScrutinizer	and they even tolerate degradation of cell chemistry and capacity by doing this	13:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	I didn't try	13:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	I'll try	13:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	but the issue is the following:	13:28
RobbieThe1st	So, what proof do -you- have that whatever temperature you like is better than 0C?	13:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	how can I know it works	13:28
DocScrutinizer	and you claim it's the optimum to store LiIon	13:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	maybe blink the led?	13:28
DocScrutinizer	MEH, now he's suddenly at 0°C	13:29
DocScrutinizer	while a minute ago he's been talking about -20 and evem -10F whatever that is	13:29
DocScrutinizer	sorry that's just too boring	13:29
RobbieThe1st	-10F = -25C. That's the lowest I've ever had it.	13:29
frals	-10f = -23c	13:29
GNUtoo\|laptop	http://pastebin.com/2zaRVcM0	13:29
RobbieThe1st	Also, if you look up, for several pages I've been trying to state "residential freezer"	13:30
RobbieThe1st	which is going to be around 0C. or 32F.	13:30
RobbieThe1st	But you wouldn't listen.	13:30
frals	arent freezers usually below 0C?	13:30
DocScrutinizer	RobbieThe1st: you can stop it, I'm leaving. It's really too pointless a "discussion"	13:30
RobbieThe1st	sigh.	13:31
RobbieThe1st	Oh. Maby you're right. Perhaps some are colder.	13:32
*** eichi has joined #maemo		13:34
*** lbt has joined #maemo		13:34
GNUtoo\|laptop	jacekowski, http://pastebin.com/2zaRVcM0	13:34
eichi	hello. i have a problem with the maemo5 build in email client. sometimes, i'm forced to use gprs. now, if i try to send some data with email, I get an "send failed" error. i'm very shure, this is just some kind of timeout. but there is no option for that	13:35
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: yes	13:35
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: you need correct header for it to work	13:35
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	13:35
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: otherwise xloader will not load it	13:35
*** crs has joined #maemo		13:35
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah ok nice	13:35
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: you have 4 byte jump executed in ARM mode	13:36
GNUtoo\|laptop	so I look for info on the classic x-loader	13:36
frals	eichi: have you configured the correct outgoing server for your gprs?	13:36
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: no	13:36
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: nokia xloader is different	13:36
GNUtoo\|laptop	and it would apply to nokia?	13:36
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah ok	13:36
jacekowski	no	13:36
jacekowski	you need 4 bytes for jump in arm mode	13:36
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	13:36
jacekowski	and then NOLOScnd	13:36
jacekowski	and xloader is looking for that NOLOScnd	13:37
*** Foxygnu has quit IRC		13:37
*** Foxygnu has joined #maemo		13:37
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok I see that	13:37
GNUtoo\|laptop	in ../secondary-RX-51,2217,2218,2219,2220,2120-1.4.14.9+0m5	13:37
eichi	frals: is there a seperate gprs config? with umts, it works fine	13:37
*** tg has quit IRC		13:37
frals	depends on your service provider what smtp you can use	13:38
eichi	but not depends on umts vs. gprs?	13:38
*** tg has joined #maemo		13:38
frals	shouldnt no	13:38
eichi	one moment, try to send a empty mail	13:38
SpeedEvil	DocScrutinizer: however, the spec in the manual is likely to say 90 days, without specifying - as is likely - the fact that that's at the upper limit only.	13:39
GNUtoo\|laptop	jacekowski, I copy the 4 bytes from ../secondary-RX-51,2217,2218,2219,2220,2120-1.4.14.9+0m5 ?	13:39
*** alextreme has quit IRC		13:39
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: no	13:40
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: these 4 bytes are just jump to just after NOLOScnd	13:41
*** Sicelo has quit IRC		13:41
DocScrutinizer	SpeedEvil: that's no limit of any kind, that's simply the test duration, and cell chemistry won't suffer >xx% loss of max capacity, and not >xy increase in impedance etc, during these 90 days	13:41
DocScrutinizer	it however doesn't imply that after 160 days the degrading eeffects are exactly 2 times as much - more likely they are way higher	13:42
DocScrutinizer	180*	13:42
SpeedEvil	DocScrutinizer: no - however it doesn't imply that the upper and lower limits are the same, or for the same reasons.	13:43
*** tackat has joined #maemo		13:43
DocScrutinizer	are the same as what? upper for sure is not same as lower	13:43
SpeedEvil	DocScrutinizer: For example, the upper limit may be for degradation reasons, and the lower one may be due to the electrolyte freezing being undesirable. Which will not occur at -20C.	13:43
GNUtoo\|laptop	but the address would be the same, right?	13:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	else I could do it manually, "compiling with my head" the b address thing but I wouldn't know at which address to branch	13:46
*** BCMM_ has joined #maemo		13:46
*** TriztN900 has joined #maemo		13:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	basically it works like this right: bootrom->copy xloader in the already-initialized 64k ram	13:46
DocScrutinizer	meh, I really will stop now agruaing about silly stupid statements like "store your battery at -20°C, it's optimum and just the limit of MAX temp range as in datasheet" - every child knows you should stay away from limits, and sweet spot never is at limits	13:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	and execute it	13:46
GNUtoo\|laptop	but then?	13:47
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		13:47
GNUtoo\|laptop	I should read xloader sources	13:47
* TriztN900 hates when widgets disappear by itself		13:47
DocScrutinizer	and I need no evidence for this common sense	13:47
