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| JPohlmann | Got past it by editing /etc/groups manually to contain only one audio group. | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
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| javispedro | would it be crazy to fork timeless' strings to start a new language localization? | 00:13 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: which language? | 00:13 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm currently merging enus into engb | 00:13 |
| timeless_mbp | and a coworker has someone planning to do hungarian | 00:13 |
| timeless_mbp | i'd request that you hold off a bit | 00:13 |
| timeless_mbp | i'll provide repo access in a bit... | 00:14 |
| javispedro | there's a new user in tmo that seems to want to do cataln | 00:14 |
| javispedro | s/that/who | 00:14 |
| javispedro | catalan=ca_ES btw | 00:14 |
| * timeless_mbp nods | 00:14 | |
| timeless_mbp | pass that guy a private link to my repo | 00:16 |
| timeless_mbp | (or gal) | 00:16 |
| timeless_mbp | have him play w/ the tool | 00:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I want Elmer Fudd | 00:16 |
| timeless_mbp | and suggest the person start coming up w/ questions about strings that aren't obvious | 00:16 |
| timeless_mbp | and ask that this person wait 2 weeks before actually trying | 00:16 |
| timeless_mbp | with luck, i'll have a more open repo in a bit | 00:16 |
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| javispedro | timeless_mbp: can you PM me the url? | 00:19 |
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| JPohlmann | http://lunar-linux.org/~jannis/screenshots/maemo/string-issue.png - am I missing a package for the *real* strings? | 00:22 |
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| zgold | Hi! Where can I find the source to an application i've found in extras-devel (for Fremantle) ? | 00:38 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | zgold: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/source/ | 00:41 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Or, if you're in the SDK and have the correct deb-src lines added: apt-get source <package> | 00:42 |
| zgold | that was easy to find >< | 00:42 |
| zgold | qwerty12_N810: thanks! | 00:42 |
| lbt | who's got an app in Extras ? | 00:42 |
| zgold | is that linked from anywhere? | 00:42 |
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| zgold | widget documentation is pretty poor :/ | 00:44 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Widgets.. That reminds me: I need to laugh at fiferboy | 00:45 |
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| GAN900 | Crap | 00:46 |
| GAN900 | There's a race condition with the shift key. | 00:46 |
| qwerty12_N810 | He kept telling me of how it would be better in Canada now that Wind Mobile is coming and Wind Mobile just got shot down by the Canadian cellular authority | 00:46 |
| GAN900 | Hahaha | 00:47 |
| GAN900 | Poor Canadians. | 00:47 |
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| GAN900 | qwerty12, where do I file a bug for key input. | 00:49 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Key input? In something of mine? If not, I look to you and Andre for Bugzilla stuff... | 00:50 |
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| javispedro | ah... key input. | 00:51 |
| javispedro | fun stuff. | 00:51 |
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| GAN900 | Yeah, the shift key has a race condition | 00:54 |
| GAN900 | SHould | 00:54 |
| GAN900 | That was one key press of the shift key. . . . | 00:54 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | That may be intentional; my N810 also does the same | 00:55 |
| GAN900 | Only Nokia could introduce a race condition into a freaking keyboard. . . . | 00:55 |
| GAN900 | Intentional for what purpose. . . . | 00:55 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I find it a time-saver, actually | 00:55 |
| GAN900 | When doing what? | 00:55 |
| GAN900 | I find it a huge time waster. | 00:56 |
| lcuk | what condition gan? | 00:56 |
| lcuk | what happens | 00:56 |
| qwerty12_N810 | When I'm using one hand and I can't be arsed to hold shift | 00:56 |
| javispedro | I have a race condition with the word predictor in the browser and I don't know when I introduced it. | 00:56 |
| GAN900 | It means I either have to slow down typing or delete characters. | 00:56 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Just a quick press of the shift key and the letter and I'm done! | 00:56 |
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| GAN900 | lcuk, scrollback. . . | 00:56 |
| GAN900 | Erm? | 00:56 |
| javispedro | type "h" + "e" + "l" + "l" + "o" quickly results in "ehllo" | 00:56 |
| GAN900 | I get two shifted characters | 00:57 |
| lcuk | <GAN900> Crap | 00:57 |
| lcuk | <GAN900> There's a race condition with the shift key. | 00:57 |
| lcuk | <GAN900> Hahaha | 00:57 |
| lcuk | <GAN900> Poor Canadians. | 00:57 |
| lcuk | you have a mind that wanders | 00:57 |
| javispedro | because the h keypress starts the predictor, bumps CPU usage, but the "e" key goes straight. | 00:57 |
| GAN900 | SHould | 00:57 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Ah, I keep prediction turned off here | 00:57 |
| GAN900 | That was one key press of the shift key. . . . | 00:57 |
| lbt | it has prediction? | 00:58 |
| javispedro | I am worried I introduced that predictor behaviour with my MicroB patch :S | 00:58 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, no, I'm just quite capable of following multiple conversation threads. | 00:58 |
| GAN900 | Press shift | 00:59 |
| GAN900 | then press two characters in quick succession | 00:59 |
| GAN900 | Lots of times you get two shifted characters. | 00:59 |
| GAN900 | When you should only ever get one. | 00:59 |
| lcuk | when do you release the shift key | 00:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Erm, wait, my N810 does not do the same. Like always, I'm thinking of something else. Sorry | 01:00 |
| lcuk | ie, do you press release shift, then "A" then "B" | 01:00 |
| javispedro | WORKSFORME in N810. | 01:00 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GAN900: I get the same behaviour here | 01:00 |
| javispedro | relol. | 01:00 |
| qwerty12_N810 | On the N900 | 01:00 |
| javispedro | well, file the bug. | 01:00 |
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| javispedro | in an ideal work, a regression like this one would be marked critical severity... | 01:00 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: did you demand an engb? | 01:00 |
| timeless_mbp | if so, it's available from that repo | 01:01 |
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| timeless_mbp | log your bugs to timeless@gmail | 01:01 |
| timeless_mbp | for some reason the package icon is broken | 01:01 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Cool. Will it nuke the default set of en_GB strings? | 01:01 |
| timeless_mbp | but well, ... bah | 01:01 |
| timeless_mbp | same behavior as enus | 01:01 |
| timeless_mbp | you can uninstall it from the cpl | 01:01 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Oh, cool | 01:01 |
| timeless_mbp | well, not uninstall, revert | 01:01 |
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| timeless_mbp | um... | 01:02 |
| timeless_mbp | the cpl names will change to American English/British English the next time i have time | 01:02 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I always think such statements coming from you are odd when I look at your nick | 01:02 |
| lcuk | GAN900, do you have the auto capitalization thing on | 01:03 |
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| * javisn810 wastes your time trying to quickly type inane messages on his n810 to try and trigger hildon im bugs | 01:03 | |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 01:04 |
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| javispedro | bah. so it's a browser only thing. | 01:04 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, no | 01:04 |
| GAN900 | nor autocomplete | 01:04 |
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| GAN900 | Since both of them are broken. | 01:04 |
| lcuk | i cant replicate in notes | 01:04 |
| lcuk | lol agree there | 01:04 |
| * qwerty12_N810 's best N810 uptime: " 1 9 days, 20:16:31 | Linux 2.6.21-omap1 Wed Jul 22 21:43:48 2009" :( | 01:05 | |
| GAN900 | lcuk, it's a bug. | 01:05 |
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| GAN900 | qwerty1 | 01:05 |
| GAN900 | WTF | 01:06 |
| javispedro | timeless: btw, what do you know about https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3250 (Keys of special characters of the physical keyboard don't work at web text entries). Was it fixed in a way similar to my proposed patch? | 01:06 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Yeah! Where's the '2'? | 01:06 |
| GAN900 | There's no copy address in the context menu for a lnik?! | 01:06 |
| GAN900 | Ugh, nevermind. | 01:07 |
| GAN900 | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5972 | 01:07 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm not sure how it was fixed | 01:07 |
| GAN900 | Somebody test and confirm, please. | 01:07 |
| * javispedro notices microb-eal was uploaded to sdk and shuts up :) | 01:07 | |
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| javispedro | *sources of microb-eal | 01:07 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: heh | 01:07 |
| GAN900 | I hate how the rounded corners of widgets are squared in the alpha. | 01:08 |
| GAN900 | It's really amateurish and ugly. | 01:08 |
| lcuk | GAN900, what wouldv made that error report even more special would be if you reproduced it there | 01:08 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, I did. | 01:08 |
| GAN900 | Twice. infact. | 01:08 |
| GAN900 | I just like trying to avoid bug reports with errors. | 01:09 |
| * javispedro writes I COULD TYPE THIS WHOLE SENTENCE WITH ONLY ONE PRESS OF THE SHIFT KEY | 01:09 | |
| lcuk | i still dont know when you release the shift key | 01:09 |
| lcuk | is it before you press any other letter | 01:09 |
| lcuk | or after you have pressed the first | 01:09 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, shift then other characters | 01:10 |
| javispedro | guess the former. the latter would be expected behaviour. | 01:10 |
| GAN900 | Obviously I'm not holding to down | 01:10 |
| GAN900 | Sticky shift and whatnot. | 01:10 |
| lcuk | why not obviously, i make that mistake all the time | 01:10 |
| GAN900 | YHTGnfbm | 01:10 |
| lcuk | on reg keyboard | 01:10 |
| GAN900 | Those four characters where from one shiftpress. | 01:10 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, BECAUSE THEN IT WOULDN'T BE A BUG. | 01:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | LET'S ALL TYPE IN CAPS AND REJOICE | 01:11 |
| GAN900 | Local typos aren't bugs and, thus, don't get filed in bugtrackers. | 01:11 |
| javispedro | caps lock fury | 01:11 |
| javispedro | OUCH. | 01:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | JAVISPEDRO: SAY WHAT? | 01:11 |
| javispedro | *I NEVER TYPE IN CAPS* | 01:12 |
| lcuk | where are notes stored | 01:12 |
| javispedro | PIM app? I guess eds. | 01:12 |
| lcuk | from the notes app | 01:12 |
| sp3000 | anywhere afaiui | 01:13 |
| javispedro | there's a new "notes" app under the calendar app umbrella AFAIK | 01:13 |
| lcuk | click file, save | 01:13 |
| sp3000 | that is ...hm, it has a normal save kind of thing going on | 01:13 |
| lcuk | it doesnt ask where | 01:13 |
| javispedro | ah. | 01:13 |
| javispedro | nice. | 01:13 |
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| sp3000 | yeah, well, there's notes and then there's notes | 01:14 |
| * sp3000 uses conboy for such things | 01:15 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: try .osso/osso-notes | 01:15 |
| javisn810 | Solarion, im sitll trying to type fast to waste your time, only this time im doing taht i nthe borwser. you can clealr ysee hwo some typos are itnrdouced evne though im' srue i didnt made tehm. | 01:15 |
| qwerty12_N810 | sp3000: +1 | 01:15 |
| javispedro | ouch. | 01:15 |
| sp3000 | lcuk: you don't get a button under the filename field? | 01:15 |
| javispedro | Solarion, discard that. | 01:15 |
| javispedro | sorry. | 01:15 |
| ClaesBas | Does the examples on PyMaemo/HildonDesktop http://ow.ly/y7sH work (out of the box for you on fremantle "stable")?) | 01:15 |
| ClaesBas | I can't see any widget (except the rss-one) in "Add widget"!? (I'm not the "claesbas" registered at maemo.org!) | 01:15 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone w/ an n900 and time to test engb or enus? | 01:16 |
| lcuk | Location: Documents | 01:16 |
| lcuk | but i cant find | 01:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | ClaesBas: I have to restart before any Python widgets show up in my add widget list on the N900... | 01:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: I'm missing zenity, apparently | 01:16 |
| ClaesBas | I thought I tried that.. I do it again... | 01:17 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: that means you didn't install extras-devel | 01:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Oh, yeah, I disabled it because of the -testing stuff | 01:17 |
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| javisn810 | s,o typin gemaisl in the borwse ris converted into an itneresting and awful expereince. teh autocompleter itslef doesnt sfufer form teh bug sicne it suggests words without teh tpyos. | 01:18 |
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| timeless_mbp | awesome | 01:18 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javisn810: Trying to read that just makes me want to give up and strangle you instead :/ | 01:18 |
| timeless_mbp | the nokia button doesn't have space for 'Manage Backup[s]' | 01:18 |
| * javispedro feels the urge to stamp the tablet in some nearby wall. | 01:18 | |
| * timeless_mbp feels the urge to smack someone | 01:19 | |
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| * achipa feels the urge to !$^#%^$%NO CARRIER | 01:19 | |
| * pupnik is amazed at n810 durability | 01:20 | |
| * qwerty12_N810 is wondering WTF is the localised version of "ai_ni_multiple_install" | 01:20 | |
| timeless_mbp | iirc there isn't one | 01:20 |
| qwerty12_N810 | pupnik: Please, my N800 is much stronger | 01:21 |
| timeless_mbp | ham has a bunch of strings that aren't localized | 01:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: :\ | 01:21 |
| pupnik | maybe | 01:21 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm | 01:21 |
| timeless_mbp | there is one, sorry | 01:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | pupnik: I open the battery cover on the N810 and the battery comes right out | 01:21 |
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| timeless_mbp | msgstr[0] "Installation succeeded" | 01:21 |
| pupnik | yea so.. | 01:21 |
| timeless_mbp | msgstr[1] "Installed %d packages" | 01:21 |
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| pupnik | great | 01:22 |
| qwerty12_N810 | pupnik: Point being that the N800 does not do that and I lack other devices which have this... "feature" | 01:23 |
| pupnik | no fingernail bending needed | 01:23 |
| pupnik | flip over and voila | 01:23 |
| lcuk | GAN900, ZxcvbZxcvZxcvZxcvZxcvZxcvZxcvbZxcvZxcvZxcvZxcvZxcv | 01:24 |
| pupnik | fingernail already bent on latch | 01:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Hell, with my N800, I had to use a knife to get the battery out for the first two months | 01:24 |
| pupnik | heh | 01:24 |
| lcuk | running finger along like running along a piano | 01:24 |
| lcuk | i dont think theres a faster way to enter letters | 01:24 |
| * lcuk still cannot reproduce | 01:24 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | ... | 01:25 |
| pupnik | 01:25 | |
| pupnik | what bug? | 01:25 |
| * SpeedEvil passes lcuk 50 solenoids. | 01:25 | |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SptePtH2k7g | 01:26 |
| * pupnik passes SpeedEvil 50 altoids. | 01:26 | |
| lcuk | well im wondering what mightv changed tonight specifically ;) | 01:26 |
| lcuk | since gan was in the extras test earlier | 01:26 |
| javispedro | most ... inefficient ... input method ever. | 01:26 |
| lcuk | faster than my bobss ever typed | 01:27 |
| dmj726 | http://www.theonion.com/content/video/apple_introduces_revolutionary | 01:27 |
| javispedro | ooooooooold stuff. | 01:27 |
| dmj726 | there's the most inefficient input method ever | 01:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: You don't ship the .so for the CPA with the engb translations | 01:27 |
| GAN900 | For having the highest resolution of any GPS I've ever used, Ovi Maps somehow manages to display the least amount of information. | 01:27 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: i don't? | 01:27 |
| * timeless_mbp frowns | 01:27 | |
| timeless_mbp | so how does it work for me? | 01:27 |
| GAN900 | lcuk, not fast enough or not enough system load. | 01:28 |
| dmj726 | Care to implement it on the n900 anyone? | 01:28 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: desktop file references locale-selector-cpa-engb.so and I do not have that file in /usr/lib/hildon-control-panel | 01:29 |
| pupnik | i am going to start five threads complaining about no hardware i-but paletted mode | 01:29 |
| timeless_mbp | did you get 2 .deb's or only one? | 01:29 |
| pupnik | 8-bit | 01:29 |
| pupnik | i-but mode | 01:29 |
| lcuk | was there one before? | 01:29 |
| javispedro | pupnik: uh? | 01:30 |
| javispedro | i-but mode? | 01:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: I installed from the repository, using h-a-m | 01:30 |
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| pupnik | yeah javispedro join me | 01:30 |
| timeless_mbp | right, but do oyu have 2 translations- packages | 01:30 |
| timeless_mbp | or just one? | 01:30 |
| pupnik | we will waste hundreds of hours | 01:30 |
| javispedro | pupnik: you can make pretty interesting stuff with ogles 2.0 shaders. potentially including paletted mode. note i don't know the performance of shaders... | 01:30 |
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| pupnik | arrr | 01:31 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: Oh, I removed the en_US ones (thank God) before installing | 01:31 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: dependency is missing | 01:31 |
| pupnik | how bout voodoo3 emulÃation fpr dosbox | 01:31 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: No worries, I'll just launch from the terminal | 01:32 |
| javispedro | ouch. actually, indexing an array with a non constant integer is "Optional" for ogles 2.0, thus i don't know if paletted mode is possible. | 01:32 |
| pupnik | skronk. 3 chips runnin at once. lets see the clock governor | 01:32 |
| pupnik | betcha mine is fried from heavy surfing | 01:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: "Package manager" is too long for the menu. I see "Package manag" | 01:33 |
| * javispedro wants hardware! where are the 3d drivers :P | 01:34 | |
| timeless_mbp | oh brother | 01:34 |
| timeless_mbp | 'Add/Remove' ok ? | 01:34 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sure | 01:34 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: screen capture of package manager not fitting, please | 01:34 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sec | 01:34 |
| timeless_mbp | i believe you, but i want to know why it doesn't work for you | 01:34 |
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| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: update, the package should work | 01:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | pupnik, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5972 | 01:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: http://i.imgur.com/pVVUe.png | 01:36 |
| timeless_mbp | oh | 01:37 |
| timeless_mbp | it is Add/Remove in enus :) | 01:37 |
| timeless_mbp | that was the engb localizer's fault :) | 01:37 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sure... :p | 01:37 |
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| timeless_mbp | (really, he exists) | 01:37 |
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| pupnik | GAN900: dont recall actually | 01:39 |
| pupnik | not that | 01:39 |
| ClaesBas | Has anybody here got the python examples in http://ow.ly/y7sH to work (in FREMANTLE_X86 SDK 5.0)? I can't see the widget to add even after "reboot"! | 01:39 |
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| pupnik | :/ | 01:40 |
| * javispedro sighs. | 01:41 | |
| lcuk | timeless, "not enough memory in target location" to install "American English Translation" | 01:41 |
| javispedro | there's still the hardcoded n810 keyboard stuff in microb-eal fremantle edition. | 01:41 |
| lcuk | or rather, to update it | 01:41 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: um.. reboot? | 01:41 |
| lcuk | ill just uninstall half the stuff i put on this afternoon | 01:41 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: They're trying to be "Mer friendly"... | 01:41 |
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| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: put it this way | 01:44 |
| timeless_mbp | as the enus localizer, i didn't make that mistake :) | 01:44 |
| timeless_mbp | this was obviously done by someone else :) | 01:44 |
| qwerty12_N810 | :) | 01:45 |
| qwerty12_N810 | The new string for the Nokia legalese in the Application manager gets a 10/10 from me. Will look to removing that entire dialog when Nokia release their first production firmware | 01:46 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm glad you like it ;) | 01:46 |
| javispedro | what does it say? "You can go to hell for installing this app"? | 01:46 |
| timeless_mbp | post a picture | 01:46 |
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| lbt | where's the fremantle busybox deb? | 01:48 |
| timeless_mbp | you *want* to install busybox | 01:48 |
| timeless_mbp | ? | 01:48 |
| timeless_mbp | are you *nuts*? | 01:48 |
| lbt | yep :) | 01:48 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless, javispedro: http://i.imgur.com/MBUxE.png | 01:48 |
| lbt | I'm making a fremantle chroot | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | Recent busybox isn't bad. | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | With busybox firefox and X | 01:48 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: how long do those urls last btw? | 01:49 |
| lbt | I mirrored all of http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle | 01:49 |
| lbt | but busybox isn't there | 01:49 |
| lbt | I guess it's preinstalled in the rootfs | 01:49 |
| javispedro | lol. | 01:49 |
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| javispedro | ^^^ qwerty12_N810 :) | 01:49 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: glad you approve | 01:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: Dunno, I *think* forever, but... | 01:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: :) | 01:50 |
| javispedro | I think the "I accept" translation is best. | 01:50 |
| timeless_mbp | what i like is that the strings are shorter, and still very accurate | 01:51 |
| javispedro | it perfectly synthesizes what the person who designed that dialog had in mind. | 01:51 |
| ClaesBas | Is there any better place (than this) to ask questions about PyMaemo/HildonDesktop (not working) examples? | 01:51 |
| timeless_mbp | javispedro: yeah, that's one funny thing about my translation | 01:51 |
| timeless_mbp | it tends to be much closer to designer intent | 01:51 |
| timeless_mbp | and usually i never speak to the designer | 01:51 |
| VDVsx | GAN900, ping | 01:51 |
| javispedro | :) | 01:51 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Update dialog: http://i.imgur.com/Jbj9u.png | 01:52 |
| qwerty12_N810 | "Status: Newer version available" | 01:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | No shit, Sherlock | 01:53 |
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| pupnik | ClaesBas: sorry for the rude people :) | 01:56 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: sometimes it'll say it can't install it | 01:56 |
| timeless_mbp | although i can't remember what the rules are for that | 01:56 |
| pupnik | i dont know... | 01:56 |
| pupnik | ClaesBas: perhaps talk.maemo.org or the mailing list | 01:57 |
| GAN900 | VDVsx, pong? | 01:57 |
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| ClaesBas | pupnik: I'm going to give it a try tomorrow.... | 01:58 |
| VDVsx | GAN900, user/development is a valid category isn't it ? | 01:58 |
| VDVsx | at least I can found it in some docs | 01:59 |
| VDVsx | *find | 01:59 |
| timeless_mbp | GAN900: btw, which category am i in? :) | 01:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | user/I_spell_colour_wrong | 01:59 |
| pupnik | loll | 01:59 |
| pupnik | no user/gamez yet | 02:00 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, I thnik py2deb is valid, and we thumb it down , eheh | 02:00 |
| innociv | whao.. the n900 has about 12 hours of battery life with normal usage like web browsing? That's a lot. | 02:02 |
| javispedro | i still don't know if it's a user/ package | 02:02 |
| lcuk | GAN900, you said before about the unsightly corners on rounded buttons in app manager | 02:02 |
| lcuk | same occurs on device in h-a-m when you taphold on an app | 02:02 |
| qwerty12_N810 | VDVsx: Still not sure what purpose it serves in user/. I think it's more for apps like his PyGTKEditor | 02:02 |
| lcuk | i dont think its a user package | 02:03 |
| lcuk | it has no ui | 02:03 |
| innociv | anyone know who'll carry the n900 in the US? | 02:03 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, neither I, gonna send a follow up to the -ml with some thoughts about the marathon | 02:03 |
| lcuk | it is right to be in extras | 02:03 |
| lcuk | but not right as a user app | 02:03 |
| lbt | VDVsx: any more testing tomorrow? | 02:03 |
| * lbt popped in earlier but then had desktop issues :( | 02:04 | |
| VDVsx | lcuk, so you only can install it via xterminal in your opinion ? | 02:04 |
| VDVsx | lbt, you can do it at any time ;) | 02:04 |
| javispedro | I agree with lcuk. | 02:04 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, it makes sense | 02:04 |
| qwerty12_N810 | VDVsx: It is rather fitting that way, considering that its only usage is gonna be via the terminal... | 02:04 |
| lcuk | i wish however there was a proper way to promote to -sdk or -tools | 02:05 |
| lcuk | which would serve khertan better - since hes a developer | 02:05 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: *shudder* | 02:05 |
| GAN900 | VDVsx, yes. | 02:05 |
| javispedro | yeah, we need a "stable" -tools repo | 02:05 |
| lcuk | lol | 02:05 |
| GAN900 | timeless_mbp, user/system | 02:05 |
| javispedro | for packages that do not make sense in device but do in dev environments. | 02:05 |
| lcuk | i would like to fully put a proper git there | 02:05 |
| VDVsx | GAN900, and something like this: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/python2.5-py2deb/0.5.1-2/ | 02:06 |