*** blitz00 has joined #maemo		13:48
*** blitz00 has joined #maemo		13:48
*** tonyditchfield_ has joined #maemo		13:49
*** arno0ob has quit IRC		13:51
*** alextreme has joined #maemo		13:52
GNUtoo\|laptop	because NAND isn't memory mapped	13:52
GNUtoo\|laptop	it should have code for reading nand	13:53
fellu	hmm	13:53
GNUtoo\|laptop	s/it/so it/	13:54
infobot	GNUtoo\|laptop meant: so it should have code for reading nand	13:54
fellu	yea	13:54
*** Sicelo has quit IRC		13:55
eichi	frals: realy seems, that i cant send smtp via gprs. even a empty mail fails -.-	13:58
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		13:59
SpeedEvil	most providers will block port 25.	14:01
*** tekojo has joined #maemo		14:02
*** panaggio has joined #maemo		14:03
*** FireFly has quit IRC		14:06
*** jas4711 has quit IRC		14:07
*** NIN101 has joined #maemo		14:07
*** buntfalke has quit IRC		14:10
*** villev has quit IRC		14:12
*** panaggio has quit IRC		14:13
SpeedEvil	Oooh - neat! http://www.sentex.net/~mwandel/legos/legos.html	14:17
*** FireFly\|n900 has quit IRC		14:17
* SpeedEvil wonders if he has enough lego		14:17
*** lcuk has joined #maemo		14:17
*** Arkenoi has joined #maemo		14:19
*** edisson has joined #maemo		14:19
*** blitz00 has quit IRC		14:19
Arkenoi	oops. mycontacts eats up to 85Mb vm	14:19
SpeedEvil	You don't care about VM	14:20
SpeedEvil	(generally)	14:20
SpeedEvil	http://www.selenic.com/smem/	14:20
SpeedEvil	Shows unique memory per-process, and how much shared.	14:20
SpeedEvil	RSS overstates this - for example - RSS includes libc.	14:21
*** murrayc has quit IRC		14:21
SpeedEvil	But libc is multiply mapped by all the processes in the system, so if it's a couple of meg - it's only reasonable to apportion 20K to each process if there are 100 running.	14:21
*** blitz00 has joined #maemo		14:22
Arkenoi	anyways i feel my phone is much slower with mycontacts, it's a shame as it is extremely useful thing	14:24
RST38h	Arkanoid: Found the reason for the slowdown?	14:28
*** Smily has quit IRC		14:30
*** Smily has joined #maemo		14:30
MohammadAG	RST38h, it's closed source :p	14:32
*** zz_comawhite is now known as comawhite		14:32
*** villev has joined #maemo		14:32
*** comawhite has quit IRC		14:32
*** comawhite has joined #maemo		14:32
*** FireFly\|n900 has joined #maemo		14:32
*** PhonicUK has joined #maemo		14:34
ZogG	lardman, ping	14:35
lardman	ZogG: pong	14:36
alterego	Adding the last major v1 feature for Columbus :)	14:37
*** RobbieThe1st has quit IRC		14:37
alterego	I'm thinking of putting a donations table up on the website (when I make it).	14:41
alterego	So people can see how generous, or not, others' are.	14:41
*** hurbu__ has joined #maemo		14:43
Arkenoi	RST38h, appears that if i disable mycontacts, it behaves much better	14:43
RST38h	Arkenoi: Kill the mycontacts and forget about them then	14:43
RST38h	Arkenoi: Checked their memory footprint with HTOP?	14:43
ZogG	alterego it would be nice to have donations page on communities pages with list of apps and links for donations so who ever wants can choose app and dev in one place i think	14:44
alterego	ZogG: this is just an app specific highscore table.	14:44
alterego	A community page would be cool, we could knock one up on the wiki	14:45
ZogG	yeah just a table. app \| dev \|donation link. and if it's possible \|donated	14:45
*** hurbu_ has quit IRC		14:46
Arkenoi	only 10% of vsz is shared	14:46
*** lardman is now known as lardman\|afk		14:50
*** villev has quit IRC		14:55
Arkenoi	tv-b-gone app, great, i can forget about having the dongle with me and replacing batteries in it	14:55
*** diegohcg has joined #maemo		14:55
*** FIQ\|n900 has quit IRC		14:55
SpeedEvil	The n900 IR sucs though.	14:58
Arkenoi	yes	14:58
SpeedEvil	Well - actually it blows softly.	14:59
SpeedEvil	It can't suck - that's another problem	14:59
Arkenoi	still cannot understand what prevents pda and smartphone vendors from installing really powerful IR	14:59
SpeedEvil	Arkenoi: $	14:59
Arkenoi	SpeedEvil, it is dirt cheap	14:59
SpeedEvil	Sure.	14:59
ShadowJK	I wonder if the ir is weak or if the modulation is just off	15:00
SpeedEvil	$.1 extra means that they don't have $.1*500K	15:00
SpeedEvil	Which isn't too trivial	15:00
Arkenoi	and lose vital functionality	15:00
Arkenoi	just add $.1 to the rpice	15:00
Arkenoi	price	15:00
SpeedEvil	$.25 or so.	15:00
SpeedEvil	And those 'just one more' features add up, and soon you find that you have a 4Kg phone costing $18000.	15:01
*** achipa has quit IRC		15:02
*** andrenarchy has joined #maemo		15:02
*** arno0ob has joined #maemo		15:03
*** buntfalke has joined #maemo		15:05
*** renatofilho has joined #maemo		15:09
*** ab has quit IRC		15:10
*** tekojo has quit IRC		15:11
*** E0x has joined #maemo		15:11
*** buntfalke has quit IRC		15:12
*** lbt has quit IRC		15:12
yacc	Arkenoi, it's so VITAL that they don't even provide any software to use by default, right?	15:13
yacc	Arkenoi, what is VITAL to you is not necessary what is VITAL to pointy haired weirdos ;)	15:14
*** Dragnslcr has quit IRC		15:14
*** Dragnslcr has joined #maemo		15:15
*** sar3th is now known as sar3th\|away		15:15
*** lardman\|afk is now known as lardman		15:17
*** disco_stu has quit IRC		15:22
*** disco_stu has joined #maemo		15:23
*** blitz00 has quit IRC		15:23
*** schasch has joined #maemo		15:26
*** aloisiojr has joined #maemo		15:29
*** FireFly\|n900 has quit IRC		15:31
*** FireFly\|n900 has joined #maemo		15:31
*** chenca has joined #maemo		15:32
*** SpeedEvil has quit IRC		15:33
Termana	Happy Australia Day to any fellow Australians!	15:35
MohammadAG	and no Happy Australia day for the rest of us?	15:36
MohammadAG	racist!	15:36
*** hardaker has joined #maemo		15:37
*** SpeedEvil has joined #maemo		15:39
Termana	MohammadAG, No, because everyone else knows that it really should be Happy Invasion Day	15:39
Arkenoi	New latitude app. Still no option to turn GPS on for a brief period of time	15:40