| VDVsx | what do you think | 02:06 |
| VDVsx | no GUI, no icon... | 02:06 |
| VDVsx | you can use it only via terminal | 02:06 |
| lcuk | end users might want to send .debs to each other! | 02:06 |
| lcuk | awww damn, they couldnt install em anyway | 02:07 |
| GAN900 | VDVsx, it's fine. | 02:07 |
| timeless_mbp | GAN900: hrm, i think i'm already using that :) | 02:07 |
| GAN900 | timeless_mbp, you are. | 02:07 |
| GAN900 | VDVsx, I think it should be explained in the long description, though. | 02:08 |
| qwerty12_N810 | VDVsx: If it helps, I haven't thumbed it down... | 02:08 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810 / GAN900: if you can figure out why the engb icon isn't working in the .deb, write me an email (or patch) | 02:08 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, you bastard!!! | 02:08 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: Patch what, exactly? I don't have the source package's debian/control :) | 02:09 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: there's a control file in the package | 02:09 |
| timeless_mbp | dpkg-deb is your friend | 02:09 |
| qwerty12_N810 | VDVsx: Aww, don't say that, it makes me think you're pissed off at me | 02:09 |
| timeless_mbp | dpkg-deb -e | 02:09 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | dpkg-deb -e, actually, but point taken | 02:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Er, yeah, sorry | 02:10 |
| * VDVsx sends some cookies qwerty12_N810 | 02:10 | |
| * qwerty12_N810 goes blind after 12:00 AM :) | 02:10 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Thanks VDVsx | 02:10 |
| timeless_mbp | you thought i typed -c? :) | 02:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5972 | 02:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | You do have canconfirm, right? | 02:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: -x, because that's the only thing I ever run it with :) | 02:11 |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 02:11 |
| timeless_mbp | fwiw, i used to build debs by hand | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | No | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Now you do, though. | 02:12 |
| timeless_mbp | (using tar + ar) | 02:12 |
| timeless_mbp | (then dpkg-deb) | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, open that bug and confirm it, please. | 02:12 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Second option, right? | 02:13 |
| VDVsx | oh , I've question in some of the packages that I've commented (thanks package interface for not having notifications :( ) | 02:13 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Is there a "Bugzilla for retards" book anywhere? I really need a copy | 02:16 |
| lcuk | i lent my copy to VDVsx, he hasnt given it back yet | 02:16 |
| VDVsx | RST38h , great comment in the VGb emulator, lol | 02:16 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, sorry | 02:16 |
| VDVsx | I really need it :( | 02:16 |
| lcuk | :( can you just scan the 3rd chapter | 02:17 |
| lcuk | it has that flow chart i need | 02:17 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, check you inbox | 02:17 |
| VDVsx | *your | 02:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: Don't. He told me to do the same and I found some dodgy videos | 02:18 |
| lcuk | you always have dodgy videos in your inbox | 02:18 |
| lcuk | usually self taken | 02:18 |
| lcuk | that damned pixelpipe has something to answer for | 02:19 |
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| lcuk | what is the best way to get a view of folder size | 02:20 |
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| timeless_mbp | lcuk: were you another of those people who wanted the engb variant of my package? | 02:20 |
| timeless_mbp | because it's now available | 02:20 |
| lcuk | i see | 02:21 |
| lcuk | im trying to make space to install | 02:21 |
| timeless_mbp | lol | 02:21 |
| timeless_mbp | that's pretty sad, you know | 02:21 |
| timeless_mbp | unless i screwed up in packaging it | 02:21 |
| lcuk | nahh its me | 02:21 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: is the engb one less optified? | 02:21 |
| lcuk | ive been in extras testing all day | 02:21 |
| lcuk | installed prettyy much everyhthing on page 1 | 02:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | No, blame VDVsx and his testing marathon | 02:21 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, we need to find a faster way | 02:21 |
| lcuk | and we need support on the device when we do | 02:22 |
| GAN900 | It was all just a ploy to ruin everybody's N900. | 02:22 |
| * qwerty12_N810 blames VDVsx for everything | 02:22 | |
| lcuk | its just to disjointed to install and test and comment and rate apps | 02:22 |
| lcuk | your strong pushing actually helped | 02:22 |
| lcuk | but it was still a slog | 02:22 |
| timeless_mbp | hrm, it looks like it might be less optified | 02:23 |
| lcuk | "less optified" | 02:23 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, yeah, people should do it voluntarily for the app that they use | 02:23 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, its not that | 02:23 |
| timeless_mbp | no | 02:23 |
| lcuk | its doing it and redoing it and redoing it | 02:23 |
| lcuk | the same thing | 02:23 |
| lcuk | jaffa is right | 02:24 |
| VDVsx | and perhaps we should establish a testing team, just to check the small things | 02:24 |
| lcuk | he made an edge case bug fix | 02:24 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, totally agreed | 02:24 |
| lcuk | good idea! | 02:24 |
| lcuk | VERY good idea | 02:24 |
| VDVsx | the problem here is the package interface :( | 02:24 |
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| lcuk | keep the -testing chan open | 02:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | How many times are people expected to thumb up the same program, let alone a minor update? | 02:24 |
| lcuk | and have the participants working on things | 02:24 |
| lcuk | 10 friends per patch | 02:25 |
| GAN900 | We need to do this all through h-a-m | 02:25 |
| lcuk | its not even that | 02:25 |
| lcuk | cos once it goes into extras | 02:25 |
| GAN900 | Red Pill should be a package tester's mode. | 02:25 |
| lcuk | there wont be 10 people watching it in -testing | 02:25 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, what i learnt more than anything today | 02:26 |
| lcuk | was about the actual failure states for an app | 02:26 |
| lcuk | the general reasons for not accepting | 02:26 |
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| lcuk | in a meaningful manner | 02:26 |
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| lcuk | more than any wiki page could try to teach | 02:26 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, yes, comments !!!! | 02:26 |
| timeless_mbp | did people actively thumb down packages? | 02:27 |
| lcuk | you are getting them now! | 02:27 |
| VDVsx | but we really need to follow the rules if we want good SW in extras ;) | 02:27 |
| lcuk | for some serious problems yes, but on the whole we maintained status quo | 02:27 |
| timeless_mbp | fwiw, internally, we have an extension for geolocation for microb | 02:27 |
| VDVsx | most of the things are easy fix | 02:27 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, i agree | 02:27 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm supposed to review it this week | 02:27 |
| lcuk | :D NICE timeless | 02:27 |
| lcuk | thats been requested quite often | 02:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: Say that it is awesome so that it actually sees the light of day :) | 02:28 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, i will do a writeup later, but i need one thing | 02:28 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: um | 02:28 |
| lcuk | the full log of todays testing session into the wiki | 02:28 |
| timeless_mbp | the dev in question has added or reviewed code that enables arbitrary code execution on a number of occasions | 02:28 |
| timeless_mbp | there's no way i'm going to just say "it's awesome" | 02:28 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, with the wiki, can you make html bookmarks wiki.maemo.org/testingsession#osm2go etc ? | 02:29 |
| lcuk | timeless, gulp! | 02:29 |
| qwerty12_N810 | How was I to know? Although, after hearing that, I still stick with my original idea: Say that it is awesome | 02:29 |
| lcuk | how come it needs code execution? | 02:29 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, I've already write some thoughts about it ;) | 02:29 |
| lcuk | good | 02:30 |
| VDVsx | the testing-marathon | 02:30 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: oh, that's not related to this code | 02:30 |
| timeless_mbp | merely a note | 02:30 |
| timeless_mbp | i can't simply blindly trust hin | 02:30 |
| lcuk | ahhh right | 02:30 |
| timeless_mbp | s/hin/him/ | 02:30 |
| infobot | timeless_mbp meant: i can't simply blindly trust him | 02:30 |
| * lcuk nods | 02:30 | |
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| lcuk | hey timeless | 02:32 |
| lcuk | timsamoff even | 02:33 |
| lcuk | grrr | 02:33 |
| timsamoff | Hey. Handing out candy to strangers evening. | 02:33 |
| lcuk | cool | 02:33 |
| lcuk | we found out our new cat likes the taste of pumpkin | 02:33 |
| lcuk | a lot | 02:34 |
| timsamoff | ;) | 02:34 |
| lcuk | jake managed to get 3 steps into trick or treating, before a massive firework went off (why?!) and he ran back in the house terrified | 02:34 |
| VDVsx | yerga, ping | 02:35 |
| innociv | Is there a channel for talking about phones? XD | 02:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | http://www.filehurricane.com/viewerthumbnails/562008102154AM_495.jpg | 02:36 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: ouch | 02:36 |
| VDVsx | innociv, #phones | 02:36 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: i take it that your pumpkin didn't survive? | 02:36 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N810, lol | 02:37 |
| innociv | I'm trying to figoure out if it's worth getting a new phone and what plan to get. | 02:37 |
| lcuk | lol it did, hes only a little kitten, but he practically fell inside it and was licking around it | 02:37 |
| innociv | $80 a month is ugh. | 02:37 |
| lcuk | innociv, any particular kind of phone? | 02:37 |
| innociv | n900 | 02:37 |
| innociv | I'm wondering the feasibility of just a data plan and voip | 02:37 |
| lcuk | oh cool, they are on sale now? | 02:37 |
| innociv | not yet | 02:37 |
| lcuk | awww shucks, when are they comin out? | 02:38 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: good thing it wasn't a jack'o'lantern | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | innociv: Where are you/ | 02:38 |
| lcuk | they look so cool | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | ? | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | n900 sucks, get an iphone. | 02:38 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lcuk: You want to make the most of him while he's still a kitten. I've had two cats and they've both been unaffectionate bastards as cats | 02:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | qwerty12_N810: you can fix that. | 02:38 |
| innociv | USA | 02:38 |
| SpeedEvil | qwerty12_N810: with the proper upbringing. | 02:38 |
| innociv | I don't like iphone. propriotary etc. | 02:38 |
| innociv | How does the n900 suck? | 02:39 |
| lcuk | cats are nice to us | 02:39 |
| innociv | it's fast, long battery, good camera, keyboard. | 02:39 |
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| * sp3000 let a koala attack his laptop | 02:39 | |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.ding.net/bonsaikitten/ | 02:39 |
| SpeedEvil | qwerty12_N810: | 02:39 |
| lcuk | ringo sleeps anywhere | 02:39 |
| * sp3000 reboots | 02:39 | |
| SpeedEvil | innociv: I wasn't being serious. | 02:39 |
| SpeedEvil | innociv: I'm getting one. | 02:39 |
| lcuk | he nuzzles on head when you are asleep | 02:39 |
| innociv | I figured not | 02:39 |
| innociv | Cell phone plans and such can be really sucky in the USA | 02:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | SpeedEvil: 0.o | 02:40 |
| lcuk | innociv, note, the n900 is not just a phone. its much much more and may require taming | 02:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | innociv: He means do not install anything which has the prefix of "liq" | 02:41 |
| innociv | lcuk, well I use linux. | 02:41 |
| * lcuk agrees with that | 02:41 | |
| innociv | I want a tiny laptop, not a phone | 02:41 |
| innociv | I rarely make calls. I instant message, use web apps, surf the web. | 02:41 |
| lcuk | innociv, note, the n900 is not just a tiny laptop. its much much more and may require taming | 02:41 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: It's interesting how a different set of strings can make the device feel "different" :) | 02:42 |
| * lcuk huggles n900 and throws cat @ qwerty12_N810 | 02:42 | |
| innociv | Anyone in the USA getting one? | 02:43 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: enus v. enus1, enus1 v. engb1, or engb v engb1 ? | 02:43 |
| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: Nokia en_GB v. your en_GB strings | 02:43 |
| lcuk | yeah inno theres a load of people | 02:43 |
| innociv | is voip with 3g call qaulity any good? :\ | 02:43 |
| lcuk | did you get a chance to go to any of the nokia events | 02:43 |
| innociv | can it integrate into the calling features of the phone? | 02:43 |
| innociv | Nope | 02:43 |
| timeless_mbp | qwerty12_N810: where's my fingerable zenity? :) | 02:44 |
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| lcuk | ive not done any voip | 02:44 |
| lcuk | but i cant tell you its got the best damned messaging centre ive ever used | 02:44 |
| lcuk | look at that, normally you wake up with a headache and lose a few hours | 02:45 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | timeless_mbp: I keep putting that one off because it uses GtkUiBuilder and I have no experience with it. But I guess I can work around parts :\ | 02:45 |
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| practisevoodoo | has anyone got mer install on their n810? | 02:45 |
| lcuk | steve ballmer does the same and he loses a decade. | 02:46 |
| lcuk | http://slashdot.org/story/09/10/31/2134237/Microsofts-Lost-Decade?art_pos=1 | 02:46 |
| innociv | lcuk, yeah but that's with a cell service and not jsut 3g. I'm curious if voip can behave like the normal calling .. | 02:46 |
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| lcuk | dunno, anyone else use voip? | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | innociv: it does | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | i've used it w/ google talk and skype | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | it feels the same | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | although, using anything on a train is basically not going to work | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | been, there, tried Cell and GTalk over Cell | 02:47 |
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| timeless_mbp | the Cell Network sucked, so all calls died | 02:47 |
| timeless_mbp | some in more disturbing ways than other | 02:48 |
| innociv | "It must really suck to be a billionaire and yet realize if you had been smart you coulda been a trillionaire." That is so prophetic. :x | 02:48 |
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| pupnik | is there a "call" command for n900? :) | 02:50 |
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| timeless_mbp | you mean command line app? | 02:50 |
| pupnik | za | 02:51 |
| pupnik | ya | 02:51 |
| pupnik | nobody thoughta that eh | 02:51 |
| pupnik | :) | 02:51 |
| * timeless_mbp shrugs | 02:51 | |
| innociv | n900 doesn't have a navigation app though does it? | 02:52 |
| timeless_mbp | tel://5 in the browser launches the dialer | 02:52 |
| lcuk | pupnik, dunno about calling but you can use a python script to send text messages and stuff | 02:52 |
| timeless_mbp | tel:5 doesn't do the right thing , but ... oh well | 02:53 |
| pupnik | call timeless_number < /home/user/phlblt.wav | 02:53 |
| pupnik | ah cool | 02:53 |
| practisevoodoo | has anyone got a copy of the merinstaller file? | 02:53 |
| timeless_mbp | since the browser doesn't know anything about the dialer | 02:53 |
| timeless_mbp | that means something is handling url dispatch | 02:53 |
| lcuk | practisevoodoo, try asking in #mer | 02:53 |
| timeless_mbp | try the wiki! | 02:53 |
| timeless_mbp | ~mer | 02:54 |
| infobot | mer is, like, http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer | 02:54 |
| practisevoodoo | lcuk, which server? | 02:54 |
| lcuk | this one | 02:54 |
| pupnik | why 5 timeless_mbp ? | 02:54 |
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| practisevoodoo | thanks | 02:54 |
| timeless_mbp | pupnik: because i was lazy and didn't want to type out some other number? | 02:54 |
| pupnik | k | 02:55 |
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| * javispedro notes that yes, his "so perfect" microb patch introduces a race condition that only shows up when the predictor's dictionary gets big | 03:00 | |
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| innociv | Ugh. Anyone know what plan/provider is best to use VOIP? | 03:04 |
| pupnik | country? | 03:04 |
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| innociv | USA | 03:04 |
| pupnik | really | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | you can only use t-mobile if you want 3g | 03:05 |
| innociv | verizon it seems you can only add 5gb/mo data ontop of a calling plan | 03:05 |
| Myrtti | innociv: which phone? | 03:05 |
| innociv | n900 | 03:05 |
| SpeedEvil | you can only use t-mobile if you want 3g in the USA with the n900 | 03:06 |
| Myrtti | innociv: t-mobile, as said above | 03:06 |
| innociv | hm yeah looks like t-mobile. $40 a month | 03:06 |
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| innociv | which still seems expensive to me. :| | 03:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | innociv, I think the web'n'walk plan with a cheap voice plan may work. | 03:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | But a data-only plan in the US is not a workable proposition. | 03:08 |
| innociv | web'n'walk? | 03:09 |
| innociv | why isn't it workable? | 03:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's their cheap data plan you can add onto feature phones. | 03:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Because nobody offers a reasonably priced data-only option. | 03:09 |
| innociv | $40 is fairly reasonable. Would arther it be $30 | 03:10 |
| innociv | But you look at iphone, that's $100 a month, completely unreasonable. | 03:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think T-Mobile's new unlimited plans are somewhat reasonable. | 03:11 |
| innociv | $80 | 03:12 |
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| ccooke | evening, all | 03:14 |
| lcuk | hey ccooke \o | 03:14 |
| ccooke | hiya | 03:14 |
| ccooke | how goes? | 03:15 |
| lcuk | tired today | 03:15 |
| lcuk | ive got testeritis | 03:15 |
| *** VDVsx changes topic to "Welcome Stskeeps, our new distmaster for maemo.org! http://tinyurl.com/yzwxvoq | http://maemo.org | http://maemo.nokia.com | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog" | 03:15 | |
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| ccooke | tired I understand :-) | 03:16 |
| * ccooke is in a hotel in Ilkley, after his Dad's wedding | 03:16 | |
| javispedro | but great job :) | 03:16 |
| ccooke | lcuk: what were you testing and how did igt go? | 03:16 |
| lcuk | testing the packages in maemo-testing respository of course :P | 03:17 |
| lcuk | review the things here: http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | innociv, http://www.t-mobile.com/shop/plans/cell-phone-plans-detail.aspx?tp=tb1&rateplan=Even-More-Plus-500-Talk-Text-Web | 03:17 |
| lcuk | and download, give them a once over | 03:17 |
| lcuk | and rate them and discuss things you notice | 03:18 |
| innociv | too much D: | 03:18 |
| lcuk | we did a whole marathon | 03:18 |
| ccooke | okay, will do. | 03:18 |
| ccooke | although not right now :-) | 03:18 |
| lcuk | dont worry, thats what we were doin today | 03:18 |
| innociv | Has anyone had luck going in an getting a discount on a plan? | 03:18 |
| lcuk | really interesting to see the sorts of things make apps fail | 03:18 |
| ccooke | we have to pack tonight - our train back to London is earlyish tomorrow | 03:18 |
| ccooke | yeah, it is. | 03:19 |
| lcuk | how was the wedding? | 03:19 |
| ccooke | some bugs can be seriously funny - if they're odd enough and easy to fi :-) | 03:20 |
| ccooke | fix | 03:20 |
| innociv | Some bugs can make you bust holes in your wall with your face. | 03:20 |
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| lcuk | it was good to see whole classes of similar errors and to think about how to prevent them in future | 03:20 |
| lcuk | or at least highlight them | 03:20 |
| ccooke | it was fine. church do, then a reception, then a party | 03:21 |
| wjt | lcuk: got a summary somewhere of the classes of error? | 03:21 |
| lcuk | not yet, i havent slept | 03:21 |
| ccooke | it's strange to not be wearing all black, though :-) | 03:21 |
| lcuk | and VDVsx has the logs of the actual convo | 03:21 |
| lcuk | was just things like the icon being missing initially | 03:21 |
| ccooke | innociv: those are the ones I find most amusing | 03:21 |
| wjt | heh | 03:22 |
| lcuk | the opt stuff and how its being handled | 03:22 |
| ccooke | working with omputers has given me a fine appreciation of train-wrecks. | 03:22 |
| innociv | Then 3 hours later you realized you forgot an "if" or didn't have the right capitalization. | 03:22 |
| lcuk | heh | 03:22 |
| lcuk | i dont reuse variable names with wrong case ;) | 03:23 |
| ccooke | or missed a single character in a different file. | 03:23 |
| lcuk | thats evil code | 03:23 |
| lcuk | i think i can count on one hand the number of variables or functions in liqbase which are upper case | 03:23 |
| * ccooke realises he should pack and sleep | 03:24 | |
| innociv | I want a netbook i can fit in a big pocket. xD | 03:24 |
| ccooke | night, all | 03:24 |
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| lcuk | gnite ccooke \o | 03:24 |
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| innociv | Any of you seen that dell prototype? 7" screen. | 03:24 |
| ccooke | innociv: be a giant like me. i can do that... :-) | 03:24 |
| innociv | Lol I'm only 5'8" and 120lbs. | 03:24 |
| ccooke | my dad's QPv firs in my trouser pockets... | 03:25 |
| innociv | can Maemo be installed on any phone with similar hardware to the n900? o_O | 03:25 |
| ccooke | 10v | 03:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | I haven't seen any compact backpack like things. | 03:25 |
| ccooke | innociv: heh. I'm 6'8" and more than three times that weight :-) | 03:25 |
| pupnik | yes, with pliers | 03:26 |
| innociv | lol | 03:26 |
| SpeedEvil | Sort of like a flat backpack, with a netbook hardcase you can lean back on without issue. | 03:26 |
| SpeedEvil | And which you can pull it out one-handed without unstrapping | 03:26 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, n900 | 03:26 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: well - that too. | 03:26 |
| ccooke | (actually I *am* a giant... just, according to pre-20C medical definitions :-) | 03:27 |
| innociv | lol theft | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: but sometimes a 12" screen would be nice. | 03:27 |
| SpeedEvil | (assuming some security measure) | 03:27 |
| * lcuk would get a hernia carrying around ccooke's laptop | 03:27 | |
| * ccooke would like a folding screen-and-keyboad job | 03:27 | |
| ccooke | with an n900-like to power it | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | my laptop ATM is an x60s - ~1.3Kg or so 12" - nice. | 03:28 |
| lcuk | i agree - fold out a pair of 900 screens? or 810 size each? | 03:28 |
| SpeedEvil | ccooke: that would be fun. | 03:28 |
| lcuk | ccooke, book style, or laptop style with a virtual kb on one | 03:28 |
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| SpeedEvil | You also run rapidly into battery issues that way though | 03:28 |
| ccooke | say a flexible rolled-up 15" screen and a folded full-size kb to slot in | 03:29 |
| lcuk | ccooke, supposing 2 completely standalone tablets could act in harmony and show the same data | 03:29 |
| SpeedEvil | virtual display | 03:29 |
| lcuk | book style, or laptop style | 03:29 |
| ccooke | SpeedEvil: contactless charging and a battery for each. since we're in a fantasy | 03:29 |
| ccooke | hmm | 03:29 |
| ccooke | nice | 03:29 |
| ccooke | book-style is nice | 03:30 |
| lcuk | and just flip when needbe | 03:30 |
| lcuk | you could do it with a custom case | 03:30 |
| lcuk | just sit a pair of n810s there | 03:30 |
| ccooke | fun: two-page four-screen book. double-sided | 03:30 |
| lcuk | i say 810s because of price | 03:31 |
| ccooke | on a ring binder with sensors | 03:31 |
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| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/double_tiny.JPG | 03:31 |
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| ccooke | load four pages at once, flipping the unseen page when you rotate the 'current' page to the back | 03:31 |
| ccooke | endless book. | 03:31 |
| lcuk | heh | 03:32 |
| lcuk | mobias strip of n810s :D | 03:32 |
| ccooke | eah | 03:32 |
| ccooke | hey, it could be done easily | 03:32 |
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| lcuk | sure it could | 03:32 |
| lcuk | just needs the sw | 03:32 |
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| * timeless is enroute to airport | 03:39 | |
| * ccooke actually goes. yes. | 03:40 | |
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| timeless | lcuk: so, package installed? | 04:04 |
| lcuk | i stopped trying for the night timeless | 04:04 |
| * timeless frowns | 04:04 | |
| lcuk | i will get it on tomorrow some time | 04:05 |
| lcuk | cmon i had a long day | 04:05 |
| timeless | what happened? | 04:05 |
| timeless | did it refuse to install? | 04:05 |
| lcuk | no | 04:05 |
| lcuk | just had no space | 04:05 |
| lcuk | will do tomorrow im just tired and my mind is in code | 04:05 |
| timeless | do you guys run a script to calculate how much each new package eats? | 04:06 |
| lcuk | not always | 04:06 |
| lcuk | just looking out for extreme ones | 04:06 |
| timeless | /var/cache/apt is 10mb here | 04:06 |
| * timeless considers that extreme :) | 04:06 | |
| lcuk | i really like the idea of giving people this list | 04:06 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ | 04:06 |
| lcuk | and saying just have a look, find something you feel like tesitng and giving it the once over | 04:07 |
| lcuk | i think the list order should be randomized tho | 04:07 |
| lcuk | not just in order of insertion | 04:07 |
| timeless | youch, people were not nice to some, -4 | 04:08 |
| timeless | in microb, i can't tell if karma is for the item above or below | 04:08 |
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| timeless | um | 04:11 |