*** avs has quit IRC		15:42
*** leandrosansilva has quit IRC		15:47
frals	Arkenoi: for most consumers IR isn't "vital functionality"	15:48
*** svillar has quit IRC		15:48
alterego	What's "latitude app" ?	15:51
alterego	Arkenoi: why do you want to have gps on for a brief period?	15:52
*** T7g has joined #maemo		15:53
*** trupheenix has quit IRC		15:54
lardman	alterego: Google Latitude	15:54
alterego	Oh	15:54
lardman	that's the name of the service, not a command to use a search engine ;)	15:55
Arkenoi	alterego, because it is too battery consuming, and small lag or not quite accurate position on ok. Actually i'd prefer using cell towers for positioning and enabling GPS only if the position was obviously changed.	15:55
alterego	Yeah, I vaguely remember that	15:55
alterego	Arkenoi: to do what?	15:55
*** pcacjrat1ork has quit IRC		15:55
Arkenoi	alterego, to share it	15:55
alterego	Oh, well, why not just enable gps when you want to share position?	15:56
alterego	Like how it works for facebook	15:56
marnanel	What does it mean if I can compile a program in x86 scratchbox, but when I try to do so in armel scratchbox, it complains about assembler instructions and falls over like this? http://pastebin.com/r9WBVDV3 (It can compile some code, fwiw. But this bit gives it some trouble.)	15:57
*** pcacjr_ has joined #maemo		15:57
lcuk	marnanel, make clean?	15:57
lcuk	i get similar when I flip between targets and forget to clean the source	15:58
BCMM_	marnanel: make clean; it may be getting confused by x86 .o files	15:58
* lcuk cheers for new rfk also		15:58
BCMM_	i dunno if it's the right thing to do, but i've set up my qt project with a symlinked src directory so i don't waste time on make clean	15:59
marnanel	lcuk, BCMM_: oh duh. thanks, I thought I was going crazy.	15:59
Arkenoi	alterego, because i want it to stay in my pocket and sharing my position continuously	16:00
BCMM_	i.e. program-arm/src is symlinked to program-x86/src, and binaries live in program-x86/ and program-arm/ rather than poluting the source directory with platform-specific binaries	16:01
BCMM_	is there a nicer way to do that?	16:01
marnanel	yeah, distclean fixed it	16:01
marnanel	thanks folks	16:01
BCMM_	having seperate directories means not rebulding the entirity of the x86 version every time you test it on the device	16:02
*** NishanthMenon has quit IRC		16:03
alterego	Arkenoi: and sharing with what service?	16:04
Arkenoi	alterego, google latitude	16:04
alterego	Right,	16:04
alterego	Well, why don't you write an app to do it?	16:04
alterego	Qt Mobility APIs are quite easy to use.	16:04
alterego	And linking with a webservice is easy enough	16:05
*** jhb is now known as jhb\|afk		16:05
*** [DrkGUNMAN-N900] has joined #maemo		16:06
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	oh the horrors of messing with powervr.ini.....	16:07
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	taken long enough to get up and running again!	16:07
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	hildon definitely seems more sluggish since the reflash	16:08
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	does anyone know how to re-enable shortcut keys? ctrl+shift+x is no longer working!	16:11
Jaffa	[DrkGUNMAN-N900]: Ah, the magical "I'll 'turn on' PowerVR and it'll be better" switch. Why are Nokia so stupid as to leave it off, eh?!	16:11
* Jaffa asks MohammadAG...		16:11
*** andrenarchy has left #maemo		16:12
*** mece has quit IRC		16:12
*** hrw has left #maemo		16:12
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	I was due a reflash anyway :) thought i'd have a look at it.	16:13
*** philipl has joined #maemo		16:13
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		16:14
*** lizardo has joined #maemo		16:14
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		16:14
merlin1991	[DrkGUNMAN-N900], gconf-schemas --register hildon-desktop-keys.schemas + reboot should bring back the default shortcuts	16:15
[DrkGUNMAN-N900]	thank you merlin1991	16:15
*** chiwawa_42 has left #maemo		16:17
*** Venemo has quit IRC		16:17
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		16:17
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		16:19
*** panaggio has joined #maemo		16:20
alterego	Bloody apt-worker getting in the way of my development as usual ..	16:21
*** swc\|666__ has quit IRC		16:22
*** [DrkGUNMAN-N900] has quit IRC		16:23
*** Earthwings_ has joined #maemo		16:23
*** ruskie has quit IRC		16:23
*** ptlo has quit IRC		16:23
*** libben has quit IRC		16:23
*** razzloss has quit IRC		16:24
*** razzloss has joined #maemo		16:24
*** Earthwings has quit IRC		16:24
*** libben has joined #maemo		16:24
*** Venemo has quit IRC		16:24
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		16:25
*** swc\|666__ has joined #maemo		16:25
*** GNUtoo\|laptop has quit IRC		16:25
*** korhojoa_ has quit IRC		16:25
*** ruskie has joined #maemo		16:26
*** ptlo has joined #maemo		16:26
*** korhojoa has joined #maemo		16:27
*** murrayc has joined #maemo		16:27
MohammadAG	muhaha, patched vumeter to make the keyboard a VU	16:29
MohammadAG	thanks merlin1991 o	16:29
merlin1991	?	16:30
alterego	MohammadAG: did a proper line count just now, columbus + libcolumbus + librxsupport + columbus-plugins-core = 11630 lines.	16:32
alterego	And that's just source files, there's a little more with .desktop files debian packaging stuff etc, etc.	16:32
*** Earthwings_ is now known as Earthwings		16:34
*** Earthwings has joined #maemo		16:34
*** Venemo has quit IRC		16:34
*** pcacjr_ is now known as pcacjratwork		16:35
*** leandrosansilva has joined #maemo		16:35
*** Ryback_ has joined #maemo		16:35
*** Termana has quit IRC		16:36
BCMM_	alterego: what do you use for line-counting, btw?	16:38
BCMM_	i've seen something cleverer than wc, but can't recall its name	16:39
BCMM_	(i think it did things like ignore blank lines and count comments seperately and so on)	16:39
alterego	BCMM_: find dir1 dir2 dir3 -name '.cpp' -or -name '.h' \| xargs wc -l	16:41
*** Smily has quit IRC		16:42
*** Cy8aer has quit IRC		16:44
*** msanchez has quit IRC		16:44
BCMM_	oh, ok.	16:51
BCMM_	thanks	16:51
*** murrayc has quit IRC		16:51
edheldil	BCMM: you can leave out comments with grep	16:51
MohammadAG	shitty sony handycam	16:52
MohammadAG	I want the N8 back already :/	16:52
*** ds3 has quit IRC		16:53
*** dazo is now known as dazo_afk		16:54
*** GNUtoo\|laptop has joined #maemo		16:54
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		16:54
GNUtoo\|laptop	jacekowski, for the 4 byted does it do that:	16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	bootrom	16:55
*** ds3 has joined #maemo		16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	read xloader from flash	16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	put it in the 64k of ram	16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	jump there	16:55
*** Sicelo has quit IRC		16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	so now xloader has control	16:55
*** msanchez has joined #maemo		16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	xloader loads nolo or something else from flash	16:55
GNUtoo\|laptop	put it somewhere(where?)	16:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	and read the instruction	16:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	that is 32bit = 4 bytes	16:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	that contains a jump	16:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	like b address	16:56
GNUtoo\|laptop	that goes to where nolo or the something else is extracted?	16:56
*** dazo_afk is now known as dazo		16:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	s/?//	16:57
infobot	GNUtoo\|laptop meant: that goes to where nolo or the something else is extracted	16:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	+ an offset	16:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	I bet I'm wrong somewhere	16:57
GNUtoo\|laptop	because xload must initialize the ram, right?	16:57
*** RST38bis has joined #maemo		16:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	because 64k is not enough for nolo	16:58
*** dos1 has joined #maemo		16:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	that is to say, nolo can't be copied in the 64k	16:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	hmmm	16:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	I'm surely missing something	16:58
*** Smily has joined #maemo		17:00
RST38bis	yawn	17:01
*** FireFly\|n900 has quit IRC		17:01
*** Venemo has quit IRC		17:01
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		17:02
*** Venemo has quit IRC		17:03
GNUtoo\|laptop	also if NAND is not memory mapped, how can the CPU run uboot from it on other devices?	17:03
*** wjt has left #maemo		17:03
SpeedEvil	It can't.	17:04
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah, so how does it work	17:04
GNUtoo\|laptop	you have NOR+NAND on other devices?	17:04
SpeedEvil	The stepping-stone loader on the CPU onboard ROM loads it and executes it.	17:04
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah ok	17:05
*** felipec has joined #maemo		17:05
GNUtoo\|laptop	so cpu like imx31 should have a bootrom	17:05
GNUtoo\|laptop	interesting...	17:05
SpeedEvil	There is a 48k? ROM inside the omap	17:06
*** dneary has quit IRC		17:09
*** achipa has joined #maemo		17:11
*** achipa has joined #maemo		17:11
MohammadAG	isn't that what allows coldflashing?	17:11
*** amigadave has quit IRC		17:12
SpeedEvil	yes.	17:12
*** ab has joined #maemo		17:18
*** FireFly\|n900 has joined #maemo		17:18
*** schasch has quit IRC		17:18
*** eichi has left #maemo		17:23
*** larsivi has quit IRC		17:23
*** tackat_ has joined #maemo		17:23
*** mitsutaka has quit IRC		17:24
*** tackat has quit IRC		17:24
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: nope	17:26
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: rom loads nokia xloader	17:26
*** buntfalke has joined #maemo		17:26
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: omap rom starts at 0x0 and then it reads nannd	17:27
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: and it's reading xloader there with proper headers ( signatures and stuff )	17:27
*** rm_work has joined #maemo		17:28
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: and xloader is loaded at 0x40208000	17:28
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	17:28
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: than xloader loads nolo from nand	17:28
jacekowski	GNUtoo\|laptop: verifies if it has correct magic ( NOLOScnd )	17:29
jacekowski	and if it has just jumps to 0x8040000	17:29
*** z4chh has quit IRC		17:29
GNUtoo\|laptop	ok	17:30
GNUtoo\|laptop	so what are the stuff that is before NOLOScnd	17:30
jacekowski	it's just a jump	17:30
GNUtoo\|laptop	to 0x8040000	17:30
jacekowski	no	17:30
GNUtoo\|laptop	ahhh	17:30
GNUtoo\|laptop	I get it	17:30
GNUtoo\|laptop	basically	17:30
jacekowski	NOLOScnd is at 0x8040004	17:31
GNUtoo\|laptop	xload jumps to 0x8040000	17:31
GNUtoo\|laptop	but if it started with NOLOScnd	17:31
GNUtoo\|laptop	it wouldn't be able to execute the content	17:31
GNUtoo\|laptop	so....	17:31
jacekowski	basicaly it's just that there is only one instruction before nolo magic	17:31
jacekowski	so unless you want to fuck yourself up	17:31
jacekowski	you have to jump to place where you have more space	17:31
jacekowski	after that magic	17:32
GNUtoo\|laptop	it's just for skipping the magic right?	17:32
*** FireFly has joined #maemo		17:32
GNUtoo\|laptop	so it doesn't execute the magic	17:33
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		17:33
*** pupnik has quit IRC		17:35
jacekowski	yes	17:35
*** leandrosansilva has quit IRC		17:36
*** ppenz has quit IRC		17:36
*** MadViking has quit IRC		17:42
*** philipl has quit IRC		17:42
*** hannesw_ has joined #maemo		17:45
*** hannesw has quit IRC		17:48
SpeedEvil	Woo - cheapness.	17:50
SpeedEvil	T-mobiles 'blackberry' SIM works.	17:50
SpeedEvil	10 quid topup for 6 months 'free' internet.	17:51