| timeless | why does ham show me a line with a single dot for touchsearch's description? | 04:11 |
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| lcuk | igagis, are you around | 04:13 |
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| timeless | finnair free wifi in HEL :) | 04:16 |
| lcuk | nice | 04:16 |
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| oilinki | timeless: on flight? | 04:21 |
| timeless_mbp | not yet | 04:21 |
| timeless_mbp | it's a 6:45 flight | 04:21 |
| timeless_mbp | i can't check in for another half hour or so | 04:22 |
| oilinki | timeless: but does finnair provide wifi on the flights as well? | 04:22 |
| timeless_mbp | oh, i'm flying Lufthansa | 04:22 |
| pupnik | used to have a wonderful service in the 70s | 04:23 |
| timeless_mbp | anyone know how to use touchsearch? | 04:24 |
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| timeless_mbp | i installed it, but can't see it anywhere | 04:25 |
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| timeless_mbp | ah, i'm supposed to reboot | 04:26 |
| * timeless_mbp frowns | 04:27 | |
| timeless_mbp | Incorrect PIN. 2 attempts remaining. | 04:27 |
| oilinki | that is something which is not nice to hear when traveling :) | 04:28 |
| timeless_mbp | oilinki: yeah, but you're not considering the English failure | 04:30 |
| timeless_mbp | starting a sentence with a number is generally wrong | 04:30 |
| * timeless_mbp cries | 04:31 | |
| timeless_mbp | Message (no subject) was not found on server. | 04:31 |
| timeless_mbp | boy that's helpful | 04:31 |
| lcuk | i gather you would need translation lines for both variations | 04:31 |
| lcuk | Incorrect PIN. N attempts remaining. | 04:31 |
| timeless_mbp | ? | 04:31 |
| lcuk | Incorrect PIN. 1 attempt remaining. | 04:31 |
| lcuk | or how is the plural catered for | 04:32 |
| timeless_mbp | there are distinct strings | 04:32 |
| timeless_mbp | and SIMs only give you 3 tries | 04:32 |
| timeless_mbp | so N is always 2 | 04:32 |
| lcuk | yeah in this specific case maybe, but in general | 04:33 |
| lcuk | how would an app deal with translating this | 04:33 |
| timeless_mbp | SIM will lock if the correct PIN isn't entered within the next two attempts. | 04:33 |
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| timeless_mbp | that seems a bit wordy, but it's less wrong... suggestions? | 04:33 |
| lcuk | no, you failed to tell the user they failed. | 04:34 |
| lcuk | its more confusing that way, even though the original wording was also wrong | 04:34 |
| timeless_mbp | it's 4:30am, i haven't slept recently, give a counter suggestion :) | 04:34 |
| * lcuk nods | 04:34 | |
| lcuk | same here im thinkin | 04:34 |
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| lcuk | hold on, lemme check somefink | 04:34 |
| timeless_mbp | btw, i sure hope there's a way for people who've reviewed ver X of a package to see a list of such packages when version Y is released | 04:36 |
| timeless_mbp | so they can rereview all of them | 04:36 |
| lcuk | nice idea! | 04:36 |
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| lcuk | jeremiah, X-Fade ^^^^ is that feasible | 04:37 |
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| * timeless_mbp needs to fix "Removed %s" => "%s removed" and similar | 04:38 | |
| lcuk | timeless, the more i think about that line, the more i think it shouldnt change lol | 04:38 |
| timeless_mbp | "Update weather" in om weather needs to be "Updating weather" | 04:39 |
| lcuk | cool | 04:40 |
| lcuk | he added a "its sunny!" button | 04:40 |
| timeless_mbp | could someone with OMWEather please try to add SF.ca.us/SFO ? | 04:40 |
| timeless_mbp | i can't figure out how to do it | 04:40 |
| lcuk | wtf | 04:41 |
| luke-jr | WHO IS HIGH ON PIXIE STICKS?!?! | 04:41 |
| lcuk | my desktop has been wiped | 04:41 |
| lcuk | i thought i was just on a blank desk | 04:41 |
| lcuk | so spun it round | 04:41 |
| lcuk | and they are blank | 04:42 |
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| lcuk | when do we get to save profiles of entire screenfulls | 04:42 |
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| timeless_mbp | feature | 04:42 |
| timeless_mbp | it was overcrowded | 04:42 |
| lcuk | then choose work,home,explore | 04:42 |
| lcuk | arghh! | 04:42 |
| timeless_mbp | you needed to do some housecleaning | 04:42 |
| lcuk | i had | 04:43 |
| lcuk | this is the second time ive lost my layout | 04:43 |
| timeless_mbp | so... omweather? | 04:43 |
| lcuk | its a pita to solve | 04:43 |
| lcuk | not there | 04:43 |
| timeless_mbp | for more fun. try adding 20210 | 04:44 |
| lcuk | ahhh | 04:44 |
| lcuk | add country | 04:44 |
| lcuk | add region | 04:44 |
| timeless_mbp | btw, delaware isn't a region | 04:45 |
| lcuk | its ok | 04:45 |
| lcuk | it just crashed on me | 04:45 |
| timeless_mbp | heh | 04:45 |
| lcuk | and the widget is gone! | 04:45 |
| timeless_mbp | crashing widgets definitely don't belong on your desktop :) | 04:46 |
| lcuk | these touch panels are really bugging me | 04:46 |
| lcuk | errr touchlists | 04:46 |
| timeless_mbp | checking in... later all | 04:47 |
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| lcuk | cya timeless | 04:48 |
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| * GeneralAntilles sighs at -developers. | 05:04 | |
| GeneralAntilles | tz loves to make my life difficult | 05:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just when I thought he was done filing useless bugs he's moved on to useless rant threads on -developers. | 05:04 |
| luke-jr | GeneralAntilles: where is this list? sounds perfect for me to join! | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | On the exact same subject that Jaffa brought up not 8 hours early (in an actual productive attempt to make things more useful). | 05:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_mailing_lists | 05:05 |
| luke-jr | GeneralAntilles: you were supposed to laugh at me and say no way | 05:05 |
| luke-jr | :( | 05:05 |
| luke-jr | my pixie stick high says to troll the list just to get back at you | 05:06 |
| luke-jr | must resist the urge... | 05:06 |
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| lcuk | can i get powertop logging all the data for a whole event? | 05:33 |
| lcuk | err period | 05:33 |
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| timeless_mbp | sp3000: i'm having fun w/ this guy from wapreview.com | 06:13 |
| timeless_mbp | his spelling sucks | 06:13 |
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| tarek_ | Hey, any idea when is the N900 coming out this month | 06:20 |
| timeless_mbp | no | 06:20 |
| timeless_mbp | you going to be in the bay area this week? | 06:20 |
| timeless_mbp | i'm starting my flight sequence to SFO in <30mins | 06:21 |
| timeless_mbp | oops, "Go to gate" | 06:21 |
| timeless_mbp | bye :) | 06:21 |
| lcuk | cya on the other side, have a pleasant flight | 06:21 |
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| timeless | ok, boarded the flight to munich, not the one to frankfurt :) | 06:38 |
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| ryoohki | timeless_mbp: what are you doing in sf bay? i live in san jose | 06:41 |
| ryoohki | anyone know how android is going to effect maemo? | 06:41 |
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| BBNS | treat or trick! | 06:49 |
| dmj726 | ryoohki: how so? | 06:50 |
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| GeneralAntilles | ryoohki, steal sales and developers? | 06:58 |
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| yigal | After visitng umpcportal the one thing that hits me is that I didn't quite realize how awesome the n800 is weighing in at only 206g it is still one of the lightest mids available | 07:11 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Why do people want to bitch about leased RX-51 users not releasing reviews. . . | 07:16 |
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| yigal | to be honest as someone who likes the fact that there is no physical keyboard on the n800, and like so many who think a 3.5" screen is a joke for mobile computing I really can't care about the RX-51 | 07:26 |
| yigal | tbh | 07:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | yigal, yeah, I liked that about the N800, too. | 07:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | I type faster on the N900 finger keyboard than the N800's. :) | 07:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | You really don't notice the difference. | 07:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | So, my little recommendation to you is that you actually try the N900 before you condemn it. | 07:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~ping | 07:30 |
| infobot | ~pong | 07:30 |
| yigal | ha, I'm not condemning it as a device for others with slightly different needs, however I find the n800's screen to be too small and hope that in the next few months I'll be able to purchase a linux or linux made device with roughly 5"-7". I like to take notes in class with my n800, these are graduate classes in physics and the n800 serves me well with xournal, but something slightly larger is better for my needs. | 07:33 |
| yigal | also completing homework assignments on the tablet would be my desire | 07:34 |
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| yigal | which I have done using latex but the size/processor speed/ram etc. make the process all a little too tight | 07:34 |
| yigal | s/tight/a bit too imperfect for me to not want to change devices in the future/ | 07:37 |
| infobot | yigal meant: which I have done using latex but the size/processor speed/ram etc. make the process all a little too a bit too imperfect for me to not want to change devices in the future | 07:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | TouchBook. | 07:37 |
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| tlir | are there any players with gui capable of playing subtitles for movies? | 07:38 |
| tlir | does mplayer have a gui? | 07:38 |
| yigal | GeneralAntilles: yes, it's a good option | 07:38 |
| GeneralAntilles | tlir, mplayer can have many frontends | 07:38 |
| tlir | GeneralAntilles: can you suggest me one that I can install on the n810? | 07:39 |
| yigal | GeneralAntilles: almost too large | 07:39 |
| tlir | KMplayer? | 07:39 |
| dmj726 | yigal...just get a small (9" works for me) netbook and install ubuntu and a touchscreen. | 07:39 |
| yigal | dmj726: ya, I'm waiting for the eee model after their initial 8.9" touchbook | 07:41 |
| dmj726 | I know that you can add one yourself already | 07:42 |
| dmj726 | (about 70 USD on ebay) | 07:42 |
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| yigal | dmj726: but I think again this size range of 8-9" is a bit too large for my needs, I want something between 5-7" | 07:42 |
| yigal | and it's all a matter of $ for that size range | 07:43 |
| dmj726 | then again, one of the main reasons to have a netbook is the rather beefy hardware keyboard. | 07:43 |
| dmj726 | Yes, you can write a novel on one. | 07:43 |
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| yigal | dmj726: right, but an external keyboard gives me the same usage out of a smaller device than a netbook | 07:44 |
| dmj726 | maybe something else would be better for you then | 07:44 |
| yigal | dmj726: yes, I already have a netbook, and an n800, it's in between these 2 size I'm looking for | 07:45 |
| dmj726 | to me the ideal device combo is desktop, netbook, awesome linux smartphone | 07:45 |
| dmj726 | I can live without the notebook and the MID. | 07:45 |
| yigal | I guess it is halloween in the states at least, for the words I have just seen scrolled on #maemo | 07:46 |
| yigal | dmj726: different needs for different folks, it's cool | 07:46 |
| yigal | dmj726: it's so nice having nothing other than my tablet and the book I'm studying with me (+ cell phone of course) | 07:47 |
| dmj726 | there are potential advantages to that | 07:51 |
| dmj726 | of course it's nice to be able stuff a small laptop in one's pocket | 07:51 |
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| yigal | lol, a very near perfect fit for my needs is the Samsung Q1 running linux | 07:52 |
| dmj726 | yes I can do that with my eeepc 900 | 07:52 |
| yigal | except for the ticket price | 07:52 |
| yigal | dmj726: lol | 07:52 |
| dmj726 | how much? | 07:52 |
| yigal | dmj726: cargo pants? | 07:52 |
| yigal | dmj726: approx $700 | 07:52 |
| yigal | dmj726: I can part with the $, but it will hurt | 07:53 |
| tlir | KMplayer can't play subtitles | 07:53 |
| dmj726 | It doesn't fit everywhere, but it fits in cargo pants and a couple of shorts in the upper pockets | 07:53 |
| yigal | tlir: ~/.mplayer/config ? | 07:53 |
| yigal | dmj726: figured, and you've plopped a touch screen on it, right? | 07:54 |
| tlir | oh wait, stupid me I didn't copy the subtitles lol | 07:54 |
| tlir | a sec | 07:54 |
| dmj726 | no, but i was going to | 07:54 |
| dmj726 | that money is earmarked for n900 at the moment | 07:54 |
| yigal | dmj726: I'm glad the rx-51 fits into the needs of other's | 07:55 |
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| dmj726 | I was a bit disappointed with the small screen size and the lack of usb host mode, but otherwise it looks very nice. | 07:55 |
| dmj726 | To be honest I've been comparing it more to iphone and android. | 07:56 |
| yigal | dmj726: those features are exactly the sort of thing I would want on a new portable device, in any event | 07:56 |
| dmj726 | From a linux hacker's point of view it beats the living daylights out of the iphone. | 07:56 |
| yigal | dmj726: android is such a disappointment imo | 07:57 |
| yigal | so far at least | 07:57 |
| yigal | if I hadn't had the n800 prior to the g1 I might have thought a bit better of the device, maybe | 07:58 |
| dmj726 | I used to be excited about android | 07:58 |
| dmj726 | before I saw that you actually could have better (aka maemo 5 on the n900) | 07:58 |
| yigal | dmj726: I was so excited I'm using the 1st mass produced android phone, the excitement wore of very quickly for me | 07:59 |
| dmj726 | what caused that? | 07:59 |
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| yigal | little things, I can't install any program I want on the g1, no open office, no fortran, no eboard, the terminal is highly inferior | 08:00 |
| yigal | no bash, without a chroot | 08:00 |
| yigal | the chroot can't have graphical programs run in it | 08:00 |
| yigal | random mail attachments can't be downloaded | 08:00 |
| yigal | from the default mail clients, on and on and on | 08:01 |
| dmj726 | eww | 08:01 |
| yigal | it's rediculous how lame android is for a phone platform imo | 08:01 |
| dmj726 | how do you think n900 compares to it? | 08:02 |
| yigal | favorably, extremely, almost no comparison | 08:02 |
| yigal | it's a far better platform. | 08:03 |
| Analias | anyone know where the libhildonfm 2.28 source repository is kept? It's not a tagged version in the SVN repo and the gitorious repo for it only goes to 2.21. The version in the freemantle package repo is marked 2.28. | 08:03 |
| dmj726 | that's what it looked like | 08:03 |
| dmj726 | to me (not having either of course) | 08:03 |
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| yigal | dmj726: if I hadn't purchased the g1 a year ago I would be purchasing an n900 now for sure | 08:04 |
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| yigal | the viliv x70 ex is also a perfect device if only it would run linux :( | 08:07 |
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| BBNS | Analias: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/libh/libhildonfm/ | 08:12 |
| Analias | BBNS: that's the packages and tarball - do you know where the svn or git repository is for it? | 08:13 |
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| BBNS | Analias: unfortunately nope :/ | 08:17 |
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| dark | Hi i have a questioh for everybody | 08:30 |
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| dmj726 | ask ohway | 08:31 |
| RST38h | askth thy questioh theh | 08:31 |
| dark | I installed the metalayed crawler for updating the music list in media player now i have a proplem when try to update os2008 update software | 08:31 |
| dark | Always appers the same message | 08:32 |
| RST38h | how could you "install" something that has been installed before? | 08:32 |
| dark | Before yes | 08:32 |
| dark | Everything was in perfect condition except the media player when i update the mmc | 08:33 |
| dark | I read a problem was occurred with the media player and metalayer crawker | 08:34 |
| dark | Then i force to install a metalayer crawler update fix | 08:35 |
| ShadowJK | forcing things is asking for problems.. | 08:35 |
| dark | That i need to install os2008 update and cant install it because need a metalayer crawler version 1.3.19-2 | 08:38 |
| ShadowJK | metalayer-crawler is already installed. If you have forced install metalayer-crawler from something else, or force-updated metalayer-crawler, then you will also have broken updates | 08:41 |
| RST38h | Umgh...seems like the marathon yesterday has never got to the end of the list | 08:41 |
| ShadowJK | marathon? | 08:42 |
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| dmj726 | currently building | 08:43 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: An initiative to test all the packages in Fremantle Extras-Testing | 08:43 |
| dark | So the most recomendable is reset the device | 08:44 |
| dark | Where i can find all the test package list | 08:45 |
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| RST38h | moo zap | 08:54 |
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| RST38h | NASA to irradiate monkeys for science! | 08:55 |
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| * timeless arrives @muc | 09:18 | |
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| timeless | anyone alive? | 09:36 |
| dmj726 | ...brains! | 09:36 |
| timeless | anyone alive ... with an n900? | 09:37 |
| RST38h | guts are more meaty though | 09:37 |
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| timeless | rst38h: try activating offline mode and then turning off your n900 | 09:38 |
| timeless | turn it on again | 09:38 |
| timeless | what does the dialog say? | 09:38 |
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| anvith3 | hello | 09:39 |
| anvith3 | anyone here? | 09:39 |
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| timeless | anvith3: no one here but as chickens | 09:39 |
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| * RST38h sighs at the disaster the current Fremantle Extras "QA" process is :( | 09:40 | |
| RST38h | Typical result of well meaning commitee making decisions | 09:40 |
| dmj726 | will help with QA process for n900 | 09:40 |
| anvith3 | new to maemo . interested in developing for the nokia tablets. but not sure where to start | 09:40 |
| timeless | rst38: i'm pretty sure it's better than the s/Extras// process | 09:40 |
| timeless | anvith3: a problem or interest typically | 09:41 |
| timeless | do you have a device? | 09:41 |
| anvith3 | taking it up as final ear project for my engineering undergrad course | 09:41 |
| anvith3 | es i have access to a N810 | 09:42 |
| anvith3 | *year | 09:42 |
| anvith3 | and *yes | 09:42 |
| anvith3 | installing scratchbox after breaking my head for a long time | 09:43 |
| anvith3 | :) | 09:43 |
| anvith3 | but finally its downlading and installing | 09:43 |
| anvith3 | i was interesed in developing something on the lines of text-to-speech | 09:44 |
| dmj726 | that would be way cool anvith3 | 09:45 |
| anvith3 | but dunno how difficult or easy it is going to be | 09:45 |
| anvith3 | was looking around and foud that flite was orted but nothing else | 09:46 |
| anvith3 | so dunno if its not very possible | 09:46 |
| anvith3 | *ported | 09:46 |
| dmj726 | if it works on debian, is not very cpu intensive, and can work with arm, it won't be hard. | 09:48 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 09:48 |
| anvith3 | yeah it was developed for Ipaq and palm | 09:49 |
| anvith3 | sources are available along with binaries for N770 | 09:49 |
| anvith3 | arm and PC i386 | 09:49 |
| anvith3 | i was thinking something on the lines of making a text-to-speech background app tat would assist blind users . u know something like click with the stylus and any characters are read out aloud | 09:51 |
| anvith3 | has any thing like this been done before? | 09:51 |
| anvith3 | is the wrong place for this ? | 09:52 |
| anvith3 | just a question | 09:52 |
| anvith3 | first day on the IRC channel | 09:52 |
| dmj726 | As far as I know, not on maemo. | 09:52 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 09:52 |
| dmj726 | closest thing on linux is orca | 09:52 |
| anvith3 | cause taking it up as a final year proj wud be risky if i get stuck in the middle | 09:53 |
| anvith3 | hmm | 09:53 |
| anvith3 | i am working on Ubuntu Jaunty | 09:53 |
| anvith3 | and its just two of us who would be developing. we are going to have a Nokia R&D center soon to be set up in the college. its an initiative from Nokia were tey are setting up centers in colleges and asking students to come up with innovative ideas. | 09:55 |
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| anvith3 | i am in Karnataka, India | 09:55 |
| timeless | so, there's a lib/app for text to speech | 09:58 |
| timeless | iirc it can be used w/ things like maemo mapper | 09:59 |
| timeless | you defitinitely want to look at atk | 09:59 |
| timeless | but keep in mind that atk is a gtk solution | 09:59 |
| RST38h | Hmm...looks like loading PSW breaks something | 09:59 |
| timeless | and harmattan has announced a preference for qt | 09:59 |
| RST38h | Or PSL, for that matter... | 09:59 |
| timeless | wah, this power outlet's a dud | 10:00 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 10:03 |
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| anvith3 | we have to develop for the predecessors N8x0 | 10:05 |
| timeless | ok | 10:05 |
| timeless | also please note that there's no official support for atk | 10:06 |
| anvith3 | from what i have dug up till now C is good enuf | 10:06 |
| timeless | ? | 10:06 |
| anvith3 | i wanted to learn python and do something with it | 10:07 |
| anvith3 | but with the time constraints i dunno if it is feasible for me | 10:07 |
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| anvith3 | is C good enough for programming anything for the Maemo OS or NIT | 10:07 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 10:07 |
| * timeless shrugs | 10:08 | |
| timeless | languages aren't interesting | 10:08 |
| * timeless finds power | 10:08 | |
| RST38h | QT will require C++. Currently, you can do stuff in C only. | 10:08 |
| anvith3 | ok | 10:09 |
| anvith3 | like is said i am new to development on maemo | 10:09 |
| RST38h | anvith3: http://maemo.org/development/ | 10:09 |
| anvith3 | so not very well versed with all the IDE's or SDK's | 10:10 |
| anvith3 | yes | 10:10 |
| anvith3 | i have done a bit of research on that | 10:10 |
| anvith3 | :) | 10:10 |
| anvith3 | google and wiki too | 10:10 |
| anvith3 | just wanted to know if there's anyone who has done something on text-to-speech | 10:11 |
| RST38h | there is a package called flite | 10:11 |
| anvith3 | yes | 10:12 |
| anvith3 | i have downloaded it | 10:12 |
| anvith3 | and the source | 10:12 |
| anvith3 | but cant find any active work on it | 10:12 |
| anvith3 | so i assumed its either done before or not very feasible | 10:13 |
| anvith3 | either way i just found the IRC channel | 10:13 |
| anvith3 | i thought this wud be the best place to find out | 10:13 |
| RST38h | Yes, you probably need to do some googling first. | 10:13 |
| RST38h | Find the last flite maintainer, contact him by email, you know... | 10:14 |
| anvith3 | hmm | 10:14 |
| anvith3 | o | 10:14 |
| anvith3 | k | 10:14 |
| anvith3 | i think i'll do that | 10:14 |
| vasily_pupkin | there are to much pain with non-text interaction with ~PC :] | 10:15 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 10:15 |
| anvith3 | on a totally diff not i'm installing scratchbox an am running out of space on my ubuntu home directory | 10:15 |
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| anvith3 | can anyone tell me how to clean up the drive | 10:16 |
| anvith3 | sory for asking this question here | 10:16 |
| vasily_pupkin | uninstall something unused :] | 10:16 |
| dmj726 | remove temporary files | 10:17 |
| vasily_pupkin | or by a new harddrive :D | 10:17 |
| dmj726 | that works! | 10:17 |
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| * timeless cries | 10:20 | |
| timeless | a travel advisory: | 10:21 |
| timeless | > remains closed. Comment and Analysis According to the National Weather Service | 10:21 |
| timeless | > (NWS), the storm system is expected to more eastwards; resulting in rainfall in | 10:21 |
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| * timeless wonders if they were using busybox command completion when writing that bit | 10:21 | |
| RST38h | omg it is RET | 10:24 |
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| timeless | ret? | 10:27 |
| * RST38h wonders if it is worth filing bugs for package management interface | 10:32 | |
| RST38h | 'cause the only possible fix is getting rid of Midgard, it seems =( | 10:32 |
| RST38h | and that is politically unfeasible | 10:33 |
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| Jaffa | RST38h: Package mgmt interface isn't too bad considering its base. I reckon you *can* build really usable interfaces on top of Midgard, it's just a lot more work | 10:39 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: I can't consider base here: the current interface is simply unusable | 10:40 |
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| RST38h | Can't set package author, can't upload screenshots, multiple votes appear for a single voter, the votes are not immediately reflected in the list of packages | 10:41 |
| RST38h | Voting itself takes minutes to complete for each package | 10:41 |
| RST38h | Can't quote the previous commenter (midgard eats > marks) | 10:42 |
| RST38h | I can continue with this crap for a long time, but why not fix it? | 10:42 |
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| RST38h | moo wazd, qwerty | 10:46 |
| qwerty12 | Hiya, RST38h | 10:49 |
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| wazd | heya all :) | 11:03 |
| Jaffa | hi wazd | 11:03 |
| JoeBrain | hellos | 11:04 |
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| anvith3 | need help installing the Maemo SDK Diablo | 11:17 |
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| anvith3 | the libraries were gettin downloaded and i lost power here | 11:18 |
| anvith3 | now do i have to start all over again or is there any way to cntinue | 11:18 |
| anvith3 | i selected the runtime environment + All Dev packages and Dbg packages option | 11:19 |
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| aquatix | good morning all | 11:20 |
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| timeless | sp3000: cloning considered harmful yet hilarious | 11:37 |