SpeedEvil	500M/mo only - but, it's a backup SIM.	17:51
SpeedEvil	(uk)	17:51
SpeedEvil	Free SIM + 10 quid topup, and it just works.	17:51
nidO	rly?	17:53
nidO	damn, I missed a trick there then, recently got a 3 sim for my tablet, that only gives me like 100MB free when I top it up :(	17:53
*** Per_n900 has quit IRC		17:53
psycho_oreos	isn't 3 a subsidiary of vodaphone over there?	17:54
kerio	3 here gives you 3gb for 5€/month	17:56
kerio	well, 100mb/day for 5€/month	17:56
*** jhb\|afk is now known as jhb		17:56
SpeedEvil	nidO: The voice rates are pretty bad.	17:58
SpeedEvil	nidO: But I rarely make calls.	17:58
nidO	yeah doesnt concern me, the sim in my tablet's for data only :P	17:58
nidO	shame I didnt spot that deal :(	17:58
SpeedEvil	Also - if you buy before FEb - you can get a PAYG SIM - and add the 20 quid 6 month internet booster, with a 1G cap	17:59
nidO	http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=927908 is quite astonishing	18:03
*** ptlo has quit IRC		18:04
*** perolsen has joined #maemo		18:07
*** guizz has joined #maemo		18:09
*** solarion has joined #maemo		18:11
*** Venemo has quit IRC		18:13
*** mitsutaka has joined #maemo		18:14
*** chx has joined #maemo		18:15
*** eMHa_ has quit IRC		18:16
*** Tsuyo has joined #maemo		18:17
kerio	haha	18:23
kerio	"Because of a factory problem, there was no N900 in the box"	18:23
MohammadAG	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM7ltX3Wtok I hate sony handycams (also, video blocked in Germany by youtube)	18:23
MohammadAG	need a way to find it more interesting, it's kinda boring right now	18:23
SpeedEvil	kerio: Damn - I need to use that line for ebay.	18:24
MohammadAG	I'd skip the first acoustic part	18:24
*** tchan has quit IRC		18:27
*** zap has quit IRC		18:29
*** eMHa has joined #maemo		18:29
*** rcg1 has joined #maemo		18:29
*** jpe_ has quit IRC		18:31
*** eMHa has quit IRC		18:32
*** eMHa has joined #maemo		18:33
*** chx has quit IRC		18:37
*** BCMM has quit IRC		18:37
*** sar3th\|away is now known as sar3th		18:38
*** kwek has quit IRC		18:39
*** WellMux_ has quit IRC		18:41
merlin1991	nice MohammadAG :)	18:44
*** BCMM_ has quit IRC		18:47
*** ab has quit IRC		18:48
*** Tuco1 has quit IRC		18:48
*** Tuco1 has joined #maemo		18:49
*** Tuco1 has joined #maemo		18:49
*** nicu has quit IRC		18:50
*** TriztN900 has quit IRC		18:52
*** tchan has joined #maemo		18:52
*** hannesw_ has quit IRC		18:59
*** peregrin has quit IRC		18:59
*** Tuco1 has left #maemo		19:00
*** Wikier has quit IRC		19:01
*** scoobertron has joined #maemo		19:03
*** z4chh has joined #maemo		19:04
*** msanchez has quit IRC		19:05
*** guizz has left #maemo		19:05
*** millenomi has quit IRC		19:07
*** eMHa has quit IRC		19:10
*** stef_204 has quit IRC		19:10
*** retro\|cz has quit IRC		19:11
alterego	kerio: you'd think they'd notice from the weight...	19:11
*** scoobertron has quit IRC		19:12
*** scoobertron has joined #maemo		19:12
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		19:12
*** achipa has quit IRC		19:12
*** digitalsurgeon has joined #maemo		19:13
*** setanta has quit IRC		19:15
*** peregrin has joined #maemo		19:16
*** tackat has joined #maemo		19:17
*** ftrvxmtrx has quit IRC		19:17
chem\|st	so now i need to contact that technical labratory to send my device back to me... insurance pays 220eur	19:17
*** tackat_ has quit IRC		19:17
chem\|st	+o	19:18
*** geaaru has quit IRC		19:19
*** kW_ has joined #maemo		19:19
*** MadViking has quit IRC		19:22
*** panaggio has quit IRC		19:22
*** Bash has joined #maemo		19:23
*** onen\|openBmap has joined #maemo		19:25
*** pupnik has joined #maemo		19:29
pupnik	Genial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBT4UhT_nIA Staatsverschuldung mal einfach erklärt	19:29
*** `0660 has quit IRC		19:29
MohammadAG	hah, keyboardless N9-01 rumor	19:29
*** setanta has joined #maemo		19:29
pupnik	devboard+screen running meego...	19:29
pupnik	the bloggers are getting antsy at nokia	19:29
*** mairas has quit IRC		19:30
*** lardman is now known as lardman\|gone		19:31
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		19:32
*** dolphin has joined #maemo		19:32
*** linuxplatform has joined #maemo		19:33
jacekowski	MohammadAG: that thing i asked you to test	19:38
jacekowski	MohammadAG: after testing it on emu	19:39
jacekowski	MohammadAG: it looks like it's real nolo console	19:39
jacekowski	MohammadAG: but on serial port	19:39
*** setanta has quit IRC		19:39
MohammadAG	jacekowski, I guess there's no way to export that over USB?	19:39
jacekowski	nope	19:40
jacekowski	well, there is	19:40
jacekowski	but not easyway	19:40
*** setanta has joined #maemo		19:40
*** eMHa has joined #maemo		19:40
*** merlin1991 has quit IRC		19:41
*** tchan has quit IRC		19:41
*** onen\|openBmap has quit IRC		19:44
*** tchan has joined #maemo		19:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	hmmm	19:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	I wonder what's the easiest led-debugging like thing	19:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	I bet having serial without soldering is difficult	19:45
GNUtoo\|laptop	maybe the vibrator	19:47
MohammadAG	jacekowski, how easy?	19:47
*** piggz has joined #maemo		19:47
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		19:48
*** BCMM has quit IRC		19:48
*** jrocha has quit IRC		19:48
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		19:49
*** davyg has joined #maemo		19:52
*** svillar has joined #maemo		19:53
*** arno0ob has quit IRC		19:53
*** jhb has quit IRC		19:58
alterego	GNUtoo\|laptop: not really, you just need to mould a connector that can sit under the battery.	19:58
GNUtoo\|laptop	yes the problem is that I've nothing to do that	19:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	maybe I could try like this:	19:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	I make a PCB	19:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	with soldered cables that ends with solder balls	19:59
GNUtoo\|laptop	?	19:59
alterego	Erm ..	20:00