| lbt | o/ all | 11:38 |
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| * lbt laughs at tz on the ml | 11:38 | |
| RST38h | Umgh...VS.NET has not heeded "volatile" hint | 11:38 |
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| * timeless pokes lbt | 11:43 | |
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| * lbt rolls over and pretends to sleep | 11:44 | |
| * qwerty12 pours water over lbt | 11:44 | |
| lbt | EEK | 11:44 |
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| timeless | lbt: you're another person who wanted engb1, right? | 11:46 |
| lbt | *nod* | 11:46 |
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| timeless | have you installed it yet? | 11:49 |
| lbt | how? | 11:51 |
| lbt | last time it didn't | 11:51 |
| lbt | IIRC | 11:51 |
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| * lbt looks at the battery cover/stand and wonders how hard it would be for Nokia to make a new cover with a full width stand | 11:54 | |
| * lbt pokes N900 and decides to name it Weeble | 11:55 | |
| Stskeeps | lbt: i think a simple plastic gadget that extends the stand should be posible | 11:55 |
| RST38h | Sts: A pencil! | 11:55 |
| * RST38h tries to figure out which Dr Who to download from torrent: he has not seen any of the latest series incarnation | 11:56 | |
| *** avs has quit IRC | 11:57 | |
| RST38h | Oh yesss, here it is: Series 1 (2006) | 11:57 |
| qwerty12 | Dr Who? The answer to that is easy: Don't download any episodes | 11:58 |
| lbt | buy the BBC DVDs you thief | 11:59 |
| lbt | or you can borrow one of mine | 11:59 |
| SpeedEvil | series 1 was not 2006 | 11:59 |
| SpeedEvil | Also many of the earlier episodes were not kept. | 11:59 |
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| RST38h | And where can I buy BBC DVDs of Dr Who in Moscow? =) | 12:01 |
| RST38h | Speed: They mean the new incarnation by "series 1", I guess | 12:01 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: From a man in a bulky coat? | 12:05 |
| RST38h | Speed: Yea. That would cost me ~$5 for the same files I am downloading from torrent | 12:06 |
| SpeedEvil | Also, I think the BBC shop ships worldwide | 12:09 |
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| aquatix | RST38h: on play.com? | 12:12 |
| * aquatix always buys them there | 12:12 | |
| aquatix | you need to buy in euros to get the shopping-outside-the-UK though | 12:13 |
| aquatix | *shipping | 12:13 |
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| wazd | guys. what's the last firmware for n900 now? | 12:13 |
| RST38h | 41.10 | 12:14 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: We actually have quite a few BBC DVDs, mostly with nature/learning stuff | 12:15 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Widely available here, even translated well. But DrWho has got limited appeal, so no official distribution | 12:16 |
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| Corsac | hey there | 12:29 |
| timeless | heya | 12:29 |
| Jaffa | wazd: Latest, or latest available to us? | 12:31 |
| wazd | Jaffa: available | 12:34 |
| wazd | Jaffa: Vlad asking | 12:34 |
| Jaffa | wazd: as RST38h says, 1.2009.41-10 | 12:34 |
| wazd | thx | 12:35 |
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| * timeless idly pokes jaffa | 12:45 | |
| RST38h | wazd: Vlad should be at the latest version | 12:49 |
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| RST38h | Because 41.10 is what they handed out at the Summit | 12:49 |
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| vasily_pupkin | and how about OMAP2 3D? :] | 12:49 |
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| timeless | whois vlad? :) | 12:51 |
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| anvith3 | qwerty12 are u on se-nse forums as well? | 13:08 |
| qwerty12 | anvith3: Used to be | 13:09 |
| anvith3 | oh ok | 13:09 |
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| anvith3 | i thought i remembered u're id | 13:09 |
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| homeasvs_ | anyone know if it's normal for applets and some other things not to be there in diablo scratchbox ? | 13:38 |
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| Moo___ | does maemo 5 come with qt webkit component (even if it is not used in any app out of the box)? or is there nokia specific component which name is....? | 13:40 |
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| Jaffa | homeasvs_: The Diablo SDK is not an emulator, nor a full-blown environment of the device. It contains the necessary parts to develop applications. | 13:42 |
| homeasvs_ | Jaffa, so it's normal not to be able to install applications, or have applets ? | 13:42 |
| Jaffa | homeasvs_: You can install community-written ones, or write your own. | 13:43 |
| ccooke | Morning, all | 13:44 |
| homeasvs_ | Jaffa, browser, same story ? scratchbox doesn't have a browser that can be installed ? | 13:45 |
| Jaffa | homeasvs_: correct. | 13:45 |
| derf | homeasvs_: The scratchbox environment is pretty limited for testing anything specific to the Maemo environment. Expect to spend a lot of time testing on the actual device. | 13:45 |
| Jaffa | homeasvs_: Well, it has *a* browser, but it's not the Nokia-provoided one | 13:45 |
| homeasvs_ | Jaffa, ah, well, for me none of the browser links there by default work | 13:46 |
| cosmo_ | Moo___: yep it has webkit | 13:47 |
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| Moo___ | cosmo_: thx | 13:48 |
| Moo___ | I am planning to port phonegap for maemo | 13:48 |
| Moo___ | phonegap.com | 13:48 |
| cosmo_ | looks nice.. go ahead | 13:48 |
| cosmo_ | i just ported a desktop qt app to maemo with no trouble | 13:49 |
| cosmo_ | except maemo's qt webkit package is missing phonon dependency, make sure you install phonon also or you'll get linker errors | 13:49 |
| cosmo_ | there's #qt-maemo btw | 13:50 |
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| Jaffa | Why is there a #qt-maemo when Qt is the future platform of Maemo? | 13:52 |
| Jaffa | Seems a bit weird to be off in their own little group | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | signal vs noise maybe | 13:52 |
| Jaffa | Meh. Most of the noise on #maemo is just to fill the time. If there was proper signal, it'd probably drop ;-) | 13:53 |
| qwerty12 | Yeah, I mean, this isn't Talk... | 13:54 |
| * Jaffa is enjoying another talk-free day. Much better for my blood pressure, even when I only read the threads I'm interested in | 13:55 | |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa: But you're missing out on so much | 13:55 |
| qwerty12 | in the competitors forum! | 13:55 |
| qwerty12 | And I have no idea how the fuck that spanned two lines | 13:55 |
| lbt | Jaffa: it was for sprint fixing qt-maemo AFAIK | 13:55 |
| Jaffa | Ah | 13:56 |
| RST38h | FOUND IT | 13:57 |
| RST38h | yahoooo | 13:57 |
| lbt | ME TOO | 13:57 |
| *** trofi has quit IRC | 13:57 | |
| lbt | damn, lost it again | 13:57 |
| jaska | capslock? | 13:57 |
| * RST38h brings up the dead and boots VMX on the corpse | 13:58 | |
| RST38h | Not VMX, VMS, sorry | 13:58 |
| RST38h | VMX would be too scary | 13:58 |
| Jaffa | VMS is *pretty* scary | 13:58 |
| * jaska pets his vax | 13:58 | |
| RST38h | VMS is how operating system should be done | 13:59 |
| Vulcanis | with a chisel and stone tablets? | 13:59 |
| jaska | i should run vms on my n810 in an emulator :| | 13:59 |
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| Jaffa | Didn't someone port Hercules? | 13:59 |
| jaska | well, thatd be mvs (s/390 etc) , not vms :) | 14:00 |
| Anwarboy11 | hello | 14:01 |
| Anwarboy11 | who has a n900 here? | 14:01 |
| Jaffa | jaska: Indeed, but similar sort of cool factor :) | 14:01 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Quite a few. | 14:01 |
| Anwarboy11 | i would like to know | 14:02 |
| Anwarboy11 | what is the youtube playback like on the n900 | 14:02 |
| Anwarboy11 | is it better than iphone? | 14:02 |
| RST38h | iPhone can do Youtube? | 14:02 |
| Vulcanis | out of browser | 14:02 |
| * RST38h though iPhone could not run Flash? | 14:02 | |
| Vulcanis | it has a youtube browsing app | 14:02 |
| auenf | bah, scratchbox wont show the localization strings for me | 14:02 |
| Anwarboy11 | no the iphones utube app is good tho | 14:02 |
| Anwarboy11 | i heard that n900 doesnt allow you to play the higher quality | 14:03 |
| * RST38h suggests stopping to expect from scratchbox normal operation | 14:03 | |
| Vulcanis | anwar: its really not, though | 14:03 |
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| Vulcanis | and if your browser supports flash | 14:03 |
| RST38h | n900 will play HD video | 14:03 |
| Vulcanis | your browser then supports HQ video | 14:03 |
| Anwarboy11 | well anyway, don't you think somone should work on a dedicated youtube application for n900, which enables the higher bitrates | 14:04 |
| RST38h | this has nothing to do with youtube though, youtube and HD video are mutually exclusive | 14:04 |
| RST38h | No. | 14:04 |
| RST38h | But, someone is | 14:04 |
| Anwarboy11 | i mean the hd and hq options in utube | 14:04 |
| Meizirkki | Isn't RX-71 going to have almost the same hardware RX-51 does ? | 14:05 |
| RST38h | + the syringe | 14:05 |
| RST38h | for kool aid injections | 14:05 |
| anvith3 | is there a IRC channel for beginners? | 14:06 |
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| RST38h | aha, Eldar started jerking off at Motorola Droid | 14:07 |
| Anwarboy11 | the n900 has jerky youtube playback, so someone should make a dedicated application for it!!! | 14:07 |
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| RST38h | Interesting | 14:07 |
| RST38h | Anwarboy11: Do you have n900? | 14:07 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Anwarboy11: And you know this from trying one? | 14:07 |
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| Anwarboy11 | nop | 14:08 |
| Anwarboy11 | but its wat keeps poping up an maemo.org | 14:08 |
| Anwarboy11 | in forums | 14:09 |
| Anwarboy11 | im still getting this phone, not tryna put it down | 14:09 |
| Anwarboy11 | i just want someone to make a dedicated youtube app, so the playback can be v-good like iphones | 14:09 |
| Anwarboy11 | plays back in higher quality | 14:09 |
| Meizirkki | ppft | 14:09 |
| Anwarboy11 | also, an app for bbc iplayer | 14:09 |
| RST38h | Anwarboy11: Ok. How long have you been reading maemo.orf forums? | 14:10 |
| Anwarboy11 | as seen iplayer fails on n900 | 14:10 |
| Anwarboy11 | 2 months | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Perfect | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Anwarboy11: It is time for you to write a standalone youtube app for n900 | 14:10 |
| RST38h | Download SDK and start right away! | 14:10 |
| Anwarboy11 | lol | 14:11 |
| Anwarboy11 | i cant code...yet | 14:11 |
| Anwarboy11 | i'm learning tho | 14:11 |
| Anwarboy11 | learning c++ atm | 14:11 |
| qwerty12_N900 | RST38h will also teach you ASM, the easiest language by far | 14:11 |
| Anwarboy11 | asm | 14:11 |
| Anwarboy11 | wots that, it it worth learning | 14:11 |
| auenf | <RST38h> Download SDK and start right away! <-- i'm trying, but the scratchbox doesnt want to show localized strings for me :/ | 14:13 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: YouTube plays very well IME. There is a dedicated viewer app (or two) already | 14:13 |
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| Meizirkki | Anwarboy11, i thknk i have seen a video in youtube of n900 playing a youtube video.. it wasn't jerky | 14:13 |
| Anwarboy11 | where are those apps? | 14:13 |
| Anwarboy11 | but its a desktop vesion and the quality isnt good | 14:14 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: http://maemo.org/packages/view/mytube/ | 14:14 |
| Anwarboy11 | compared to iphone...(sorry for comparison ive just had one ) | 14:14 |
| * qwerty12_N900 is playing a "normal" YouTube video right now and it plays fine | 14:14 | |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/mytube/ | 14:14 |
| Anwarboy11 | ohh nice | 14:14 |
| cvandonderen | qwerty12_N900: well, 800x480 youtube is pretty jerky in cthe browser | 14:14 |
| cvandonderen | those low-res thing work great :-) | 14:15 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/canola2-youtube-plugin/ | 14:15 |
| Jaffa | And there's also a Qt app written by some people that I've not tried (or can find a URL for) | 14:15 |
| Anwarboy11 | i dont knw how qt works | 14:15 |
| Anwarboy11 | can someone explain asm, ? | 14:15 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: It's just a development platform/GUI library | 14:15 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: As a user, you don't care. | 14:16 |
| Anwarboy11 | i do want to learn code | 14:16 |
| Anwarboy11 | im trying c++ buts itsnot that easy :S | 14:17 |
| Anwarboy11 | in maemo extra's wats the difference between armel and i386 | 14:17 |
| vasily_pupkin | Digia@scene just perfect :] | 14:17 |
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| Jaffa | vasily_pupkin: Ah, that's it. | 14:20 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: armel is the processor architecture used by the device. i386 by your desktop. | 14:20 |
| Anwarboy11 | how easy is asm to learn | 14:20 |
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| vasily_pupkin | very easy | 14:20 |
| RST38h | qwerty: I can, for a fee =) | 14:20 |
| Anwarboy11 | does it give me the ability to write an app for maemo tho? | 14:20 |
| RST38h | Anwarboy11: Well, if you can't code it yourself, don't ask other people do it for you, for free =) | 14:20 |
| Anwarboy11 | i would if i could :s | 14:21 |
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| Anwarboy11 | say ive learnt asm then how do i start on maemo | 14:21 |
| RST38h | Anwarboy: Well, it may take you time learning C++, but managing what you ask from other people is something you can start working on right away =) | 14:22 |
| Anwarboy11 | >_< | 14:23 |
| Anwarboy11 | jaffa: armel and i386 which would you chose when you want do download from xtras? | 14:23 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: You don't choose either. What are you doing? Are you going to repository.maemo.org in a web browser? | 14:24 |
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| `0660 | why not just continue programming maemo with asm? | 14:24 |
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| Anwarboy11 | yh | 14:24 |
| `0660 | anwarboy could reverse engineer the 3d driver :) | 14:24 |
| Anwarboy11 | jaffa: im in google chrome | 14:25 |
| vasily_pupkin | :D | 14:25 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Right. That's not how you download applications. Either use the Application Manager on the device, http://maemo.org/downloads/Maemo5/ or apt-get as root in X Terminal. | 14:25 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Navigating a Debian repository in a browser (such as Chrome) is not a fun way to pass the time. | 14:26 |
| vasily_pupkin | Anwarboy11: just RTFM | 14:26 |
| Anwarboy11 | :oh kk ty | 14:26 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: If you want to browse lots of the packages (even those in testing), use http://maemo.org/packages/ | 14:26 |
| Anwarboy11 | yh thats what i was on | 14:26 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Ah, right. For looking at stuff on there, the armel/i386 distinction is not important | 14:27 |
| Anwarboy11 | jaffa:btw i google asm and im reading that its for java development, meamo dont support java? | 14:27 |
| Anwarboy11 | jaffa:kk ty, im just browsing apps realy not dling | 14:27 |
| ifreq | anyone know will there be kismet on the repository? | 14:29 |
| ifreq | it used to be but its gone 4 good :/ | 14:29 |
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| ifreq | ah nvm i see it | 14:30 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Assembler isn't for Java, although there is a low-level Java bytecode manipulation library called asm (used by Hibernate amongst others) | 14:31 |
| Anwarboy11 | hmm | 14:31 |
| * RST38h facepalms | 14:31 | |
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| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: ARM assembler is straightforward, though if you find C++ difficult I wouldn't have thought that assembler was the right route to starting to program. | 14:31 |
| RST38h | (quietly, in the corner, of course) | 14:31 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: Perhaps Python would be a better choice? | 14:31 |
| Anwarboy11 | can you linke me to a decent page about asm which will give me the info i need | 14:31 |
| * qwerty12_N900 whistles and walks away | 14:31 | |
| Anwarboy11 | jaffa: well i didnt find it 'difficult' just tryna get my hed round the boolean | 14:32 |
| RST38h | No, Anwarboy11, you do not really need this info. | 14:32 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: I don't know a good page on ARM assembler. I learnt it from a book in the late 80s published by Dabs Press. | 14:32 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I thought facepalm was programmed in html/js? | 14:32 |
| Anwarboy11 | rst38h:thanks very supportive.... | 14:32 |
| RST38h | Yes, I facepalmed in js. | 14:32 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Quick to develop, slow to execute? | 14:33 |
| Jaffa | :) | 14:33 |
| RST38h | And never to garbage-collect, yes | 14:34 |
| Jaffa | Anwarboy11: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Archimedes-Assembly-Language-Dabhand-Guide/dp/1870336208 is what I learnt from | 14:34 |
| Jaffa | But, seriously, Python. | 14:34 |
| Jaffa | Best bet. | 14:34 |
| Lupu | I'd second that. | 14:35 |
| Lupu | A very good language to get started with. It'll also lower the barrier for C++ if you want to get there later. | 14:36 |
| Anwarboy11 | hmm | 14:38 |
| Anwarboy11 | thanks | 14:38 |
| Anwarboy11 | thats wat the 1st guy i talked to told me | 14:38 |
| Anwarboy11 | then a group of seconds told me pyton is crap go with c++ | 14:38 |
| Anwarboy11 | i think ill go back to python | 14:38 |
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| RST38h | until the next group tells you that python is indeed crap? :) | 14:39 |
| derf | Python is crap. | 14:39 |
| Anwarboy11 | yh | 14:39 |
| derf | You should learn it. | 14:39 |
| Anwarboy11 | kk | 14:39 |
| Anwarboy11 | so forget about asm | 14:39 |
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| derf | Unless you're programming for a 286. | 14:40 |
| Anwarboy11 | 286? | 14:41 |
| RST38h | derf: Your humor is falling on the deaf ears here: he does not know what 286 is | 14:42 |
| RST38h | (and how should he know?) | 14:42 |
| derf | RST38h: I think this is the part where I brandish my walker and mutter something about lawns. | 14:42 |
| Anwarboy11 | go ahead... | 14:42 |
| RST38h | Yea | 14:43 |
| Anwarboy11 | The Intel 80286[1], introduced on February 1, 1982, (originally named 80286, and also called iAPX 286 in the programmer's manual) was an x86 16-bit microprocessor with 134,000 transistors. It was the first Intel processor that could run all the software written for its predecessor[2] . | 14:43 |
| Anwarboy11 | It was widely used in IBM PC compatible computers during the mid 1980s to early 1990s, starting when IBM first used it in the IBM PC/AT in 1984. | 14:43 |
| RST38h | You need to know of 286 no more than you need to know of assembly language | 14:43 |
| RST38h | Google? :) | 14:43 |
| Anwarboy11 | wiki :) | 14:43 |
| RST38h | Anyways, download Python for Windows and learn programming in it. | 14:43 |
| Anwarboy11 | kk | 14:43 |
| RST38h | It sounds like a good first step of the plan | 14:43 |
| Anwarboy11 | yup | 14:44 |
| Anwarboy11 | can python be coded in codeblocks | 14:45 |
| derf | Soon we'll be dealing with kids whose _parents_ weren't alive in 1982. | 14:45 |
| v2px | oh shit | 14:45 |
| RST38h | Codeblocks is another concept you do not need to care at the moment | 14:46 |
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| RST38h | what you need to care about is Python for Windows and a good Python guide with examples | 14:47 |
| RST38h | The remaining words you have found with google will make no sense at the moment and they should not | 14:47 |
| gomiam | enri | 14:48 |
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| Anwarboy11 | kk | 14:51 |
| Anwarboy11 | ty guys | 14:51 |
| Anwarboy11 | cya l8r | 14:51 |
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| ayanes | Hi all | 14:51 |
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| timeless | hey, where's that maemo.org avi? | 15:00 |
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| pupnik | i had flashbacks to programming at 11 | 15:03 |
| pupnik | time | 15:03 |
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| * timeless pokes pupnik | 15:05 | |
| timeless | where was the avi that someone made w/ the maemo.org logo? | 15:05 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | timeless: GA did one: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/maemo.org-startup3.mov | 15:07 |
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| timeless | thanks | 15:09 |
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| timeless | thanks | 15:10 |
| timeless | i want the black one | 15:10 |
| timeless | i want the black one | 15:11 |
| timeless | hrm, not 2 | 15:11 |
| timeless | there was a later one | 15:12 |
| timeless | the one where .org exposes later | 15:12 |
| * timeless finds flyby in a thread | 15:14 | |
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| timeless | ~ $ sudo gainroot | 15:21 |
| timeless | sh: --use-su: unknown operand | 15:21 |
| timeless | Root shell enabled | 15:21 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Yeah, update rootsh | 15:21 |
| timeless | eh, why did updating rootsh cause sudo gainroot to spit that out? | 15:21 |
| timeless | i just did! | 15:22 |
| pvanhoof | "<derf> Soon we'll be dealing with kids whose _parents_ weren't alive in 1982." Yeah, i was born in 1981 and if I would have wanted kids they'd now be about around 8 years old I guess. So that's just a few more years :) | 15:22 |
| pvanhoof | The little geniuses might already be around hacking like the people we now call old-Amiga-farts used to when they were eight | 15:23 |
| qwerty12_N900 | timeless: Gah, it's working here. I'll take a look in a few hours, after all, it is extras-devel :) | 15:23 |
| SpeedEvil | Grandparents if they were in some areas. | 15:23 |
| derf | Back then we learned BASIC instead of Python. | 15:23 |
| derf | And we liked it. | 15:23 |
| pvanhoof | Hey X-Fade , thanks for adding Jannis. He's all happy and stuff :) | 15:23 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12_N900: I've added a screenshot to ttf-droid in downloads; hope you don't mind | 15:23 |
| _Pete_ | pvanhoof: count me in, since I am one | 15:23 |
| SpeedEvil | The populations of which feature heavily in daytime TV. | 15:23 |
| pvanhoof | _Pete_, an old amiga fart? :) | 15:24 |
| _Pete_ | yes | 15:24 |
| * SpeedEvil saw an amiga once. | 15:24 | |
| pvanhoof | Cool, I'm just a sleazy XT fart, telix, terminate, etc etc | 15:24 |
| _Pete_ | copper is my friend | 15:24 |
| pvanhoof | But Mod Tracker was great | 15:25 |
| _Pete_ | and blitter | 15:25 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Jaffa: Oh, crap, I forgot that promoting automatically adds an entry to downloads; I still have the chinook/diablo mentality where I think you have to create an entry manually. Thanks! | 15:25 |
| * SpeedEvil went zx80, zx81, pcw8512, then I defected from the z80 to 808*, and went to an amstrad PC2386 (20MHz 386) | 15:25 | |
| _Pete_ | and 68kcpu asm | 15:25 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12_N900: No probs. | 15:25 |
| SpeedEvil | err | 15:25 |
| derf | Maybe you guys should've let him learn asm. Builds character. | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | zx81, spectrum, pcw8512 | 15:26 |
| SpeedEvil | derf: there are better ways. For example, roll some d6's. | 15:26 |
| _Pete_ | pvanhoof: so I assume you know what those mean? | 15:26 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Jaffa: Let me just multiply that thanks by 10. I forgot how painful it is to add a screenshot | 15:27 |
| pvanhoof | _Pete_, I never really used an Amiga, I think those are chips right? | 15:27 |
| pvanhoof | Blitter and Copper | 15:28 |
| _Pete_ | pvanhoof: right enough | 15:28 |
| pvanhoof | My dad was lame enough to go with XT, AT and later 386 before I bought my first p60. I never owned an Amiga :( | 15:29 |
| _Pete_ | poor dad then :) | 15:29 |
| _Pete_ | being one myself | 15:29 |
| _Pete_ | cant say much more | 15:29 |
| pvanhoof | Well, I was smart enough to learn myself pascal and later delphi, instead of listening to the strange basic guys :) | 15:30 |
| _Pete_ | :) | 15:30 |
| pvanhoof | And then 'this guy' installed linux on my machine | 15:30 |
| _Pete_ | well | 15:30 |
| _Pete_ | I was aged with C64/amiga | 15:30 |
| pvanhoof | And from that point in time, it didn't matter anymore what hardware you had :) | 15:30 |
| zaheerm | makes me feel old hearing that | 15:31 |
| _Pete_ | and did some demos also | 15:31 |
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| zaheerm | i started with my own zx spectrum 48k, then a bbc master, then a 12MHz 286 | 15:31 |
| pvanhoof | _Pete_, I did play sk8ordie very often at friends and once it was ported to DOS | 15:31 |
| pvanhoof | Being a skateboarder myself :) | 15:31 |
| pvanhoof | That was a C64 game I think | 15:32 |
| _Pete_ | but I still remember those blitter things | 15:32 |
| _Pete_ | = was like you put the starting region in mem | 15:34 |
| _Pete_ | to certain mem | 15:34 |
| _Pete_ | and where to it ends | 15:35 |
| _Pete_ | and the hit a go | 15:35 |
| _Pete_ | and the blitter did it for you | 15:35 |
| sp3000 | timeless: what, cloning, who, where? | 15:36 |
| timeless | see msg | 15:36 |
| timeless | brb, rebooting | 15:37 |
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| timeless | ok, splash screen updated :) | 15:39 |
| ifreq | jetpack on zx spectrum.. oh the golden times | 15:40 |
| ifreq | :-) | 15:40 |
| RST38h | Which reminds me that only 2 (two) people voted for Speccy in Extras-testing | 15:41 |
| RST38h | And one of them is myself | 15:41 |
| RST38h | (thanks lcuk =)) | 15:44 |
| _Pete_ | my favo games on c64 are: | 15:45 |
| _Pete_ | usagi yojimbo | 15:45 |
| _Pete_ | commando | 15:45 |
| timeless | speccy? | 15:45 |
| _Pete_ | never used that | 15:45 |
| timeless | qwerty: why doesn't this do what i want: | 15:45 |
| timeless | zenity --file-selection '--title=Select Video' '--file-filter=Movies | *.avi *.mov' '--file-filter=QuickTime | *.mov' '--file-filter=MS AVI | *.avi' /home/user/MyDocs/.videos/ | 15:45 |
| RST38h | ahha, ver_misc passed, next unit test | 15:49 |
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| wazd | http://cgi.ebay.com/9.5%22-LCD-TOUCHSCREEN-MONITOR-VGA--CAR-PC-CARPUTER-NR_W0QQitemZ290275309690QQcmdZViewItem?rvr_id=&itemid=290275309690 Á- 9.5 | 15:53 |
| wazd | 9.5" touchscreen - $999 | 15:54 |
| wazd | http://www.gadgetadvisor.com/computer-hardware/nanovision-mimo-7-usb-touch-screen-monitor 7" touchscreen with webcam - 150$ | 15:54 |
| RST38h | "Add ARM CPU with Linux OS for +$50" ? :) | 15:55 |
| wazd | seriously, this life has absolutely no sense :) | 15:56 |
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| RST38h | You mean life rotating around gadgets? =) | 15:57 |
| wazd | especialy :D | 15:57 |
| RST38h | screw the gadgets then | 15:58 |
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| sp3000 | timeless: oh, right, I looked at it and looked for cloning and missed it :) | 16:00 |
| timeless | but you got it now? | 16:01 |
| timeless | cute, eh? | 16:01 |
| sp3000 | yeah, waking up helps | 16:01 |
| timeless | heh | 16:01 |
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| * timeless wants to stab those guys | 16:02 | |
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| RST38h | Ehehehe, Eldar says he is already using N950 prototype and it "is more stable than N900" | 16:04 |
| * RST38h gets some popcorn and waits for some enterprising t.m.o member to run this through google translate | 16:05 | |
| Stskeeps | poor guy | 16:05 |
| wazd | more stable = doesn't expoding in hands? :) | 16:07 |
| wazd | exploding* | 16:07 |
| RST38h | No idea what he means | 16:07 |
| Stskeeps | he probably got a zoom2 and thought it was a n950 | 16:07 |
| * RST38h does not even know what makes N900 "unstable" | 16:08 | |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: It's very unstable. | 16:08 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: that little stand... It's pathetic! | 16:08 |
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| RST38h | Twue | 16:08 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i only have issues with browser personally | 16:08 |
| Stskeeps | that brings down the system | 16:08 |
| cosmo_ | maybe N950 is already released in asia | 16:08 |
| lcuk | thats cos you shouldnt be browsing techpron on it | 16:09 |
| cosmo_ | like the N900 | 16:09 |
| zaheerm | to compile a C hildonapp is it hildon-1 i need to use with pkg-config to get cflags and libs? | 16:09 |
| lcuk | igagis, are you awake now | 16:10 |
| RST38h | Sts: Well I have lots of issues (see bugzilla) but none of them can qualify toward "unstable" | 16:10 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah, i haven't had a wd reboot in ages | 16:10 |
| * lcuk rolls eyes @ the maemo servers. | 16:11 | |
| lcuk | an enterprising individual can up/down vote apps at least 4 times | 16:11 |
| Stskeeps | i have managed to get stuck but i think HD will fix that | 16:12 |
| * RST38h adds lcuk to the queue | 16:12 | |
| derf | lcuk: As long as that number's a _small_ constant, it probably doesn't matter in the scheme of things. | 16:13 |
| lcuk | Stskeeps, HD==hildon desktop? | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 16:13 |
| RST38h | lcuk: see #maemo log about 4 hours into the past to see me bitching about it =) | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | as in, the fixes already in gitorious | 16:13 |
| lcuk | derf, for 10 votes, its possible for a single person to upvote so far 4 times seen | 16:13 |
| lcuk | RST38h, was sleeping | 16:13 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: BTW, could you quicky check my apps in Testing (starting with Speccy and fMSX) and vote them up? | 16:13 |
| lcuk | yeah sts i checked out the desktop yesterday and was havin a bit of a poke around | 16:14 |
| Stskeeps | mm, after lunch | 16:14 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Because at this rate, it does not look like they will be getting into Extras any time soon | 16:14 |
| Stskeeps | k | 16:14 |
| RST38h | Stskeeps: Yea, whenever you have time. Thanks | 16:14 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: my worry is that my QA will be disturbed by the batshit insane stuff i do to my n900 though :) | 16:15 |
| RST38h | Sts: Probably not: all my apps are very dumb in terms of system requirements | 16:15 |
| lcuk | you think you make your n900 do insane things?!! | 16:15 |
| timeless | sts: so have you installed the updated english packages | 16:15 |
| timeless | we have enus and engb | 16:15 |
| lbt | any reason that busybox.deb isn't in http://repository.maemo.org/pool/fremantle/free/b/busybox/ | 16:16 |
| RST38h | does not have an icon / does not belong to user/ packages? | 16:17 |
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| lcuk | not optified! | 16:17 |
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| RST38h | moo javispedro | 16:19 |
| javispedro | morning | 16:19 |
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| RST38h | Evolution's Path May Lead To Shorter, Heavier Women! | 16:22 |
| RST38h | (well, they did that research in Massachusetts, so no wonder) | 16:23 |
| lcuk | in certain places of the world, that is already happening | 16:24 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Do I hear bitterness in your voice? =) | 16:24 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, I voted your apps, can't see your vote in mine :P | 16:24 |
| VDVsx | lol | 16:24 |
| lcuk | not at all! | 16:24 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Actually, I remember voting for BlueMaemo | 16:25 |
| RST38h | A moment | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, that one is not in extras | 16:25 |
| lcuk | this isnt abotu gentlemans club | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | I'm joking | 16:25 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Which one then? | 16:25 |
| lcuk | get voting for the other fun apps | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, true | 16:25 |
| lcuk | and mine too :P | 16:25 |
| lcuk | i really want to vote for bullshitbingo | 16:26 |
| lcuk | its fun | 16:26 |
| lcuk | but i dont like the name | 16:26 |
| lcuk | and i cant let jake play | 16:26 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, supertux, but only if you use it/ tested it :) | 16:26 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Is it optified? | 16:26 |
| lcuk | i play supertux all the time | 16:26 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: The name is awesome | 16:26 |
| lcuk | but i havent tested the new version | 16:26 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, fully | 16:26 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Installing then | 16:26 |
| lcuk | RST38h, its actually quite solid | 16:26 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, no maemo-optifiy bulshit anymore :P | 16:26 |
| RST38h | Lcuk's stuff I tested already, gonna vote for it | 16:27 |
| VDVsx | ahahha, my device is bricked | 16:27 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Yours is not in -Testing either? | 16:27 |
| VDVsx | don't boot | 16:27 |
| RST38h | Oh. | 16:27 |
| javispedro | VDVsx: wow | 16:28 |
| RST38h | There was some guy yesterday who has done apt-get upgrade and bricked his n900 | 16:28 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: Supertux's fault, I bet ;) | 16:28 |
| VDVsx | probably full rootfs | 16:28 |
| lcuk | RST38h, liqflow liqtorch. im getting these right first | 16:28 |
| javispedro | what a mess. | 16:28 |
| lcuk | onedotzero is there but its not a user app | 16:28 |
| * VDVsx flash it | 16:28 | |
| javispedro | you have fw images already? | 16:28 |
| VDVsx | errr | 16:28 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: how do you not get liqtorch "right"? :) | 16:29 |
| lcuk | lol qwerty | 16:29 |
| RST38h | lcuk: I do not see them in -testing list, although I remember testing liqflow | 16:29 |
| lcuk | i left the rocket pencil on | 16:29 |
| lcuk | feature creep | 16:29 |
| javispedro | qwerty12_N900: the light color was slightly biased to pink | 16:29 |
| qwerty12_N900 | javispedro: People who got their devices outside of the Summit have them | 16:29 |
| lcuk | RST38h, page 2 | 16:29 |
| lcuk | lol javispedro | 16:29 |
| qwerty12_N900 | javispedro: Ah... | 16:29 |
| lcuk | qwerty12_N900, its the packaging and icon and making sure it works that matters | 16:29 |
| lcuk | i still have the zoomout problem to solve | 16:30 |
| lcuk | before i can push other things | 16:30 |
| * lcuk is getting things right first | 16:30 | |
| RST38h | lcuk: yeah, there it is, voting | 16:30 |
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| lcuk | so i can template and just make apps | 16:30 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N900, signed so I can't pass them around ;) | 16:30 |
| VDVsx | S/I/we/ | 16:30 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: For a reason: Your eMMC image has those custom changes to the videos you asked for | 16:31 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N900, true ;) | 16:32 |
| VDVsx | a special image that hides stuff ;) | 16:32 |
| lcuk | what was wrong with moobox | 16:32 |
| VDVsx | dunno | 16:32 |
| qwerty12_N900 | WTF is a "moobox"? | 16:33 |
| lcuk | a cup you turn upside down and it moos | 16:33 |
| lcuk | as a kid my nana had one | 16:33 |
| lcuk | i used to get it out of the cupboard and play :D | 16:33 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Ohh, Maemo's equivalent to iFart | 16:33 |
| lcuk | no, thats StsFarts | 16:34 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Problem with Moobox was that it still took 3% CPU when in the background. | 16:34 |
| javispedro | iFart app taking CPU ? | 16:34 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: SuperTUX feels pretty perfect, voting | 16:34 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, do you expect people to run moobox for 24hours? | 16:35 |
| qwerty12_N900 | javispedro: Well, it does like to put extra power into its output... | 16:35 |
| lcuk | how can it be fixed | 16:35 |
| lcuk | is the dev around to help him? | 16:35 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, mostly thanks to mikkov_ testing and suggestions ;) | 16:35 |
| lcuk | wicked! i see the problem | 16:36 |
| lcuk | it moos even if in the background | 16:36 |
| lcuk | this needs to be a widget lol | 16:36 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Care to check/vot: Speccy, fMSX, iNES, VGB, MG, ColEm? | 16:36 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: I don't want my son to leave moobox running in the background and me come back to a dead tablet :-p | 16:36 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: First two can be tested without any extra roms | 16:36 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, need to flash first ;) | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Given that you can subscribe to accelerometer events, it shouldn't need to do any parsing | 16:37 |
| RST38h | Oh. Shit. | 16:37 |
| RST38h | Sorry :) | 16:37 |
| lcuk | jaffa of course, but if he leaves it in the foreground it will still drain | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Sometimes iNES gets itself stuck (usually playing Super Mario and dying; I can't restart a game and it stays in a demo mode) | 16:37 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: BTW, the subscription stuff does not seem to be active now | 16:37 |
| lcuk | "accelerometer events" ? | 16:37 |
| lcuk | there is a "moo!" event in the system? | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Not if it listened for screen lock. | 16:37 |
| * SpeedEvil lols. | 16:37 | |
| RST38h | Jaffa: This sounds more like the bug with the game, so exiting iNES and getting back in should fix it | 16:38 |
| SpeedEvil | The n900 keyboard is possibly more tactile than the speccy. | 16:38 |
| javispedro | SpeedEvil: see, were trying to outcompete the iphone here. | 16:38 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Or "Reset" from the menu | 16:38 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Not really | 16:38 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Reset didn't. It felt like a keyboard input issue, but that's just a guess. | 16:38 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: well - the zx81 certainly. | 16:38 |
| javispedro | at least it's more tacticle | 16:38 |
| javispedro | than that, yes :) | 16:38 |
| javispedro | you read my mind :) | 16:38 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Anyway, you can get notified about drastic changes in orientation, that would be sufficient for moobox :-p | 16:38 |
| lcuk | moobox uses complex equations to dynamically simulate the high resolution moobox implementation | 16:39 |
| lcuk | anytihng else just feels wrong imho | 16:39 |
| VDVsx | lol removed the bat and it's working again, no need to flash | 16:39 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: Sounds pretty weird, given how insulated Maemo input code is from the game itself | 16:39 |
| lcuk | ok, is the code somewhere | 16:39 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: That is the original Mario World 1? | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | RST38h: Super Mario Bros | 16:40 |
| * Jaffa will do some more testing and then thumb iNES up. | 16:40 | |
| RST38h | Ok, I will play it for a while, let us see what is going on | 16:40 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: test 'em all if possible: I am afraid that stuff like Speccy or fMSX or ColEm will never get in | 16:41 |
| javispedro | it does still get in after 10 days, don't it? | 16:41 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, About your emus, I would like to see a title screen with a button, instead the file manager, looks more professional IMO ;) | 16:41 |
| RST38h | javis: Nope | 16:42 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Maybe, but I suspect you would never say that if you have not seen DrNokSNES :) | 16:42 |
| timeless | ok, boarded flight to SFO | 16:42 |
| lcuk | timeless, didnt you do that 12 hrs ago? | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: you are on holiday these days? you sure get around | 16:42 |
| timeless | this is business | 16:43 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, true ;) | 16:43 |
| timeless | lcuk: that was HEL to MUC | 16:43 |
| lcuk | ahhh | 16:43 |
| timeless | the layover sucked | 16:43 |
| lcuk | :( | 16:43 |
| * RST38h is fine with the file manager at the moment: there are no other options to set on startup other than selecting a file, and no SDL to take care of | 16:43 | |
| VDVsx | timeless, ohh big trip ;) | 16:43 |
| lcuk | ok moobox uses a 200ms callback | 16:43 |
| RST38h | Some nicer about screen would be nice, I guess | 16:43 |
| lcuk | can you pause/restart items added with g_timeout_add ( | 16:44 |
| lcuk | or can he just check a flag when it fires | 16:44 |
| javispedro | delete and readd them | 16:44 |
| lcuk | and if out of focus leave the rest of the function | 16:44 |
| javispedro | nope, it would be better to remove the timer | 16:44 |
| lcuk | ok | 16:44 |
| lcuk | lemme just see what events are firing | 16:45 |
| lcuk | the ui does nothing other than show a pic | 16:45 |
| timeless | anyway, i'll be offline for a while | 16:45 |
| * RST38h wonders if he can build file selector *into* the title screen | 16:45 | |
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| RST38h | Would be nice | 16:45 |
| timeless | have fun and play nice | 16:45 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/packages/source/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_source/moobox/0.1/ | 16:45 |
| javispedro | cy timeless | 16:45 |
| javispedro | rootsh got a bugfix? | 16:46 |
| javispedro | what did qwerty12_N900 break this time? :) | 16:46 |
| VDVsx | timeless, you can have 'cheap' internet at SFO airport in case you don't know ;) | 16:46 |
| * timeless thinks it got a bug | 16:46 | |
| timeless | vdvsx: i think i learned that last time i flew through | 16:47 |
| VDVsx | eheh | 16:47 |
| RST38h | Jaffa: BTW, I think you can vote multiple times right now, so you can fix your -1 on SuperTux by voting +1 twice more :) | 16:47 |
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| VDVsx | timeless, I'm used to the European prices ;) | 16:47 |
| qwerty12_N900 | javispedro: Some fixes, but one bug added. Will fix soon. Depreciated the "rootsh" command due to security concerns | 16:47 |
| javispedro | uh | 16:47 |
| javispedro | security concerns in a tablet? | 16:48 |
| timeless | depreciate is a financial term | 16:48 |
| * javispedro edits his maemo virus so to use sudo gainroot instead of rootsh | 16:48 | |
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| timeless | you want deprecate | 16:49 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Thanks | 16:49 |
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| RST38h | defenestrate is a better substitute | 16:49 |
| timeless | anyway, cells die now :( | 16:49 |
| * VDVsx take over javispedro's tablet | 16:49 | |
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| RST38h | VDVsx: he has only got N8x0, so why care? :) | 16:49 |
| javispedro | good luck -- it's actingdead | 16:49 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, can't select the options in speccy | 16:51 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Not sure I get the point of bullshitbingo, but, hey, it works and the name is awesome | 16:51 |
| VDVsx | only tape loader | 16:51 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: this is ZX128 , press shift+arrow | 16:52 |
| * RST38h disclaims any responsibility for the horrible Sinclair "UI" =) | 16:52 | |
| VDVsx | ah | 16:53 |
| * SpeedEvil ponders tape-loader over GSM. | 16:53 | |
| RST38h | Speed: We would have it, if Sir Sinclair got to design GSM | 16:53 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, can I run a game here, lol | 16:54 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: For quick fun, worldofspectrum has got .sna/.z80 games | 16:54 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: yes - but how would it incorporate washing machine parts. | 16:54 |
| RST38h | And your joystick is set to CURSOR by default, remember that | 16:54 |
| RST38h | Speed: Isn't Sir Sinclair still alive? You can probably email him this question | 16:55 |
| GiantTalkingCow | When it came to computers from the UK, I'd take an Acorn machine over a Sinclair... too bad RiscOS never really caught on outside of a few niches. | 16:55 |
| * RST38h out for now (need to do stuff outside) | 16:55 | |
| RST38h | Gieant: Like...Symbian? :) | 16:55 |
| GiantTalkingCow | I wasn't aware it was based off of RiscOS. Anyhow, I was referring to its desktop incarnation. | 16:56 |
| zaheerm | is there any easy way of having an embedded browser widget in a hildon app? | 17:01 |
| ali12341 | can anyone get decent sound out of fmradio? to me it sounds like it's playing unsigned PCM as signed or something | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, I tried to open a .tzx file and nothing happened | 17:03 |
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| ali12341 | either that or the capture level is wrong and the sound is horribly clipped | 17:04 |
| * lcuk cleans up glass, rounds up the children, stops ww3 between the cats and finally finds time to make a brew | 17:06 | |
| * Stskeeps needs beer after family in law tried to rearrange our apartment. | 17:07 | |
| lcuk | zaheerm, are you the guy that asked in t/m/o ? cos i dont think there is a tidy complete solution yet for all cases | 17:07 |
| lcuk | yikes Stskeeps | 17:07 |
| zaheerm | no i'm not | 17:07 |
| lcuk | feng shui? | 17:07 |
| lcuk | well zaheerm there was an identical question asked in tmo | 17:07 |
| zaheerm | i am porting an iphone app which is basically a bunch of html linked to bu UI buttons | 17:08 |
| lcuk | lemme just find oyu a link you are better discussing with like minded folks | 17:08 |
| lcuk | ewww ports | 17:08 |
| VDVsx | zaheer_, you probably can do it with Qt-webkit | 17:08 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, ^ | 17:08 |
| zaheerm | i think i'm gonna convert the htmls into some rich set of fremantle widgets and text views | 17:08 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, i don't want to use qt, more of a gtk man myself | 17:09 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, but yah it's an idea | 17:09 |
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| lcuk | just make the app in gtk then | 17:09 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, GTK-webit ? | 17:09 |
| lcuk | why does it have to remain html | 17:09 |
| javispedro | but isn't the issue the fact that basically hildon desktop widgets can't pan? | 17:09 |
| zaheerm | yah i'm gonna gtk-ify it | 17:09 |
| zaheerm | javispedro, not making a desktop widget | 17:10 |
| lcuk | javispedro, widgets on the desktop cant | 17:10 |
| lcuk | but widgets embedded in apps can do what they like | 17:10 |
| lcuk | the desktop is a special case subset of what a normal GTK widget is capable of | 17:10 |
| zaheerm | lcuk, yah i'm gonna convert the html to text views to start with | 17:10 |
| lcuk | and gtk widgets have panned for years before the new desktop arrived | 17:10 |
| javispedro | then the issue is? doesn't webkit-eal work? | 17:10 |
| lcuk | does it work or is it good | 17:10 |
| javispedro | err.. | 17:11 |
| javispedro | microb-eal | 17:11 |
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| lcuk | its easy to make something work | 17:11 |
| javispedro | considering its what the builtin browser uses.... | 17:11 |
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| lcuk | wheres some examples in use? | 17:11 |
| lcuk | even from the desktop/gnome end? | 17:11 |
| javispedro | none. THIS. IS. MAEEMOO!!! >:) | 17:12 |
| lcuk | fsck that | 17:12 |
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| lcuk | you are talking about combining 2 widgets | 17:12 |
| lcuk | not bringing a mega app in | 17:12 |
| zaheerm | javispedro, where is the microb-eal api? | 17:12 |
| lcuk | zaheerm what html requirements do you have | 17:13 |
| javispedro | or wait for the Nokia WRT | 17:13 |
| lcuk | is it just a quick layout you need it for | 17:13 |
| lcuk | or does it do complex stuff | 17:13 |
| zaheerm | text + links, but i'll convert them to PannableArea with a TextView i think | 17:13 |
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| lcuk | zaheerm might be simplest for now | 17:15 |
| zaheerm | it'll be better in the long run | 17:15 |
| javispedro | zaheerm: can't find them, but the source package uses doxygen. | 17:16 |
| romaxa | GeoLocation provider extension available here: http://hg.mozilla.org/users/romaxa_gmail.com/maemo-geolocation/ | 17:16 |
| romaxa | http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/geolocation/ - tested with this page, seems to works fine | 17:16 |
| lcuk | javispedro, if an app wanted to operate only when it was topmost, it would listen for the "window-state-event" event and check its topmost, right? | 17:19 |
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| javispedro | guess so, but never tried. | 17:20 |
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| lcuk | how do you sleep when not topmost? | 17:20 |
| lcuk | when panned back | 17:20 |
| qwerty12_N900 | g_signal_connect(hildonwindow, "notify::is-topmost" | 17:21 |
| sp3000 | depends on how heavy ...oh | 17:21 |
| javispedro | none of my apps do that currently. | 17:21 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Fill in the blanks :) | 17:21 |
| lcuk | and im guessing you are running at more than 3% idle | 17:21 |
| javispedro | yep. | 17:21 |
| * lcuk nods | 17:21 | |
| javispedro | it would break the nice presentation urho did while showing mario running composited :) | 17:22 |
| lcuk | i know | 17:22 |
| lcuk | thats the problem moobox has | 17:22 |
| lcuk | and it got seriously bashed for the same problem | 17:22 |
| javispedro | interesting issue. | 17:23 |
| lcuk | now, moobox is about as simple an app as possible, it would be nice to fix it up and show it as its meant to work | 17:23 |
| lcuk | so we can point developers to an app in extras which is understandable | 17:23 |
| lbt | qwerty12_N900 has the right design | 17:23 |
| lcuk | and follows the guidelines | 17:24 |
| RST38h | back | 17:24 |
| javispedro | i'm not so happy with the idea of apps pausing when going to the background | 17:24 |
| javispedro | why are we multitasking for then. | 17:24 |
| lcuk | for some apps its right | 17:25 |
| lcuk | for most, infact its right | 17:25 |
| RST38h | javis: for games, I want it to pause when I leave it | 17:25 |
| lbt | javispedro we should notify them of their presentational state | 17:25 |
| lcuk | ok, can we have a brainstorm on what could happen here | 17:25 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/packages/source/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_source/moobox/0.1/ | 17:25 |
| lbt | front/composite/hidden | 17:25 |
| RST38h | javis: having said that, I can switch it off, with a command line option, but always do sleep-on-focus-out by default | 17:25 |
| lcuk | and possible put some patches towards the dev to help him | 17:25 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: I wasn't lying: "is-topmost" is a property of a HildonWindow... | 17:26 |
| lcuk | qwerty12_N900, but how is that implemented, can you make the 10 line patch? is that possible? | 17:26 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: you use notify::property signal to check for changes to a property | 17:27 |
| RST38h | You are complicating things. | 17:28 |
| javispedro | also, SDL has the 10ms timer always ticking in. The only way to power save in a SDL app is to just shut it down | 17:28 |
| RST38h | Checking for focus-in/focus-out events is sufficient | 17:28 |
| * javispedro feels a dejàvú | 17:28 | |
| RST38h | javis: Ditch SDL then | 17:28 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | rst38h: Not complicated at all; even I can do it... | 17:28 |
| javispedro | RST38h: planning to do that in DrNokSnes. Not planning to do that in OpenTTD. | 17:28 |
| * RST38h has been shown light by romaxa and fixed his apps to suspend timer on focus-out | 17:28 | |
| lcuk | :) RST38h | 17:29 |
| RST38h | javis: Yea, I guess OpenTTD is out of the question :( | 17:29 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: If no-one steps up to the plate in 30 mins, give me a shout | 17:29 |
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| lcuk | cool qwerty | 17:29 |
| * javispedro doesn't like the idea of "paused" multitasking | 17:29 | |
| lcuk | RST38h, which app is that, can you point me to it and ill have a go at patching moobox | 17:29 |
| lcuk | javispedro, its just being busy when its not needed | 17:30 |
| lcuk | some apps want it | 17:30 |
| lcuk | others dont | 17:30 |
| javispedro | well, I wouldn't expect the calendar app to use CPU when idle. | 17:30 |
| lcuk | the one i expect to use cpu is the clock | 17:30 |
| javispedro | but I would expect the browser to do that while showing a flash laden page. | 17:30 |
| lcuk | which doesnt ;) | 17:30 |
| RST38h | lcuk: everything based on EMULib, with source code released for ColEm, at least. The problem is, the latest source code has nto been released yet | 17:31 |
| lcuk | ahhh right | 17:31 |
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| RST38h | So, I will just copy&paste from it, a moment | 17:31 |
| lcuk | i thought you were talking about a normal gtk app | 17:31 |