alterego	I'd just use some kind of glue or solidifying gel, make a mould that'll fit into the pay comfortably, then insert contact pins and cable.	20:01
GNUtoo\|laptop	ah good idea	20:01
alterego	Test the process on an old handset first	20:01
GNUtoo\|laptop	I've an idea	20:02
*** pH5 has joined #maemo		20:02
GNUtoo\|laptop	I take an eraser	20:02
alterego	I did a similar thing for an old Garmin handheld gps, used silicon liquid to stop the glue sticking to the pcb, then injected glue in with a heat glue gun.	20:03
GNUtoo\|laptop	and put cables etc...inside	20:03
alterego	That may work, though erasers have a tendency to fall apart.	20:03
*** scoobertron has quit IRC		20:05
*** lardman has joined #maemo		20:06
*** dolphin has quit IRC		20:06
*** zap has joined #maemo		20:07
*** ftrvxmtrx has joined #maemo		20:07
alterego	bbl	20:08
*** buntfalke has quit IRC		20:08
*** _berto_ has quit IRC		20:08
*** Mousey has joined #maemo		20:11
*** AD-N770 has quit IRC		20:11
*** gnutoo has joined #maemo		20:13
*** GNUtoo\|laptop has quit IRC		20:15
*** kW has joined #maemo		20:15
*** kW_ has quit IRC		20:16
*** scoobertron has joined #maemo		20:17
*** ArGGu^^ has quit IRC		20:18
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		20:19
*** ArGGu^^ has joined #maemo		20:20
*** Venemo has quit IRC		20:21
*** calvaris has quit IRC		20:22
*** blue_led_ has joined #maemo		20:22
*** blitz00 has joined #maemo		20:25
MohammadAG	it's quiet in here today	20:27
*** tackat has quit IRC		20:28
*** swc\|666 has joined #maemo		20:30
*** merlin1991 has joined #maemo		20:30
*** Tsuyo has quit IRC		20:32
blue_led_	@mohammad : switch to mhd	20:33
*** Tsuyo has joined #maemo		20:34
*** etrunko has quit IRC		20:35
*** tackat has joined #maemo		20:37
*** etrunko has joined #maemo		20:38
*** florian has quit IRC		20:38
*** nicu has joined #maemo		20:38
*** wallblom1 has quit IRC		20:39
*** trbs has joined #maemo		20:39
*** linuxplatform has quit IRC		20:44
*** _prole has joined #maemo		20:44
*** SmilyOrg has joined #maemo		20:45
*** Mousey has quit IRC		20:45
*** tackat has quit IRC		20:45
*** Mousey has joined #maemo		20:45
*** tackat has joined #maemo		20:45
*** dazo is now known as dazo_afk		20:46
*** Smily has quit IRC		20:48
*** Corsac has quit IRC		20:49
*** Corsac has joined #maemo		20:49
*** sunny_s has quit IRC		20:50
gnutoo	alterego, I failed with eraser	20:50
gnutoo	*it doesn't fall apart	20:51
alterego	:)	20:51
gnutoo	*the pin hole is exactly on top of the rx pin	20:51
gnutoo	*it fits well	20:51
gnutoo	but for an unknow reason	20:51
gnutoo	I've no voltage	20:51
*** inz has quit IRC		20:52
*** scoobertron has quit IRC		20:53
*** felipec has quit IRC		20:54
gnutoo	enable serial console : set	20:54
gnutoo	and serial console is set	20:54
gnutoo	in 0xFFFF	20:55
*** KMFDM has joined #maemo		20:55
*** msanchez has joined #maemo		20:56
gnutoo	I used that: http://www.cpkb.org/wiki/File:Nokia_n900_pinout.jpg	20:59
*** rm_you has quit IRC		20:59
gnutoo	I wonder if it's right	20:59
*** rm_you has joined #maemo		20:59
gnutoo	because http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Hacking doesn't match	20:59
*** bergie has quit IRC		21:00
*** inz has joined #maemo		21:00
*** jrocha has joined #maemo		21:02
gnutoo	jacekowski, has serial right?	21:03
*** wallblom1 has joined #maemo		21:04
*** madalu has joined #maemo		21:05
*** franz__ has joined #maemo		21:05
*** sunny_s has joined #maemo		21:05
*** FIQ\|n900 has joined #maemo		21:05
*** florian has joined #maemo		21:06
*** zutesmog has quit IRC		21:06
franz__	uh, just curious, anyone here ever tried testing gnash on maemo?	21:07
*** chx has joined #maemo		21:14
*** jrocha has quit IRC		21:15
*** blue_led_ has quit IRC		21:16
*** RST38bis has quit IRC		21:18
gnutoo	alterego, what's the exact reason of the 100k limit for the nolo partition?	21:18
*** hannesw_ has joined #maemo		21:20
*** MadViking has quit IRC		21:20
*** MadViking has joined #maemo		21:21
jacekowski	gnutoo: ?	21:22
jacekowski	gnutoo: what is the problem?	21:22
jacekowski	gnutoo: use nokia flasher	21:23
gnutoo	jacekowski, I want a way to debug or see of the code work	21:23
jacekowski	yeah	21:23
jacekowski	do you have way of connecting to these pads?	21:23
gnutoo	yes but I failed	21:23
jacekowski	what are you using to connect to them	21:23
gnutoo	I've some eraser cuted with a hole inside	21:23
gnutoo	and a wire that go trough the hole	21:23
gnutoo	I put a tape on all that	21:24
jacekowski	and where does it go after that?	21:24
gnutoo	I put the battery	21:24
gnutoo	and mesure pin voltage between microsd slot and the wire	21:24
*** zutesmog has joined #maemo		21:24
gnutoo	microsd slot is ground	21:24
gnutoo	I'll restart explaining from the beginning:	21:24
gnutoo	*I've no way to findout if barebox works	21:25
jacekowski	ehh	21:25
jacekowski	but where is your cable going after that	21:25
jacekowski	straight into rs232?	21:25
jacekowski	or you have level shifter	21:25
gnutoo	jacekowski, no, to DMM	21:25
*** msanchez has quit IRC		21:25
gnutoo	DMM say 0V	21:25
jacekowski	and what do you expect to get	21:25
jacekowski	that's correct	21:25
gnutoo	3.3V	21:25
gnutoo	or something like that	21:25
jacekowski	unless your barebox talks serial	21:26
*** jrocha has joined #maemo		21:26
jacekowski	then you will get nothing	21:26
gnutoo	I've 0v even with nolo	21:26
gnutoo	with serial enabled(0xffff)	21:26
jacekowski	use nokia flasher	21:26
gnutoo	even under GNU/Linux with microcom	21:26
jacekowski	not 0xffff	21:26
gnutoo	ok	21:26
jacekowski	and what sort of dmm you've got?	21:27
gnutoo	a cheap one	21:27
jacekowski	is it real dmm	21:27
gnutoo	no-name	21:27
jacekowski	or cheap one	21:27
gnutoo	yes	21:27
gnutoo	a real cheap one	21:27
gnutoo	not home made	21:27
gnutoo	it works etc...	21:27
gnutoo	(the DMM)	21:27
jacekowski	thing is that it's just pulsed DC there	21:28
jacekowski	and it's 2.6V max	21:28
gnutoo	ok	21:28
jacekowski	so it goes to 2.6 for microseconds	21:28
jacekowski	take a look at	21:28