| javispedro | what are we going to do? pause youtube videos when the browser is not in the front? so much for multitasking -- then why don't shut down the apps and free memory while we're at it. | 17:31 |
| lcuk | javispedro, no | 17:31 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, where's the action button in colem ? | 17:32 |
| lcuk | this isnt a fix everything and please dont go on the defensive | 17:32 |
| lcuk | some apps make sense when they have focus | 17:32 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Q/W, or use screen cues | 17:32 |
| lcuk | others dont | 17:32 |
| javispedro | lcuk: sorry. | 17:32 |
| RST38h | lcuk: I am a pretty normal gtk app :) | 17:32 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Check here: | 17:32 |
| RST38h | static gint GTKFocusHandler(GtkWidget *SrcWidget,GdkEventFocus *Event,gpointer Arg); | 17:32 |
| lcuk | lol rst | 17:32 |
| qwerty12_N900 | osso_hw_set_display_event_cb() is an alternative but only works when the display goes off, not if the display is on and it's out of focus | 17:32 |
| RST38h | g_signal_connect(G_OBJECT(HWnd),"focus_in_event",G_CALLBACK(GTKFocusHandler),0); | 17:32 |
| RST38h | g_signal_connect(G_OBJECT(HWnd),"focus_out_event",G_CALLBACK(GTKFocusHandler),0); | 17:32 |
| RST38h | lcuk: In GTKFocusHandler you set a variable, like FocusOUT=1 | 17:33 |
| lcuk | nahh ill just kill the timer | 17:33 |
| lcuk | and reenable on focus in | 17:33 |
| lcuk | thanks! | 17:33 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Well, do you block in gkt loop now? | 17:34 |
| lcuk | i dont do anything | 17:34 |
| lcuk | its just got a simple gtk window and a 200ms callback timer | 17:34 |
| lcuk | it just needs to enable/disable that timer | 17:34 |
| RST38h | Well you sitll have gtk event loop don't you? | 17:34 |
| lcuk | there is | 17:34 |
| lcuk | but theres no visible code, its all in gtk_main | 17:35 |
| RST38h | so, with focusout==1, you want to BLOCK in that loop | 17:35 |
| RST38h | ok | 17:35 |
| RST38h | then it probably blocks for you anyway | 17:35 |
| lcuk | its really only got a picture | 17:35 |
| lcuk | about the simplest gtk app ever | 17:35 |
| javispedro | RST38h: since they use g_timeouts I guess the app blocks in glib event loop already | 17:35 |
| lcuk | the callback just checks the orientation and if its flipped makes a moo noise | 17:35 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, ok colem works, I could play "Chuck noris super kicks" game;) | 17:35 |
| RST38h | javis: Ok. Because I do not normally block there | 17:35 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: You can play just about ANY Coleco game on it :) | 17:36 |
| javispedro | yeah, I don't either. | 17:36 |
| RST38h | javis: But we are...mhm...special | 17:36 |
| sp3000 | javispedro: video is special, somewhat -- otherwise stuff does get suspended after a bit | 17:36 |
| sp3000 | even video doesn't paint when not visible iirc to save what it can | 17:36 |
| RST38h | Normal people do not need to run emulated CPU in parallel with gtk events prcoessing | 17:36 |
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| sp3000 | we can change that when you plug in a laptop battery ;) | 17:36 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, speccy isn't work well for me :( | 17:37 |
| VDVsx | *working | 17:37 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: So what happened with speccy? | 17:37 |
| lcuk | speccy is working as designed then! | 17:37 |
| javispedro | sp3000: I've done that. I can get cpu usage down to 10% levels, but the difference between 10% CPU usage and 100% CPU usage in battery life is minimal. | 17:37 |
| lcuk | the original 48k never worked well for anyone :D | 17:37 |
| lcuk | but we tried. | 17:37 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: lcuk is essentially right | 17:37 |
| sp3000 | javispedro: wakeups matter | 17:37 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, can load roms trough the menu | 17:37 |
| sp3000 | 10% is death | 17:37 |
| javispedro | indeed. and at 10% it's still "too many" | 17:38 |
| VDVsx | but the same game loads trough the Speccy menu | 17:38 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, ^ | 17:38 |
| lcuk | javispedro, you know how the camera app puts a cover over and pauses the pipeline | 17:38 |
| sp3000 | of course it's better than 100% :) | 17:38 |
| javispedro | lcuk: what does the camera app do when you open the dashboard? | 17:38 |
| lcuk | ^ that | 17:39 |
| lcuk | it doesnt run in dashboard | 17:39 |
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| javispedro | enuff said I guess.... | 17:39 |
| lcuk | for a slightly different reason (its yuv and not composited), but the effect is the same | 17:39 |
| lcuk | its a paused overlay | 17:39 |
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| javispedro | the osso-games-startup approach is OK for me | 17:39 |
| * lcuk nods | 17:39 | |
| javispedro | however, can you invoke the compositor while playing blocks? | 17:40 |
| lcuk | try ctrl backspace | 17:40 |
| javispedro | er.. idonthaveann900 :) | 17:40 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | The game stops and shows the OGW screen | 17:41 |
| javispedro | (basically, the osso-games-startup approach is "no multitasking". the app gets shutdown as soon as you try to switch out from it, saving state and returning to the launcher which is a Gtk+ app blocking on glib event loop) | 17:41 |
| lcuk | javispedro, do you wanna move in with qwerty for a while, go camp at his house or something | 17:42 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: So, what is the problem with that? =) | 17:42 |
| lcuk | so you get some time with device | 17:42 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: You can load games, right? | 17:42 |
| javispedro | lcuk: well, you may be coming here soon, don't you? :D | 17:42 |
| lcuk | your apps have been played with by many and i think its daft you havent got device | 17:42 |
| lcuk | yeah not soon enough | 17:42 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, yes, but you've a option that doesn't work in the menu, it's not emulator fault I think | 17:43 |
| * RST38h imagines that where javispedro lives is pretty warm and sunny at the oment | 17:43 | |
| VDVsx | I'm talking about the hildon menu | 17:43 |
| lcuk | and close to vdvsx | 17:43 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: All *my* menu options work | 17:43 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Which one does not work? Open File? | 17:43 |
| lcuk | right, i need to go see if i can make a patch | 17:43 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: 24.5 ºC, 59%, a bit cloudy. | 17:43 |
| * lcuk hopes the network works | 17:44 | |
| VDVsx | RST38h, yes | 17:44 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, nothing happens | 17:44 |
| VDVsx | 22 C here :) | 17:44 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: What file was it? The extension? | 17:44 |
| ali12341 | which package provides fmradio-tool? | 17:44 |
| RST38h | javispedro: -3oC, cloudy | 17:45 |
| javispedro | cool stuff :) | 17:45 |
| SpeedEvil | 8C, bloody rainy. | 17:45 |
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| RST38h | Ah, I forgot the snow =) | 17:45 |
| RST38h | javis: add "snow" to that | 17:45 |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, tzx | 17:45 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Please keep in mind that .tap and .tzx files are tape images | 17:45 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: When you "load" such a file, you need to initiate loading from tape by hand | 17:46 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, ah lol | 17:46 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: That is why you do not see any immediate reaction | 17:46 |
| VDVsx | open file and then load tape ? | 17:46 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Try .z80 or .sna, they are easier for the beginners | 17:46 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, only found .tzx | 17:47 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: yea, select tape loader | 17:47 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Or, in 48k BASIC, do J Ctrl+P Ctrl+P Enter | 17:47 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: I have to run out for a moment, lcuk will tell you what to do ;) | 17:47 |
| lcuk | btw, clock bug was already filed, please vote for it if you have been hit: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5466 | 17:47 |
| lcuk | i am trying to get to my scratchbox | 17:47 |
| lcuk | and my network is bein a pig again | 17:48 |
| * javispedro votes for the clock bug . | 17:48 | |
| javispedro | we need something extra to solve this. | 17:48 |
| javispedro | maybe a set of "dashboard-shown" "dashboard-hidden" dbus signals? | 17:48 |
| * sp3000 clocks the vote bug | 17:48 | |
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| * lcuk bugs the clock vote | 17:49 | |
| * javispedro sp3000s the lcuk vote | 17:49 | |
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| lcuk | javispedro, there are already plenty of events | 17:49 |
| lcuk | it just needs a simple implementation to show how they should be done | 17:49 |
| lcuk | focusin focusout works | 17:50 |
| javispedro | yeah, I know about focusin focusout | 17:50 |
| javispedro | but consider this: you stop drawing to the screen on focusout. | 17:50 |
| lcuk | and adding new events to gtk would be hairy | 17:50 |
| javispedro | the dashboard appears. your drawing is out of date. | 17:50 |
| lcuk | of course | 17:50 |
| lcuk | thats the same issue clock has | 17:50 |
| javispedro | if dashboard appearing would signal libosso or something like that | 17:50 |
| lcuk | it just takes refreshes on the apps schedule | 17:50 |
| sp3000 | so you need "visible" | 17:50 |
| lcuk | there is no right or wrong way | 17:51 |
| javispedro | you could start the drawing loop again | 17:51 |
| * sp3000 has no idea how this stuff works though :) | 17:51 | |
| javispedro | i think I'll file a brainstorm about this. | 17:51 |
| lcuk | javispedro, its app specific | 17:51 |
| lcuk | the clock needs to update after passing the minute mark | 17:51 |
| javispedro | its app specific how to handle the event | 17:51 |
| lcuk | your app might be right to refresh all the time | 17:51 |
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| qwerty12 | andre__: In your opinion, where would be the best place to file a bug against xev (an N900-specific one)? | 17:52 |
| lcuk | ive got 2 clocks in liqbase, one updates on the minute, the other updates on the second | 17:52 |
| javispedro | yep. so, the clock app just draws time once when receiving the "dashboard-shown" signal, and sets up a 1 minute timer for redrawing it, cancelling the timer when the dashboard-hidden signal fires | 17:52 |
| lcuk | nahhh | 17:53 |
| lcuk | it keeps the timer always | 17:53 |
| lcuk | doesnt actually need to listen to events | 17:53 |
| lcuk | just needs to redraw every minute | 17:53 |
| javispedro | a emu like mine starts drawing frames when the dashboard-shown signal fires, and stops drawing them when the dashboard-hidden signal fires. | 17:53 |
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| lcuk | the compositor stores the drawn areas | 17:53 |
| lcuk | hi konttori | 17:53 |
| konttori | hi | 17:53 |
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| javispedro | hi konttori. here discussing what to do when CPU hungry apps go to the background :) | 17:54 |
| sp3000 | maybe they could get away with waking up 1/min, maybe not | 17:54 |
| lcuk | some could | 17:54 |
| lcuk | some cant | 17:54 |
| sp3000 | I don't think they could get away with drawing 1/min when not visible :) | 17:54 |
| lcuk | some dont need a wakeup at all | 17:54 |
| javispedro | sp3000: 1 wakeup per minute is sane | 17:55 |
| lcuk | if its not visible changing the label will not really do much | 17:55 |
| lcuk | gtk should handle that internally | 17:55 |
| * lcuk curses his network | 17:55 | |
| javispedro | lcuk: the issue is not the CPU usage of just redrawing the label, but the power consumption of just waking the CPU, even if only runs a single instruction | 17:55 |
| lcuk | even with wired connection for the last mile it keeps dropping :( | 17:55 |
| andre__ | qwerty12, core -> x-server maybe? shrug :-P | 17:56 |
| javispedro | (in the case of timers at least) | 17:56 |
| lcuk | nahhh javispedro | 17:56 |
| lcuk | timers themselves and a little bit of time arent bad | 17:56 |
| qwerty12 | andre__: Thanks, not sure myself, but now I can blame you. Muahahahaha :p | 17:56 |
| lcuk | its havign to render a whole screen afterwards | 17:56 |
| javispedro | not sure, but then I haven't measured that :) | 17:56 |
| andre__ | qwerty12, no problem. feel free to explicitly mention this ;-) | 17:56 |
| lcuk | i was looking with powertop and stuff | 17:56 |
| javispedro | powertop measures wakeups, not usage | 17:57 |
| lcuk | it measures lots of things | 17:57 |
| javispedro | ah. | 17:57 |
| lcuk | just run it once | 17:57 |
| javispedro | sorry, talking about the years old version I have here :) | 17:57 |
| lcuk | its amazing - i would want it running all the time actually | 17:57 |
| lcuk | but i cant get it to do anything other than a sleep 12, check 30 | 17:57 |
| javispedro | 2,00 Ghz 0,0% 1,80 Ghz 0,0% 1000 Mhz 100,0% mwahahaha | 17:57 |
| * lcuk needs to fix network the laptop is uncontactable again | 17:58 | |
| lcuk | why did we move away from wired nets | 17:59 |
| Corsac | to be able to move away from switches :) | 17:59 |
| javispedro | Wakeups-from-idle per second : 892,9 for example, this would kill the battery quickly I guess | 17:59 |
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| lcuk | Corsac, you never heard of a 3mile patch lead? | 17:59 |
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| javispedro | even in OpenTTD I could probably disable Draw*() routines if I knew I wasn't : neither topmost app nor dashboard open. | 18:01 |
| practisevoodoo | has anyone used opencv on the n810? | 18:02 |
| Firebird | javispedro, why not just skip everything that's in the main loop? | 18:02 |
| javispedro | Firebird: cause I don't want the game to pause. | 18:02 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, still around ? | 18:02 |
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| VDVsx | does anyone knows how to change emulators in RST38h's TI calculator ? | 18:03 |
| sp3000 | konttori: do we have some excellent guides and dev docs on how to do dashboard liveness and not suck at pm? we probably should :) | 18:03 |
| lcuk | zaheerm, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=361936#post361936 from discussion earlier | 18:03 |
| qwerty12 | VDVsx: Ctrl+Enter ;) | 18:03 |
| lcuk | sp3000, ++ | 18:03 |
| lcuk | using simple usable apps as examples | 18:03 |
| zaheerm | lcuk, oh yah i even thanked you on that post :) | 18:03 |
| lcuk | ie moobox :D | 18:03 |
| zaheerm | lcuk, forgot about that | 18:03 |
| lcuk | lol | 18:03 |
| * zaheerm has a bad memory | 18:04 | |
| lcuk | dozy git!" | 18:04 |
| zaheerm | telling me :P | 18:04 |
| Firebird | arg, why isn't qt and boost optified :( | 18:04 |
| lcuk | crap crap crap | 18:04 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12, thanks | 18:04 |
| lcuk | Firebird, because no1 has filed a bug or found a complete solution yet | 18:04 |
| lcuk | theres a lot of testing needed before altering the subsystem components | 18:05 |
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| qwerty12 | andre__: Opting for Development Platform -> Tools, instead. Unless it has changed from the Diablo days, packages from the tools repository are expected to be installed on the device if needed | 18:09 |
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| andre__ | qwerty12, also fine... | 18:10 |
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| lcuk | hey, since moobox works all the time, if we had a moobox and an oinkbox and a chickenbox and a barkbox etc we could have a whole farmyard going on (if they had different accel triggers! | 18:17 |
| v2px | aw cute | 18:17 |
| qwerty12 | If I met someone who was doing that on their N900 in public, I would take the N900 and throw it into the nearest river I could find. | 18:17 |
| vasily_pupkin | qwerty12: what is that? (= | 18:18 |
| * vasily_pupkin .oO(may be qwerty12 throw it to me?) | 18:19 | |
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| javispedro | lcuk: and that's my primary multitasking use case! lol | 18:19 |
| lcuk | lol | 18:19 |
| lcuk | qwerty12, imagine the noise it would make as it flies through the air tumbling | 18:20 |
| lcuk | we need one special one, a quackbox, which only triggers in the presence of water | 18:20 |
| qwerty12 | "I'm dying!" | 18:20 |
| lcuk | at the cocreation session, we got a photo of everyone throwing their n900s in the air | 18:21 |
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| lcuk | we needed that app for that | 18:21 |
| Analias | Morning Icuk, Pupkin, et al | 18:21 |
| lcuk | el | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | coq | 18:22 |
| * lcuk facepalms | 18:22 | |
| qwerty12 | You asked for it | 18:22 |
| lcuk | "Icuk" makes me sound like a chef | 18:23 |
| kami | when throwing the n900 it should sound like a mosquito :P | 18:23 |
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| qwerty12 | lcuk: Did you get moobox sorted? I guess I should get tap-and-hold in GPE File manager, since I was whining about it... | 18:23 |
| lcuk | i was actually surprised it came back down | 18:23 |
| lcuk | it should levitate | 18:23 |
| lcuk | no i cant get my damned network working | 18:23 |
| lcuk | upstairs is fine | 18:23 |
| lcuk | but the connect down to the laptop is bein a bitch | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | I thought the N900 was your SDK? ;) | 18:24 |
| lcuk | it is for liq* stuff | 18:24 |
| lcuk | but not for autocrap and dpkg-waa | 18:24 |
| lcuk | i got halfway through configure stage and the net dropped | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | Ouch | 18:25 |
| lcuk | yeah tracy has loads of fun playing on whatever farm game she plays via facebook | 18:25 |
| * lcuk hates routers | 18:25 | |
| lcuk | my net was stable before i had them | 18:26 |
| qwerty12 | Wouldn't say the same about your tablets' battery life, however... | 18:26 |
| lcuk | its ok on the whole | 18:26 |
| lcuk | i still use adhoc when im out | 18:26 |
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| lcuk | tho nowadays i just jack onto whatever router is around | 18:27 |
| lcuk | the train routers dont allow lan play | 18:27 |
| lcuk | but everywhere else seems to | 18:28 |
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| Lynoure | What would be a good starting point/doc for a person who knows python and java and is not scared of new languages, and wants to develop something for fremantle? | 18:33 |
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| lcuk | qwerty12, i patched the main, but it wont build. its actually failing on my comments rather than code :S | 18:42 |
| lcuk | why would c not like // comments | 18:42 |
| Stskeeps | cos // is c++ | 18:43 |
| freenose | lcuk: use C99 | 18:43 |
| qwerty12 | lcuk: CFLAGS: "-ansi" | 18:43 |
| sp3000 | yeah the wrong choice of spec vintage would probably do that :) | 18:44 |
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| * lcuk facepalsm | 18:44 | |
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| javispedro | what? I though you needed -pedantic to make it reject C++ style comments | 18:46 |
| qwerty12 | It has that too. Please ignore this n00b | 18:46 |
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| VDVsx | humm, does anyones tested the mirror app (N900) ? | 18:47 |
| lcuk | lol qwerty12 | 18:47 |
| javispedro | qwerty12: using pedantic is not what I'd call "n00bness" | 18:47 |
| * lcuk strongly dislikes /* */ and only uses the in specific places | 18:48 | |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, the front camer's picture has an annoying stripe | 18:48 |
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| * qwerty12 doesn't use -pedantic / -Wall in his stuff. He does, however, make sure there are no warnings... | 18:48 | |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, yes, and a get a very noisy image as well | 18:49 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, yah coz the camera is crap | 18:49 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, the stripe i think is a bug, the noisiness is expected | 18:49 |
| qwerty12 | *Werror. Of course | 18:49 |
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| Stskeeps | -Werror is insane | 18:49 |
| w00t | -Werror is good fun :-) | 18:50 |
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| Stskeeps | until gcc invents new warnings and most of your codebase stops building | 18:50 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, well, worst than the cam in my n810 :( | 18:51 |
| w00t | well, yes. | 18:51 |
| w00t | but that's half the fun | 18:51 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, are you surprised? | 18:51 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, a lot worst,lol | 18:51 |
| w00t | I mean, it's no different to gcc randomly moving things around to new headers so things stop building, Stskeeps | 18:51 |
| w00t | and they do that rather regularly. | 18:51 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, the n810 has 1 or 2 cameras? | 18:51 |
| lcuk | thats fun tho | 18:51 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, one | 18:51 |
| lcuk | hunt the header should be a game | 18:51 |
| zaheerm | then it is expected | 18:51 |
| w00t | lcuk: except that the prize is a new release with more headers moved :-( | 18:51 |
| zaheerm | compare the n810 camera to the carl zeiss one at the back of the n900 :) | 18:52 |
| Stskeeps | w00t: back to coding instead of arguing with me! ;) | 18:52 |
| lcuk | the face camera on the n900 is a regression at this point | 18:52 |
| w00t | Stskeeps: I really do need to be doing that at some point, yes | 18:52 |
| lcuk | thankfully we dont need all the res | 18:52 |
| zaheerm | VDVsx, stefan would know a lot more re: front camera quality | 18:53 |
| lcuk | and the band can be somewhat worked around | 18:53 |
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| zaheerm | well the band i believe is not there with the nokia internal builds | 18:53 |
| VDVsx | zaheerm, ehehe, but the front one is unusable, they could save some money | 18:53 |
| zaheerm | because stefan showed surprise when i showed him the output | 18:53 |
| sp3000 | meh, just needs some more processing, right? :) | 18:53 |
| Shapeshifter | sooo, any awesome news in the last days? | 18:55 |
| sp3000 | does mirror still ship its .svn to opt? | 18:55 |
| * sp3000 goes check | 18:55 | |
| *** VDVsx changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | http://maemo.org | http://maemo.nokia.com | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Tentative: UX meets Code hackfest - http://tinyurl.com/ybl8ytt" | 18:57 | |
| lcuk | qwerty12, can you check this, my damned network has dropped about 100 times | 19:00 |
| lcuk | http://pastebin.com/m61616487 | 19:00 |
| qwerty12 | You want it compiled? | 19:00 |
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| mezcalero | hmm, i bricked my n900 apparntly. | 19:01 |
| mezcalero | didn't do much though, except leaving it in my pocket | 19:01 |
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| mezcalero | only reaction i now get is the charge led | 19:02 |
| mezcalero | i assumed the battery just ran empty | 19:02 |
| ifreq | mezcalero: how does leaving phone to pocket brick it? | 19:02 |
| lcuk | what color and whats it doin | 19:02 |
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| mezcalero | but after 10h of charging I still cannot power it up | 19:02 |
| mezcalero | ifreq: if i knew.... | 19:02 |
| ifreq | took the battery off and powered it again? | 19:02 |
| mezcalero | lcuk: charge led is thet yellowish orange | 19:02 |
| mezcalero | ifreq: yes did that | 19:03 |
| mezcalero | ifreq: couple of times | 19:03 |
| mezcalero | the to no luck | 19:03 |
| lcuk | are you charging via a usb or from the wall | 19:03 |
| mezcalero | lcuk: usb | 19:03 |
| lcuk | you got a wall charger? | 19:03 |
| mezcalero | lcuk: yes, i do | 19:04 |
| lcuk | do you want to give that a try for a while | 19:04 |
| * mezcalero does that | 19:05 | |
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| qwerty12 | lcuk: Works fine. Just that check_orientation_timer should be unsigned | 19:13 |
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| lcuk | cool, so on device it just idles when its not on the front then :D | 19:14 |
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| qwerty12 | I know what a MooBox is, now, just wondering why someone would want one... | 19:15 |
| lcuk | for a bit of fun :) | 19:15 |
| lcuk | nothing serious, simple applications which do odd things | 19:16 |
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| lcuk | make a cymbol app, a tamborine app, a drum app and let the kids go wild in class | 19:16 |
| wazd | do you think guys that beagleboard is good enough to be carputer? :) | 19:16 |
| lcuk | use pyano and theramin and boxar etc | 19:16 |
| Firebird | and soon a fart app/buttons->sound template program? | 19:16 |
| lcuk | wazd of course they are | 19:16 |
| lcuk | yes Firebird | 19:17 |
| Firebird | :o | 19:17 |
| lcuk | the moobox is almost that now | 19:17 |
| lcuk | its a simple little gtk app | 19:17 |
| lcuk | that just has a cover pic and does something amusing when you run it | 19:17 |
| lcuk | bish bash bosh | 19:17 |
| wazd | the only thing I doubt is radio solutions | 19:17 |
| lcuk | n900 | 19:17 |
| lcuk | qwerty12, do you wanna send the guy a patch | 19:18 |
| qwerty12 | lcuk: Your patch | 19:18 |
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| lcuk | nahh its everyones | 19:19 |
| wazd | lcuk: well, I can but standalone cassete player too but that's not quite a solution :D | 19:19 |
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| lcuk | qwerty12, ive made it unsigned and put a header comment | 19:21 |
| lcuk | http://pastebin.com/f53ed4882 | 19:21 |
| lcuk | the pastebin is perm, ill just post in the maemo apps thing | 19:22 |
| lcuk | cos theres no central git etc | 19:22 |
| qwerty12 | Cool | 19:22 |
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| lcuk | thanks | 19:25 |
| qwerty12 | Gonna e-mail the guy or want me to do it? | 19:25 |
| wazd | ok, another question, can I attach that fancy USB display to beagleboard? :) | 19:25 |
| lcuk | qwerty12, he should be a maintainer already | 19:26 |
| lcuk | and get emails from comments there | 19:26 |
| lcuk | but if you want to be certain | 19:26 |
| lcuk | timeless came up with a cool suggestion last night | 19:26 |
| lcuk | for the packages list: http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ | 19:27 |
| lcuk | have a way to list the apps you have personally up/down voted or discussed | 19:27 |
| lcuk | ie the things you have an interest in | 19:27 |
| lcuk | so you can monitor their progression | 19:27 |