gnutoo	ahhh	21:28
jacekowski	hmm	21:28
jacekowski	i'm just reading what you said before	21:28
jacekowski	http://www.cpkb.org/wiki/File:Nokia_n900_pinout.jpg	21:28
gnutoo	ok	21:29
jacekowski	that pinout is for rapuyama	21:29
gnutoo	is that correct?	21:29
jacekowski	sort of	21:29
gnutoo	rapuyama???	21:29
jacekowski	if you want to talk to rapuyama	21:29
jacekowski	and you don't want to talk to rapuyama	21:29
alterego	Are we still talking about the pads under the batterY?	21:29
gnutoo	yes	21:29
jacekowski	you want to talk to main processor	21:30
alterego	There are connections for serial (TTL), USB & rapuyamna?	21:30
jacekowski	http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Hacking	21:30
gnutoo	ahh that's for the baseband	21:30
jacekowski	and what is on that port	21:30
jacekowski	http://img36.imageshack.us/i/teki.png/	21:30
jacekowski	is that	21:30
jacekowski	which i measured myself btw	21:30
gnutoo	ok	21:30
gnutoo	I saw that http://www.cpkb.org/wiki/File:Nokia_n900_pinout.jpg and http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Hacking didn't match	21:31
gnutoo	that's why I wondered what to do	21:31
*** franz__ has quit IRC		21:32
*** panaggio has joined #maemo		21:32
jacekowski	and be carefull	21:33
*** pupnik_ has joined #maemo		21:33
jacekowski	these pins are only 2.6V	21:33
gnutoo	ok	21:33
jacekowski	and injecting more into them will probably damage your phone	21:33
gnutoo	max3232 can work with 2.6V?	21:33
jacekowski	nope	21:33
gnutoo	what can work with 2.6v?	21:33
jacekowski	bc237	21:34
jacekowski	iirc	21:34
jacekowski	some mosfets can work as well	21:34
gnutoo	ok	21:34
jacekowski	but you need one with low gate capacitance	21:34
*** pupnik has quit IRC		21:34
MohammadAG	I thought no one knew what those pins were	21:35
*** pupnik_ has quit IRC		21:35
jacekowski	well, you don't read wiki often enough	21:35
*** zutesmog has quit IRC		21:36
MohammadAG	of course I don't, wikis started having mediafire links	21:36
*** jevin has joined #maemo		21:37
*** Venemo has joined #maemo		21:38
*** linuxplatform has joined #maemo		21:39
*** larsivi has joined #maemo		21:42
*** jpe_ has joined #maemo		21:43
gnutoo	btw if you don't use flasher nor 0xFFFF can you run a bigger nolo/uboot?	21:43
gnutoo	like booting and acessing the NAND from GNU/Linux	21:43
gnutoo	I wonder what to do	21:44
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		21:44
*** BabelO has quit IRC		21:44
*** BabelO has joined #maemo		21:44
gnutoo	in one hand there is serial which require going to the elctronic shop, is risky etc...	21:45
*** hurbu_ has joined #maemo		21:45
gnutoo	in the other hand I've no idea on what's the best for an hello world led-blinking like stuff	21:45
jacekowski	gnutoo: i never looked into that	21:46
jacekowski	gnutoo: but it will require repartitioning nand at least	21:46
gnutoo	ok	21:46
gnutoo	maybe that's the best way	21:46
*** hurbu__ has quit IRC		21:47
*** pupnik has joined #maemo		21:49
*** thomasjfox has joined #maemo		21:52
*** zutesmog has joined #maemo		21:52
*** unixSnob has joined #maemo		21:52
*** buntfalke has joined #maemo		22:00
*** lbt has joined #maemo		22:01
*** nidO has quit IRC		22:02
jacekowski	but i'm not sure about xloader	22:05
jacekowski	and xloader can't be changed	22:05
*** jrocha has quit IRC		22:05
*** xkr47 has quit IRC		22:06
*** nidO has joined #maemo		22:07
*** rd has joined #maemo		22:08
*** ludens has joined #maemo		22:09
*** 84XABL5SK has joined #maemo		22:13
*** BCMM_ has joined #maemo		22:13
*** BCMM has quit IRC		22:14
*** 84XABL5SK has quit IRC		22:15
*** tg has quit IRC		22:15
*** Flipi\|BNC is now known as Flipi		22:15
*** tg has joined #maemo		22:16
*** madalu has quit IRC		22:17
*** Pillum has joined #maemo		22:18
*** panaggio has quit IRC		22:19
*** aloisiojr has quit IRC		22:27
*** masterhumper has joined #maemo		22:31
*** jpe_ has quit IRC		22:32
*** tackat has quit IRC		22:39
*** sid_ has quit IRC		22:43
*** svillar has quit IRC		22:43
*** LiraNuna has quit IRC		22:44
*** LiraNuna has joined #maemo		22:45
*** mcepl has joined #maemo		22:49
mcepl	please, help ... suddenly (I don't think I did anything to deserve it) pulseaudio stopped starting claiming there is missing /etc/pulse/xpolicy.conf (which really isn't there). Any idea where I can find it and how it disappeared?	22:50
ieatlint	you probably did do something to deserve it	22:52
*** msanchez has joined #maemo		22:52
mcepl	OK, let's abstaining from blaming and tell, where should I find it, which package I should reinstall?	22:52
*** Flipi is now known as Flipi\|BNC		22:53
ieatlint	one sec	22:54
trumee	does anybody has experience of lxp wifi patches?	22:54
ieatlint	http://tehinterweb.com/xpolicy.conf	22:54
trumee	is it possible to patch the stock kernel with his patches, rather than using the power kernel?	22:55
ieatlint	my dpkg says /etc/pulse/xpolicy.conf is not part of any package, so i can't tell you what to reinstall	22:55
mcepl	thanks	22:55
ieatlint	but try copying the xpolicy.conf from my phone (as linked)	22:55
mcepl	trying	22:56
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		22:56
*** Tsuyo has quit IRC		23:00
*** Sicelo has quit IRC		23:01
*** blue_led has joined #maemo		23:01
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		23:04
*** BCMM has quit IRC		23:05
*** BCMM has joined #maemo		23:05
*** kthomas_vh has joined #maemo		23:06
*** Sicelo has joined #maemo		23:06
*** lizardo has quit IRC		23:09
*** msanchez has quit IRC		23:11
*** CutMeOwnThroat has quit IRC		23:12
mcepl	hmm, doesn't work anyway, even after restart. I am afraid I see visit at the Nokia shop in my near future.	23:12
gnutoo	mcepl, maybe reflash?	23:13
corecode	anybody else have problems with xmpp video chat and broken video?	23:14
mcepl	gnutoo: yeah, how? Is there some HOWTO around?	23:16
*** me\|kor has joined #maemo		23:16
gnutoo	http://wiki.maemo.org/Flashing	23:16
Sicelo	mcepl: ~flashing	23:16
gnutoo	note that it will remove all what you installed all your data etc....	23:16