| qwerty12 | It already shows a thumbs up/down icon in the list for the packages you have voted up/down | 19:28 |
| lcuk | not the same | 19:28 |
| lcuk | but almost | 19:28 |
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| lcuk | it wont show ups downs when items have gone from testing or a new version is there | 19:28 |
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| dirk2 | Stskeeps: Thanks for updating http://omappedia.org/wiki/Maemo_Getting_Started :) | 19:30 |
| * RST38h is back | 19:30 | |
| javispedro | RST38h: working on relayouting your dialogs... | 19:30 |
| RST38h | wazd: For carputer, you have to take into account temperature swings and humidity | 19:30 |
| javispedro | openttd dialogs. | 19:30 |
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| RST38h | javis: =)~~~ | 19:30 |
| * RST38h salivates all over javispedro | 19:30 | |
| javispedro | at least for the new game I'm just rearranging the comboboxes so that the useless ones go to the bottom | 19:30 |
| RST38h | wazd: most "normal" electronics can't survive that for more than a couple of years | 19:31 |
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| ali12341 | the thing that kills electronics faster than anything in the "carputer" is diesel fumes building up inside any moving part | 19:33 |
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| RST38h | Where do you get diesel fumes in a normal gasoline engine car? | 19:34 |
| ali12341 | all other road vehicles | 19:34 |
| RST38h | And which part of carputer is moving? | 19:34 |
| ali12341 | fans, hard drives etc | 19:34 |
| ali12341 | if you mount the stuff inside the car (not in the boot) then that pretty much eliminates the fumes | 19:35 |
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| SpeedEvil | Why would you have fans and hard drives? | 19:36 |
| ali12341 | don't ask me, i just fix them | 19:37 |
| ali12341 | the harddrives because for some reason you just have to have every movie ever made on tap | 19:37 |
| ali12341 | and fans because without ventilation it tends to catch fire | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | dirk2: np, finally back home. ctrl-shift-x is a brilliant way to get cursor to show btw | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | dirk2: the port working OK for people? | 19:38 |
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| RST38h | ali12341: and what fan/hd are you going to have in a beagleboard? | 19:40 |
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| dirk2 | Stskeeps: What?? ctrl-shift-x is sufficent to get the cursor? | 19:41 |
| dirk2 | Stskeeps: I have only read a lot of mails speculating how to get the cursor, but not this easy solution yet | 19:41 |
| * dirk2 has to test this asap! | 19:42 | |
| Stskeeps | dirk2: cut out the libmatchbox2 thing, recompile it and hildon desktop.. and ctrl-shift-x starts xterm and it shows cursor | 19:44 |
| javispedro | RST38h: btw, do you remember getting a black screen in openttd while trying scaled modes? | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | it acts like that on mer at least | 19:44 |
| RST38h | javis: yep | 19:44 |
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| wazd | RST38h: yeah, that's the point | 19:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's fun having guests who shut the windows when it's 55°F out to turn the AC on to max. | 19:46 |
| javispedro | RST38h: So, I didn't solve it I guess? :( | 19:46 |
| RST38h | javis: I have not tried it in a while, as it is kinda disruptive | 19:46 |
| RST38h | but I would remove extra modes from the list, no need to keep them there | 19:46 |
| javispedro | I've removed the fullscreen checkbox from there, and now switching modes toggles fullscreen. | 19:47 |
| javispedro | and the default in fremantle is to start scaled | 19:47 |
| SpeedEvil | GeneralAntilles: True penguins. | 19:47 |
| RST38h | yea | 19:47 |
| SpeedEvil | (though my house is at the moment at 55F) | 19:48 |
| wazd | RST38h: I can place hairdryer in front of the motherboard :D | 19:48 |
| RST38h | wazd: in fact this is how they test consumer devices in China | 19:49 |
| mezcalero | lcuk: didn't really help | 19:49 |
| * RST38h isn't joking | 19:49 | |
| lcuk | :( | 19:49 |
| mezcalero | what i did manage with my bricked n900 however is that i got it to show those kitt-like moving dots while booting. but after 2s it powered itself off again | 19:49 |
| mezcalero | anyone has an idea what i can do to make it boot on after showing those KITT dots? | 19:50 |
| lcuk | it sounds battery related | 19:50 |
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| mezcalero | lcuk: power was plugged this time while rebooting | 19:50 |
| wazd | RST38h: I don't think that we will ever have something below -10 here :D | 19:51 |
| lcuk | mezcalero, try it without | 19:51 |
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| mezcalero | lcuk: did that too | 19:51 |
| mezcalero | lcuk: no difference | 19:51 |
| RST38h | wazd: got down to -37 just 2 years ago | 19:51 |
| wazd | RST38h: we were testing OMWeather, sorry for that :) | 19:52 |
| RST38h | wazd: had to bring car for repair as some wire snapped from the cold, inside the left front door | 19:52 |
| lcuk | :S mezcalero | 19:52 |
| RST38h | and 1-2 weeks at -22 is normal, so I do not see where you got the -10 figure from =) | 19:53 |
| wazd | meh, atom motherboard costs 80$, BB costs 150$ :( | 19:53 |
| RST38h | of course | 19:53 |
| wazd | what's the point of BB then? :) | 19:53 |
| RST38h | and atom warms up itself =) | 19:53 |
| RST38h | wazd: coolness factor, same as pandora :) | 19:54 |
| RST38h | for a carputer I would go with the atom though | 19:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody want to test a quick bug for me? | 19:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Open up a new SMS. | 19:54 |
| wazd | RST38h: then it's better to build x86 carputer I guess | 19:54 |
| mezcalero | anyone has another idea how to unbrick my n900? | 19:54 |
| wazd | mezcalero: unbrick my heart, baby let me be :D | 19:55 |
| RST38h | wazd: yea, put linux on an sd card and you are done | 19:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then enter a degree symbol with the Sym dialog. | 19:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tell me how many characters of 160 it consumes. | 19:55 |
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| * GeneralAntilles gets 91. | 19:56 | |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles: 91 | 19:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's one big character. | 19:56 |
| wazd | RST38h: btw, any way to implement that fancy instant on functionality into it? :) | 19:57 |
| TomaszD | put the 1/2 char for even better results | 19:58 |
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| TomaszD | unicode encoding? | 19:58 |
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| SpeedEvil | I was about to comment that SMS uses a wierd 7 bit alphabet - but 91 does seem suboptimal. | 19:58 |
| RST38h | wazd: yea, it is standby mode afaik | 19:59 |
| RST38h | wazd: just keep it on standby all the time | 19:59 |
| qwerty12 | Funnily enough, further presses of the degree symbol only result in it taking the space of one character | 19:59 |
| * pupnik is in standby mode | 19:59 | |
| RST38h | wazd: make it go into hibernation when power gets very low, that will add a few seconds on the next startup | 19:59 |
| wazd | RST38h: hm, that's an idea :) | 19:59 |
| RST38h | wazd: also, make sure your / is readonly | 19:59 |
| RST38h | wazd: there is a way to set it up this way. this reduces startup time | 20:00 |
| RST38h | wazd: if you do not need networking in your csrputer, get rid of it (in the kernel and elsewhere), this will save you boot time | 20:00 |
| SpeedEvil | wazd: plus - you don't need instant on | 20:02 |
| SpeedEvil | wazd: you want on when door is starting to be unlocked | 20:03 |
| SpeedEvil | wazd: which gives you a good 5-10s. | 20:03 |
| SpeedEvil | resume from fast flash should give that. | 20:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | 10 bugs to 6000. | 20:04 |
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| wazd | carputer costs almost like non-expensive car audio | 20:06 |
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| GAN900 | Mediaplayer loses UPnP shares a lot. | 20:06 |
| wazd | SpeedEvil: well, the faster it starts - the better :) | 20:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | wazd: Carputer is boring. Add hard-real-time and bit-bang the injectors. | 20:07 |
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| RST38h | 1,600 Names Suggested Daily For FBI's Watch List! | 20:09 |
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| wazd | SpeedEvil: I don't have any stereo so it's rather interesting for me :) | 20:09 |
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| RST38h | That is half a million terrorists a year. The entire US population should be accounted for in about 350 years | 20:09 |
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| * VDVsx suggests GAN900 name :P | 20:12 | |
| RST38h | Wait, I am wrong, it will take twice longer to terrorize the entire US! | 20:13 |
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| wazd | I really wonder who buys uber-expensive car audio for "awesome" sound | 20:14 |
| wazd | like for a thousand or more | 20:14 |
| RST38h | crazy people | 20:15 |
| RST38h | He can't buy himself a Merc or a BMW, but he still has enough money for the audio system in his Ford Escor | 20:15 |
| RST38h | t | 20:15 |
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| RST38h | BTW, whoever feels like porting some 3D games: http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/screenshots-projects.html | 20:16 |
| wazd | RST38h: you can buy x86 motherboard and some usb X-Fi audio - it would be way better | 20:17 |
| RST38h | they do not know it | 20:17 |
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| RST38h | nothing beats agrentinian oxygen-free copper in mexican guano-based insulation | 20:18 |
| VDVsx | wazd, btw, did you already got your extra karma ? | 20:19 |
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| wazd | VDVsx: yep :) | 20:20 |
| VDVsx | ;) | 20:20 |
| wazd | VDVsx: I'm rich! :D | 20:20 |
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| wazd | VDVsx: I'm on the second page now! :) | 20:21 |
| VDVsx | wazd, you need to collect more, in order to jump to the 1st page;) | 20:21 |
| VDVsx | lol | 20:21 |
| fwrnando | anybody knows a mirror for http://maemo.zhil.in/flash/flash.html ? | 20:21 |
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| fwrnando | (the maemo ui blog parallax desktop demo) | 20:21 |
| wazd | fwrnando: I know | 20:22 |
| wazd | fwrnando: wait a sec :) | 20:22 |
| fwrnando | thanks | 20:22 |
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| qwerty12 | gcobb: ping | 20:26 |
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| practisevoodoo | pong | 20:26 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: time for more openttd tests? http://depot.javispedro.com/openttd/openttd.gz | 20:28 |
| dirk2 | Stskeeps: http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2009-November/022013.html | 20:28 |
| javispedro | I can't reproduce the black screen bug in my n810. even if I just remove the updaterect call, the scaled is still (less often) sent to screen. | 20:29 |
| RST38h | javis: Downloading | 20:30 |
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| javispedro | this one build is a) compiled by the diablo gcc version b) updates only a quarter of the screen | 20:31 |
| RST38h | hmmm | 20:31 |
| * lcuk wants to push a whole new application tonight, but is not sure | 20:31 | |
| RST38h | Heh, iNES is just one vote away | 20:31 |
| * RST38h pleads for 2-3 more people to vote these apps up | 20:31 | |
| wazd | fwrnando: http://lotro.ucoz.ru/parallax/flash.html | 20:31 |
| fwrnando | ooh awesome, thanks | 20:32 |
| qwerty12_N900 | rst38h: Gimme a sec, I'll find a ROM | 20:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, ATI85 is optified now, right? | 20:33 |
| fwrnando | I'd be swiping between screens all that if that would get implemented lol | 20:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, and I'm agreed with VDVsx about the menu. | 20:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, first start should show you the emulator menu. | 20:34 |
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| RST38h | General: yes it is optified | 20:35 |
| RST38h | General: there is nothing to select from that menu except for the file name | 20:35 |
| wazd | fwrnando: that's the point :D | 20:35 |
| RST38h | General: The reason why javispedro has the screen is because he uses SDL | 20:35 |
| javispedro | osso-games-startup actually. | 20:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, er, for ATI85. | 20:36 |
| wazd | RST38h: where to vote? | 20:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | So it's obvious you have several calculator options to pick from. | 20:36 |
| RST38h | General: Ah, fot ATI85! Yes, I agree it should start with selection screen | 20:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | OK, iNES is at 10. | 20:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | VGB needs a little help. | 20:36 |
| RST38h | wazd: http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ but only if you can run it at least in the SDK | 20:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | As does ATI85 | 20:36 |
| RST38h | General: Promoting iNES up | 20:37 |
| RST38h | General: Actually, it is sad nobody tried fMSX or Speccy | 20:37 |
| * RST38h likes MSX, it was way more pleasant than NES =) | 20:37 | |
| VDVsx | RST38h, I tried Speccy, did I forget to vote ? | 20:37 |
| javispedro | RST38h: no, it does not run in the armel sdk. | 20:37 |
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| * RST38h will try changing ATI85 to start with selection | 20:38 | |
| * qwerty12_N900 likes the MSX for Metal Gear, but has no interest in the Spectrum | 20:38 | |
| RST38h | VDVsx: I think you voted for Speccy but have not tried fMSX | 20:38 |
| RST38h | qwerty: vote for fMSX then =) | 20:38 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, not yet | 20:38 |
| qwerty12_N900 | I thought I had done, let's see | 20:38 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Try the classic stuff - Goonies, Vampire Killer, Metal gear, Namco classics | 20:38 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: ftp://ftp.komkon.org/pub/MSX/Carts should have them all, as this stuff is pretty ancient | 20:39 |
| VDVsx | oh Jaffa uploaded another Hermes release, the other one was with +8 votes:( | 20:39 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, I have no nostalgia for those machines, unfortunately. | 20:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | But will test this week. | 20:40 |
| RST38h | General: I know :) | 20:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, we should really have karma carry-over. | 20:40 |
| RST38h | Mostly European stuff | 20:40 |
| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, true :( | 20:40 |
| qwerty12_N900 | RST38h: fMSX is now at two, you lucky thing. | 20:40 |
| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, this one need some testing too: http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/supertux-stable/0.1.3-1.1maemo11/ | 20:40 |
| VDVsx | ;) | 20:40 |
| * sp3000 slaps maemo-sdk-install_5.0.sh | 20:40 | |
| RST38h | yea :( | 20:40 |
| sp3000 | Using previously downloaded armel rootstrap. | 20:40 |
| sp3000 | Testing downloaded armel rootstrap integrity. | 20:40 |
| VDVsx | and qwerty12_N900 ^ | 20:40 |
| sp3000 | E: Downloaded armel rootstrap file failed integrity test. | 20:40 |
| sp3000 | $ | 20:40 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: will install in a minute | 20:41 |
| sp3000 | yeah, uh, if the previously downloaded file is bad (like, say, something killed my X session...) perhaps redownloading it might be a good idea | 20:41 |
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| wazd | RST38h: you can add me to Ati85 authors too btw :P | 20:41 |
| * RST38h moves the next version of iNES into -testing | 20:41 | |
| VDVsx | wao, you karma whore | 20:41 |
| VDVsx | :P | 20:41 |
| RST38h | wazd: not for Fremantle version (not yet in Extras) but for Diablo one I have been planning to do it tonight | 20:42 |
| wazd | VDVsx: yeah, slap me harder :D | 20:42 |
| wazd | RST38h: great, thanks :) | 20:42 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, fremantle is almost there too | 20:42 |
| VDVsx | 8 votes | 20:42 |
| wao | VDVsx: woz? | 20:43 |
| wao | oh wazd | 20:43 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Yea, the ironic thing is though that as soon as this one is through I have the next update to promote =( | 20:43 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: This all starts feeling suspiciously like Apple Store | 20:43 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, yeah, I'll vote again if you address my request, hihihi | 20:43 |
| javispedro | RST38h: worst part, is that it's not even the maemo apple store, since that will be Ovi. | 20:43 |
| * lcuk votes for VDVsx with a big stick | 20:44 | |
| RST38h | VDVsx: I would rather vote to decrease the trhreshold to 3-5 from the current 10 | 20:44 |
| * lcuk votes again, harder this time | 20:44 | |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, karma carry is the best solution IMO | 20:44 |
| * lcuk gives the stick to RST38h so he can vote too | 20:44 | |
| RST38h | javis: AFAIK, for Ovi you would just have to pay $100 or something for each promotion :) | 20:44 |
| qwerty12_N900 | We need more games with names like bullshitbingo | 20:44 |
| * pupnik votes for whatever you guys want | 20:44 | |
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| * RST38h sharpens the stick | 20:44 | |
| pupnik | u.h... | 20:44 |
| * wazd is gonna to be added to OMWeather authors :D | 20:45 | |
| VDVsx | + qwerty12_N900 :) | 20:45 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: maybe, like 1/2 of the previous package karma | 20:45 |
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| wazd | gonna be* | 20:45 |
| VDVsx | pupnik, isn't you device bricked ? | 20:45 |
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| sp3000 | what the, now it's being successful the next time without doing much | 20:45 |
| RST38h | Ohmygod...This thing cannot promote package into Testing. Just stays hanging | 20:45 |
| VDVsx | *your | 20:45 |
| * sp3000 is confused | 20:45 | |
| pupnik | yes but ignorance never stopped anyone from voting before | 20:46 |
| VDVsx | pupnik, that's bad :( | 20:46 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: Installing supertux. I knew it'd have an animal in it... | 20:46 |
| * qwerty12_N900 hides | 20:46 | |
| pupnik | i know. just kidding. | 20:46 |
| RST38h | guess who the princess toadstool is gonna be... | 20:46 |
| pupnik | supertux worked ok for me | 20:46 |
| * VDVsx hits qwerty12_N900 with a fire torch | 20:46 | |
| * javispedro gives mushroom to VDVsx | 20:46 | |
| pupnik | or maybe it bricked the device. | 20:46 |
| anvith3 | finally got the diablo sdk to install | 20:47 |
| anvith3 | :D | 20:47 |
| lcuk | qwerty12_N900, supertux works nicely | 20:47 |
| * RST38h whispers: "Maemo SDK+" | 20:47 | |
| lcuk | stable speed, playable :) | 20:47 |
| anvith3 | yeah | 20:47 |
| anvith3 | :D | 20:47 |
| RST38h | forget the original sdk it sucks | 20:47 |
| anvith3 | ? | 20:47 |
| lcuk | who killed packages ? | 20:48 |
| lcuk | http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ | 20:48 |
| * VDVsx thinks the wiki team is doing a great job :) | 20:48 | |
| lcuk | is dead | 20:48 |
| anvith3 | hmmm | 20:48 |
| * VDVsx blames RST38h ^ | 20:48 | |
| lcuk | i think we overloaded the system | 20:48 |
| RST38h | By clicking twice, yes | 20:48 |
| javispedro | or me, I sent opengfx a few minutes ago | 20:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Supertux is just ever so slightly slow. | 20:48 |
| anvith3 | but freemantle doesnt support N8x0 right? | 20:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~mer | 20:49 |
| infobot | i heard mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer | 20:49 |
| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, you're running too much stuff a the same time, perhaps :) | 20:49 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: voting up | 20:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nope, just Super Tux | 20:49 |
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| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, strange, runs ok here :) | 20:50 |
| javispedro | yep | 20:50 |
| javispedro | opengfx just built and now packages is ok again :) | 20:50 |
| RST38h | wazd: you have been added as an author | 20:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | VDVsx, old version, then, maybe. | 20:51 |
| RST38h | iNES 3.6.6 promoted to Extras, iNES 3.6.7 promoted to Extras-Testing | 20:51 |
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| wazd | RST38h: ta! | 20:51 |
| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, careful with that, old versions aren't optified (<maemo6) and <maemo10 still has 1.6mb under /, maemo11 is fully under /opt | 20:53 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: Now you can hit Jaffa for his accidental thumbs down, for you would've had enough votes to promote :p | 20:53 |
| wazd | ah, that 170$ 7" screen is not toch | 20:53 |
| wazd | touch* | 20:53 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N900, true, heeh | 20:53 |
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| RST38h | SlideRule 1.0.2. promoted to Extras, SlideRule 1.0.3 promoted to Extras-Testing | 20:54 |
| RST38h | (new versions all have better power-save mode, so you can leave them running on a locked tablet) | 20:54 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | RST38h: What would help promotion would be if you could link to some PD ROMs in the comments of your testing pages | 20:55 |
| konttori | how can we put canola2 from extras-devel to extras-testing? | 20:55 |
| RST38h | konttori: Ask the guys to promote it themselves? | 20:56 |
| VDVsx | konttori, ask etrunko | 20:56 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Acknowledged | 20:56 |
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| konttori | so, only they should promote it? | 20:56 |
| RST38h | Yep | 20:56 |
| konttori | ok | 20:57 |
| VDVsx | 33(m5) Vs 490(m4), any bet when m5 will pass m4 in number of apps ? :) | 20:57 |
| konttori | ok, asekd on canola channel | 20:57 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Depends on which repos you are looking at, vdvsx... | 20:57 |
| konttori | we really need more apps to extras proper | 20:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, konttori | 20:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | Do you want a Maemo Community cloak? | 20:58 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N900, maemo.org downloads | 20:58 |
| konttori | basically we have agreed that once we have over 25 good apps in there, we will enable extras on the device by default | 20:58 |
| VDVsx | qwerty12_N900, i.e Extras | 20:58 |
| konttori | and I would really consider canola2 as one of them | 20:58 |
| RST38h | konttori: you should lower threshold from 10 to 3-5 | 20:58 |
| konttori | you mean votes? | 20:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori, well, we have 32. :) | 20:58 |
| qwerty12_N900 | vdvsx: Will take a while, then... | 20:59 |
| RST38h | konttori: yes | 20:59 |
| VDVsx | konttori, 33 app there now | 20:59 |
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| GeneralAntilles | konttori, send INdT more RX-51s. :P | 20:59 |
| RST38h | konttori: And you should talk to whoever at Nokia is responsible about the web site to FIX it. If this requires doing away with Midgard, do so | 20:59 |
| RST38h | konttori: The current submission/promotion web interface is pretty much non-functional, people wait for minutes just to register their votes | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, that's not Nokia's job. :) | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5818 | 21:00 |
| RST38h | General: Apparently, it is | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Well, adding servers is | 21:00 |
| VDVsx | konttori, btw, canola has some issues in fremantle (lack of input methods and random crashes), afaik | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | But UI stuff on the website is not. | 21:00 |
| RST38h | No, no adding servers. | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | So don't bother konttori about it. :) | 21:00 |
| RST38h | General: Apparently the backend is badly broken | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | tekojo is the one who handles .org infra | 21:00 |
| lcuk | RST38h, please just leave the thing at 10 votes | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | and it's being worked on. | 21:00 |
| lcuk | id rather push for carrying over some | 21:00 |
| RST38h | General: Yea, I will talk to tekojo about it because it has got rather ridiculous | 21:01 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Why 10 though? | 21:01 |
| lcuk | this initial hump and minimum check is imho required, but once an app reaches that it should be simple to update | 21:01 |
| * RST38h agrees with lcuk | 21:01 | |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, why are you going to talk to him? | 21:01 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Why waste his time having him explain it to you? | 21:01 |
| lcuk | we detected a good bunch of normal things wrong with apps | 21:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | See the bug link I've provided. | 21:01 |
| lcuk | mostly they are simple enough to cure | 21:02 |
| RST38h | General: Because it literally takes up to 5 minutes to vote for a package | 21:02 |
| VDVsx | lcuk ++ | 21:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, do you think he doesn't know that? | 21:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5818 | 21:02 |
| RST38h | General: I do not know | 21:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, then follow my link. | 21:02 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, we must work out the difference between an app update and a major change | 21:02 |
| RST38h | General: Ok, the bug is titled We Need Servers. Do we really need servers? Or maybe we need to implement the backend correctly? | 21:02 |
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| konttori | RST38h: I also hate how long and how difficult it is to vote | 21:03 |
| lcuk | igagis_ shout if you are around | 21:03 |
| konttori | I complained about that to quim on friday | 21:03 |
| lcuk | we had quite a lot to say yesterday about your theramin | 21:03 |
| igagis_ | Hi | 21:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, we're not dropping Midgard. :) | 21:03 |
| javispedro | RST38h: throwing hardware to the problem is an acceptable workaround, at least as long as we can. | 21:03 |