Sicelo	~flashing	23:16
infobot	methinks flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware	23:16
gnutoo	you will get a fresh OS like when you bought it	23:17
thomasjfox	anyone here runs rockbox and has a bluetooth headset + root access on his n900? ;)	23:17
gnutoo	rockbox on n900?	23:18
wmarone	thomasjfox: I do	23:18
*** unixSnob has quit IRC		23:18
gnutoo	hi DocScrutinizer do you have an idea on how to know if some code was executed(led blink etc...)	23:18
*** perlite has quit IRC		23:18
thomasjfox	wmarone: Could you give the bluetooth headset support I wrote a quick shot? I would send you a new rockbox binary which should output debug information to the console once you press a button on the remote	23:19
*** lbt_away is now known as lbt_		23:19
wmarone	remote?	23:19
thomasjfox	wmarone: Ideally it should work out of the box	23:19
*** jrocha has joined #maemo		23:19
thomasjfox	wmarone: Doesn't your bluetooth headset feature buttons?	23:20
*** lbt has quit IRC		23:20
*** lbt_ is now known as lbt_away		23:20
*** lbt_away is now known as lbt		23:20
wmarone	volume and a power/hangup/answer button	23:20
*** buntfalke has quit IRC		23:20
thomasjfox	wmarone: What happens if you press them in the stock media player?	23:20
wmarone	nothing	23:21
*** perlite has joined #maemo		23:21
thomasjfox	wmarone: Ah ok. So that won't work for the test	23:21
thomasjfox	thanks anyway :)	23:23
*** linuxplatform has quit IRC		23:23
*** jhb has joined #maemo		23:23
*** Malin_ has joined #maemo		23:25
*** jhb has quit IRC		23:26
*** SmilybOrg has joined #maemo		23:26
gnutoo	where is lp5526 on the bus?	23:26
pupnik	do not use sabayon linux :D	23:26
DocScrutinizer	lp5523	23:26
DocScrutinizer	see wiki, led	23:27
gnutoo	ok	23:27
mcepl	Sicelo: could I reflash without Windows (I am a Linux guy)?	23:27
*** edisson has quit IRC		23:28
MohammadAG	of course	23:28
ieatlint	http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware#Linux	23:28
MohammadAG	it's a linux device :P	23:28
Sicelo	:) well, flashing apparently works even better in Linux than in Windows	23:28
MohammadAG	USB enumeration works better in Linux than in Windows :P	23:29
mcepl	cool	23:29
alterego	It's just better.	23:29
alterego	IF it works it's better on Linux, period :P	23:29
*** SmilyOrg has quit IRC		23:29
* alterego waits patiently for Plan 9 mobile devices.		23:29
ieatlint	someone should do a plan 9 vs hurd review	23:30
alterego	Plan 9 works :)	23:30
alterego	Hurd doesn't.	23:30
MohammadAG	alterego, if it works, then I doubt it's anything else	23:30
*** Pillum has quit IRC		23:30
ieatlint	define works :P	23:30
alterego	woarks-for-me :)	23:31
alterego	hurd-doesnt-work-for-me :)	23:31
ieatlint	have you tried hurd?	23:31
alterego	Yup	23:31
ieatlint	haha, ok :)	23:31
*** Sicelo has left #maemo		23:32
alterego	tbh, I can't see anything over taking GNU/Linux for a while yet.	23:32
alterego	And that's just because of hardware support.	23:32
ieatlint	hahaha http://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/	23:32
alterego	Yeah, that's what I tried :)	23:32
alterego	Debian are actually quite into Hurd for some reason.	23:33
ieatlint	that's up there with debian christian edition and hannah montanna ubuntu	23:33
*** KMFDM has quit IRC		23:33
alterego	But they're very GNU :)	23:33
*** chx has quit IRC		23:33
*** FIQ\|n900 has quit IRC		23:33
ieatlint	i learnt everything i needed to know about GNU from automake	23:33
ieatlint	and seeing quotes and parts of speeches from stallman	23:34
alterego	Hahah	23:34
*** KMFDM has joined #maemo		23:35
mcepl	is Hannah Montana Linux or GNU/Linux ? ;)	23:36
mcepl	Hannah Montana GNU/Linux would sound even better ... mishmash between Hannah Montana and hard-core geekism.	23:37
*** rd has quit IRC		23:37
*** rd has joined #maemo		23:38
*** MacDrunk has joined #maemo		23:38
ieatlint	you can go read about it http://hannahmontana.sourceforge.net/Site/Home.html	23:38
korhojoa	I'd like to see ReactOS on ARM	23:39
alterego	Or, shakespear edition, Montagnu/linux	23:39
alterego	korhojoa: not sure that'd work. That's the win clone isn't it?	23:39
*** thomasjfox has left #maemo		23:40
gnutoo	I failed again	23:41
*** kthomas_vh has quit IRC		23:41
gnutoo	I'm useless	23:41
gnutoo	i2cset -y 0x2 0x32 0x17 0x10 => Error: Write failed	23:41
gnutoo	0x2 is from:	23:41
*** Tokz has joined #maemo		23:41
gnutoo	http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_LED which says i2c-2	23:42
*** trbs has quit IRC		23:42
gnutoo	0x32 too ( 2-0032 )	23:42
gnutoo	0x16 is:	23:42
korhojoa	alterego: yeah	23:42
*** setanta has quit IRC		23:42
korhojoa	well, there's 7 for arm, so who knows	23:42
gnutoo	#define LP5523_REG_LED_PWM_BASE 0x16 + 1	23:42
Tokz	is posible to play .flac files with the default media player	23:43
korhojoa	sorry, some 8 alpha	23:43
gnutoo	taken from static void lp5523_set_brightnes	23:43
gnutoo	in the kernel driver	23:43
gnutoo	and the last value is an arbitrary value	23:44
gnutoo	for the brightness	23:44
gnutoo	I'm tired of beeing tired	23:44
Tokz	is it posible to play .flac files with the default media player?	23:44
Tokz	sorry for repeating	23:46
Tokz	but i typo'd the last one =)	23:46
*** dos1 has quit IRC		23:47
*** woodong50_______ has joined #maemo		23:47
alterego	Tokz: I think that's possible if you install the extra decoder support from extras.	23:47
Tokz	couldn't find one :\|	23:47
*** OkropNick has quit IRC		23:47
*** moshee has quit IRC		23:49
*** moshee has joined #maemo		23:49
Tokz	any ideas?	23:49
*** scoobertron has joined #maemo		23:51
gnutoo	Tokz, install extras	23:52
gnutoo	I'll go	23:52
*** gnutoo has quit IRC		23:52
*** woodong50_______ has quit IRC		23:54
*** Ryback_ has quit IRC		23:54
*** rd has quit IRC		23:54
Tokz	couldn't find anything with the words "flac" or "decoder"	23:57
Tokz	:\|	23:57
andre__	Tokz: maybe it's ogg-support	23:57
Tokz	okay	23:58
Tokz	what has ogg to do with flac?	23:58
*** jrocha has quit IRC		23:58

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!