| RST38h | General: Because I am currently seeing that 3-5 uers are ENOUGH to kill this sorry excuse for a website | 21:03 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, please suggest that in the marathon thread (-devel) | 21:03 |
| igagis_ | lcuk: there was a testing marathon I heard | 21:03 |
| lcuk | RST38h, you only see one part | 21:03 |
| lcuk | theres people all over the site and many front ends | 21:03 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: I see 3 people accessing the same db. It should not take minutes. | 21:03 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, not yet | 21:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, it's way more than 3 people. :) | 21:04 |
| lcuk | i would have to answer lots of the questions there | 21:04 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Saturday evenuing? :) | 21:04 |
| javispedro | i see that the slowdowns are clearly related to autobuilder activity | 21:04 |
| lcuk | please bring it up yourself | 21:04 |
| konttori | what I would want to have on the vote is that there would be a separate check needed for all applets and plugins that state that they don't mess up users use-time. | 21:04 |
| RST38h | general: the voting ui has been used by at most 5 people | 21:04 |
| javispedro | or package import processes, etc. | 21:04 |
| konttori | it's so easy do make a plugin that destroys use-time | 21:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, stop being silly. | 21:04 |
| lcuk | i dont feel right just jumping in, you know how i feel and this place is logged | 21:04 |
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| RST38h | General: Well, it all feels weird | 21:05 |
| *** wszyscy is now known as shpaq | 21:05 | |
| RST38h | General: How many users are using the site at one time? Like saturday evening? | 21:05 |
| lcuk | the package interface is all new code | 21:05 |
| lcuk | perhaps the database design could do with a rejig | 21:05 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, last number I heard was in the 10s-100s of thousands range. | 21:05 |
| RST38h | General: If the number is relatively small, can we at least supplant Midgard by a few PHP scripts written on the side, to make the voting/packaging UI responsive? | 21:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not small. :) | 21:06 |
| RST38h | General: Is that at one time or per day? | 21:06 |
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| * GeneralAntilles really doesn't see the point of this argument. | 21:06 | |
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| lcuk | RST38h, the server and databases have to handle all of the voting and rating and everything for downloads and packages and everything else | 21:06 |
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| RST38h | lcuk: But it is much simpler than you make it sound =) | 21:06 |
| lcuk | not really RST38h | 21:07 |
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| RST38h | General: Well, I am not trying to argue at the moment, just trying to understand the real reason for this stuff. It has been going on for months, so would really love to know what is at the bottom of it | 21:07 |
| javispedro | RST38h: did you run that openttd binary? | 21:07 |
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| RST38h | If it is 10k-100k users accessing the site at each moment, where they all come from? | 21:08 |
| RST38h | If it is 10k-100k per day, then why is the site so slow and no amount of extra hardware makes it faster | 21:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, the N900 announcement. | 21:08 |
| RST38h | Hmm...But won't these guys be mainly hitting static content? | 21:08 |
| lcuk | RST38h, we dont know the backend layout, but i would ask questions like, is garage on the main server, does the git stuff get tied in with it, the downloads and planet and packages and everything from many sources | 21:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | We've got the same hardware running the same software we had 6 months ago. | 21:08 |
| lcuk | it doesnt take users to make it busy, it takes operations and functions | 21:08 |
| RST38h | javis: Not yet, will try in a second | 21:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Response times have gone way up. | 21:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | Clearly the number of hits is the cause. | 21:09 |
| RST38h | lcuk: yep | 21:09 |
| RST38h | General: There amy be a few other causes | 21:09 |
| qwerty12_N900 | RST38h: Wait for the new servers to come before passing judgement on whether new servers will help or not | 21:09 |
| RST38h | General: db indices gettng too large for example | 21:09 |
| lcuk | even simple things as a totally fragmented hd | 21:10 |
| RST38h | Ok, openttd | 21:10 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Well, that thing is running on top of a db, relational dbs have got a few funky features on their own ;) | 21:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, they're not using FAT32. <_< | 21:10 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, filesystems of all types get fragmented. | 21:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, real filesystems manage it at the FS level. | 21:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | This isn't Windows 98 | 21:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Your Windows experience really isn't particularly relevant here. | 21:11 |
| Stskeeps | i'm with lcuk on this one. | 21:12 |
| Stskeeps | fragmentation will happen | 21:12 |
| RST38h | lcuk is right, fragmentation happens everywhere | 21:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | That's not what I'm arguing. | 21:12 |
| * javispedro was planning to show the e2fsck results of a volume he has with 60% fragmented blocks, but e2fsck detected "inconsistencies". | 21:13 | |
| GeneralAntilles | You really think the reason http://maemo.org is slow is because of fs fragmentation? :) | 21:13 |
| Stskeeps | no, its cos of overloaded servers | 21:13 |
| RST38h | javis: ok, openttd runs, opens in unzoomed mode | 21:14 |
| RST38h | javis: whatdoipress? | 21:14 |
| javispedro | probably because of previous data, defaults only apply if no .games/openttd folder | 21:14 |
| * VDVsx thinks overloaded servers isn't the only reason for the slowness | 21:14 | |
| javispedro | try to switch to windowed scaled | 21:14 |
| RST38h | both scaled windowed and scaled fullscreen work | 21:15 |
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| javispedro | uh. | 21:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, exactly my point. :) | 21:15 |
| RST38h | World Generation dialog is still too high | 21:15 |
| javispedro | it should draw the mouse cursor. try to guess if the upper left quarter is refreshing faster | 21:16 |
| RST38h | Suggesting to lay smaller items out into two columns | 21:16 |
| javispedro | RST38h: this is a botched build, don't use it to save your game | 21:16 |
| * VDVsx notices that next sprint meeting in on the next Tuesday o_0 | 21:16 | |
| RST38h | javis: update speed feels about the same | 21:16 |
| javispedro | duh. | 21:16 |
| javispedro | so inserting the UpdateRects call makes the screen go black. | 21:16 |
| RST38h | hmmm | 21:17 |
| javispedro | currently, it's only doing updaterect of top left corner | 21:17 |
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| RST38h | cannot scroll the playfield | 21:17 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: yep, this is just for trying to isolate the black screen issue. | 21:18 |
| javispedro | only has scaling patch applied | 21:18 |
| RST38h | newspaper articles still bigger than the screen probably no need to scale these) | 21:19 |
| javispedro | stop. | 21:19 |
| RST38h | stopped, quit. | 21:19 |
| javispedro | :) | 21:19 |
| javispedro | yeah, for the rest of things wait until the autobuilder finishes | 21:19 |
| RST38h | deleting binary to keep myself from trying it again | 21:19 |
| kpel | will N800 be supported in Maemo releases after OS2008? | 21:20 |
| javispedro | thanks :) | 21:20 |
| RST38h | kpel: no | 21:21 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So, konttori, would you like a cloak? | 21:24 |
| kpel | ouch! 500 quid down the train | 21:24 |
| kpel | drain rather | 21:24 |
| kpel | RST38h: thanks | 21:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | kpel, Mer. | 21:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~mer | 21:24 |
| infobot | rumour has it, mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer | 21:24 |
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| kpel | GeneralAntilles: thanks. Is Mer supported by Nokia? | 21:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | Depends on how you define support. | 21:25 |
| GeneralAntilles | They've worked hard to get TI/ImagTech to release PowerVR drivers for N8x0 devices | 21:26 |
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| GeneralAntilles | they've relicensed their close-source components for redistribution | 21:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | they've provided monetary and technical support to the project | 21:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not, however, an officially endorsed upgrade path. | 21:26 |
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| kpel | GeneralAntilles: ok thanks | 21:27 |
| javispedro | 3d drivers! where! | 21:27 |
| RST38h | there is no officially endorsed upgrade path so the question is kinda academic :) | 21:27 |
| kpel | so basically whoever buys a nokia tablet is officially discouraged from upgrading the software? | 21:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Er | 21:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | They're not officially anything | 21:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | OS2008 is just the end of official support for the N8x0 series. | 21:28 |
| kpel | I quite liked OS2007 and OS2008 releases. It's s shame there is on official support. Not that I knew that. I upgraded to OS2008 assuming that there is support since the nokia.com site sent me to maemo.org for software upgrades. | 21:29 |
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| Firebird | 3d drivers! where! | 21:29 |
| inz | There was no mention of success | 21:29 |
| kpel | oh well, i might try mer eventually | 21:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | kpel, erm, what? | 21:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | kpel, I'm afraid you may have misinterpreted what I said. | 21:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | OS2008 was an official release for the N800 and N810 | 21:31 |
| kpel | ok, so that was officially supported then | 21:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | There will be no official release of Maemo 5 for the N800 and N810. | 21:31 |
| kpel | I see | 21:31 |
| javispedro | Fatal error: Maximum execution time of 30 seconds exceeded in /mnt/netapp/pear/midcom/lib/midcom/helper/_dbfactory.php on line 451 | 21:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | When I say there's no official upgrade path I mean to Maemo 5. | 21:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | For that, you want Mer. | 21:31 |
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| Andril | noooooo | 21:31 |
| kpel | ok, I see | 21:31 |
| Andril | we need Maemo 5 | 21:32 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Andril, Mer. | 21:33 |
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| kynky | maemo 5 need certain min hardware requirements ? | 21:33 |
| kpel | I don't see this as a problem specific to the MAemo5 upgrade. It's more of a product support issue. After two years N800 is officially dead :( | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | kpel, such are the vagaries of the mobile market | 21:33 |
| kpel | GeneralAntilles: how true | 21:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hardware moves a LOT faster in mobile devices than PCs | 21:34 |
| javispedro | and after a year N900 will be dead. | 21:34 |
| w00t | particularly when it's not "final generation" | 21:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Your performance margins are razor thin. | 21:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maemo 4 was BARELY workable on OMAP2 hardware | 21:34 |
| Andril | my n810 got like 20% of the usage - i thought Android was coming then Maemo just moved on without us :( | 21:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maemo 5 simply isn't supportable in an official capacity. | 21:34 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Which is why Nokia has chosen to support Mer instead of releasing a backport. | 21:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's not constrained by official requirements | 21:35 |
| Andril | i personally think it's a bad move for Nokia | 21:35 |
| konttori | Maemo 5 will be fully supported for a year | 21:35 |
| konttori | it will have top notch support - much better than n8xx devices have had | 21:35 |
| Andril | i don't think that they will sell as many n900's as they did with the n800 & n810 series | 21:35 |
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| * RST38h hopes Maemo6 still runs on n900 though | 21:35 | |
| RST38h | After all, it will be the same OMAP3 hardware, right? | 21:35 |
| kynky | maemo6 will need cap screens i thought | 21:35 |
| javispedro | RST38h: but it'll have multitouch stuff | 21:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mer has much more viability for long-term support. | 21:36 |
| Andril | you read my mind | 21:36 |
| kpel | I don't see how a customer can be expected to keep spending £500 every 1-2 years for something that is not going to be supported in the long term | 21:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Andril, then you're deluded. | 21:36 |
| RST38h | javis: Yes, but do you really see it *require* multitouch? As an option for some operations maybe... | 21:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | kynky, the presentation said it will SUPPORT capacitive screens. | 21:36 |
| javispedro | RST38h: yes. I can see them spreading all over the system interactions. | 21:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori, Nokia really needs to figure out how to support their hardware for a reasonable number of major releases. | 21:36 |
| kynky | mobile phones subsidized on mobile phone contracts , makes it easier | 21:36 |
| RST38h | javis: I fail to see many scenarios for them | 21:36 |
| javispedro | this is a "me too" race, and having multitouch is currently "top notch". | 21:36 |
| Andril | like i said personally - i know after i dump my n810 i won't go that path again | 21:36 |
| Firebird | how does one test multitouch on a PC SDK... | 21:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori, you can't get away with the Symbian-style support with a Linux device. | 21:37 |
| Stskeeps | i still think the best argument against MP only operation is the fact developers has to develop on a PC SDK.. | 21:37 |
| javispedro | bloggers nearly count gimmicks you can do with multitouch while reviewing android phones... | 21:37 |
| Andril | i got mine when it 1st came out and after the GPS trial - it started to collet dust - then came Diablo | 21:37 |
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| javispedro | MPX Xephyr! | 21:37 |
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| konttori | GeneralAntilles: by proper support, I do mean, you guys will have proper support for maemo 5. | 21:38 |
| konttori | and that doesn't mean symbian level support | 21:38 |
| konttori | Hmm... I'll try to write a blog soon (need to clear the content) about what's coming your way this year for the update releases. | 21:39 |
| konttori | we have some pretty nice stuff coming up. | 21:39 |
| RST38h | konttori: Actually, I remembered Nokia guys going bonkers over "services" at the Summit (with the cocreation workshop etc) | 21:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori, N900 users need an upgrade path to Maemo 6. | 21:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | Period. | 21:39 |
| * javispedro 's has a record history for gadgets. every pda / nit he's bough so far has been EOL'd a month or so after buying it. | 21:39 | |
| RST38h | konttori: And the idea of a perfect service Nokia can provide struck me | 21:39 |
| w00t | javispedro: I do hope you're not buying an n900 | 21:39 |
| w00t | ;) | 21:40 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: community backpots are far more sane if we get the whole infrastructure up for community ssu and all that jazz.. | 21:40 |
| RST38h | konttori: It is not Ovi Mail. It is not an App Store. It is not that free all you can eat music initiative | 21:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, unfortunately they don't help normal users. | 21:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, and the bad press is continuing to severely damage this platform. | 21:40 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | Stskeeps: Backporting Maemo 6 stuff to Maemo 5? :) | 21:40 |
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| RST38h | konttori: Simply provide software updates (with a bit of new features thrown in periodically) to your existing devices! :) | 21:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Every blog post and every engadget article I see about Maemo stuff always has comments complaining about support duration. | 21:40 |
| javispedro | already thinking on that? lol :) | 21:40 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N900: more like m6 on n900 hw.. it's both omap3, both GLES.. | 21:41 |
| konttori | RST38h: well, we are doing that. And by existing devices, we mean n900 | 21:41 |
| Stskeeps | i mean, that does help things quite a bit | 21:41 |
| sp3000 | hmm | 21:41 |
| RST38h | konttori: Actually, I had Symbian devices and N8x0 as well in mind | 21:41 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Stskeeps: Yeah, that sounds more sane | 21:41 |
| sp3000 | how does one add an avatar on maemo.org | 21:41 |
| lcuk | sp3000, rename yourself lardman | 21:41 |
| RST38h | konttori: I.e. keep existing users hooked up, like Apple does by releasing updates to their first iPhones even now | 21:42 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N900: and with the various ways around legal issues we came up with in Mer, any person doing the m6 thing would have great conditions for doing so | 21:42 |
| Stskeeps | so, from a typical linux user POV, it isn't a bad situation. | 21:42 |
| konttori | RST38h: of symbian I really cannot say anything | 21:42 |
| kynky | RST38h, arent they paid updates ? | 21:42 |
| javispedro | RST38h: the Apple dream of simultaneous support can't be prolonged forever | 21:42 |
| RST38h | kynky: Possibly, like a subscription | 21:42 |
| RST38h | javis: Of course | 21:42 |
| javispedro | I just want to be there when the first iPhone 1st generation user installs OGLES 2.0 app | 21:43 |
| RST38h | javis: But by throwing at least some crumbs to the old hardware users, they keep them hooked | 21:43 |
| javispedro | and note that Apple could easily beat Imagination until they add OGLES2 support into MBX | 21:43 |
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| microlith | whee | 21:43 |
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| RST38h | javis: these guys are not going to go and buy themselvs a Symbian phone, they will get a new iPhone hw | 21:44 |
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| javispedro | fun, fun, fun. | 21:44 |
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| microlith | go freenode go | 21:44 |
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| Stskeeps | uh wtf.. | 21:44 |
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| RST38h | The Tentacled One Is Coming! | 21:44 |
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| RST38h | Kneel Down Before His Wrath! | 21:44 |
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| suihkulokki | o tentecled one, please kill me before others! | 21:44 |
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| kpel | yay! | 21:44 |
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| lcuk | +1 RST38h, which is why this push for powervr on our hardware helps. | 21:45 |
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| lcuk | -100000 for freenode spaz | 21:45 |
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| javispedro | I think I'm going offline | 21:45 |
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| javispedro | see you. | 21:45 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | Freenode is officially the most shittiest network | 21:45 |
| javispedro | the apocalypse | 21:45 |
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| lcuk | cya javispedro | 21:45 |
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| javispedro | aim for cover! | 21:45 |
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| * qwerty12_N900 kills rst38h | 21:45 | |
| lcuk | qwerty12_N900, now, lets all ask again for irc.maemo.org :p | 21:45 |
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| kynky | efnet used to be fun too | 21:45 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | no one will know | 21:45 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | fuck freenod | 21:45 |
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| lcuk | no | 21:45 |
| javispedro | duck and cover! | 21:45 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk fuck yeah | 21:45 |
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| lcuk | freenode is generally ok | 21:45 |
| qwerty12_N900 | freenode sucks | 21:45 |
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| sp3000 | see you need an irc client with automatic conference mode for channels >n | 21:46 |
| RST38h | konttori: Basically, I think that by doing this as a service (for both Maemo and S60 users) you would have very good user retention, even if these updates are minor | 21:46 |
| javispedro | er.. ok, no need to disconnect. | 21:46 |
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| RST38h | More or less like if you were publishing serialized novels | 21:46 |
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| sp3000 | so you don't see all the noise ;) | 21:46 |
| qwerty12_N900 | First time I've ever been klined =) | 21:46 |
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| RST38h | THEY KILLED CHANSERV!!! | 21:46 |
| konttori | RST38h: symbian doesn't have proper SSU mechanism | 21:46 |
| lcuk | the bastards | 21:46 |
| qwerty12_N900 | THE BASTARDS | 21:46 |
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| RST38h | konttori: Well, it has some over-the-air update mechanism | 21:47 |
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| javispedro | good lord we have an OP here :9 | 21:47 |
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| konttori | and on maemo we have only started properly learning about the ssu updates. believe me, the internal learning takes a lot of time | 21:47 |
| kynky | guess thats one way of getting som1s nick | 21:47 |
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| RST38h | konttori: Not pretty but works as long as you do not employ it too often | 21:47 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Ctulthu will go for X-Fade first | 21:47 |
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| lcuk | +1 konttori | 21:47 |
| konttori | RST38h: well, some models have. | 21:47 |
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| RST38h | konttori: Symbian pretty much updates the whole ROM | 21:47 |
| lcuk | theres learning happening everywhere :) | 21:47 |
| javispedro | so, what was I saying | 21:48 |
| RST38h | konttori: Tolerable when done every 3-4 months or so | 21:48 |
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| RST38h | With Maemo you can do it weekly of course, testing workflow permitting :) | 21:48 |
| lcuk | javispedro, i think you said "im goin offline" | 21:48 |
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| javispedro | lcuk: due to the constant issues :) | 21:48 |
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| lcuk | it was a shitstorm, it passes | 21:48 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | freenode does make for good entertainment | 21:49 |
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| wazd | nom-nom-nom, carputer... | 21:49 |
| lcuk | we should have a netsplit drinking game | 21:49 |
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| lcuk | everytime a major one happens we neck a shot | 21:49 |
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| lcuk | that way, we wouldnt object so much | 21:49 |
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| * lcuk goes back to visualbasic | 21:51 | |
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| qwerty12_N900 | The string of people joining to hide that comment has not come... | 21:52 |
| w00t | qwerty12_N900: you get the lassoo, i'll get the lynching irons | 21:52 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | w00t: Sounds good | 21:53 |
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| javispedro | you too, qwerty12_N900? | 21:53 |
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| qwerty12_N900 | I don't want to be lynched! | 21:53 |
| * javispedro reads -devel -testing flame | 21:54 | |
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| javispedro | instead of just a /user hierarchy we need a thousand hierarchies | 21:54 |
| javispedro | user/* packages that could go into the iphone app store | 21:55 |
| practisevoodoo | has anyone got any experience with opencv on the maemo? i got it installed in the end by now i am getting a seg fault when trying to get an image from the camera | 21:55 |
| lcuk | igagis, PLEASE do not try to override the camera button | 21:55 |
| lcuk | that is not a viable option | 21:55 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: Why not? I use the slider if I need the camera | 21:55 |
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| lcuk | i often leave the slider open but close cam soft | 21:55 |
| lcuk | when im taking a few pics | 21:55 |
| lcuk | and for changing its current use once does not make sense | 21:56 |
| Jaffa | GeneralAntilles: Midgard is a pain though. bugs doesn't have the same issues; midgard makes sloppy UIs terrible; and it encourages wheel reinvention rather than lots of small tools interoperating (brainstorm) | 21:57 |
| javispedro | "user/development" is a contradiction in terms | 21:57 |
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| lcuk | i am a user of development tools | 21:57 |
| lcuk | i am not actively seeking to upgrade them | 21:57 |
| javispedro | but if we consider user "the non-geek" user... | 21:58 |
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| lcuk | then the area will be small | 21:58 |
| Jaffa | javispedro: Imagine a LOGO port? (altho' /education would be a candidate) Or a visual programming language. Or a variety of other tools. | 21:59 |
| Jaffa | Being end-user suitable doesn't mean "lowest common denominator". | 22:00 |
| javispedro | yep, I see your point. | 22:00 |
| * Jaffa offs to watch Micro Men ("Syntax Era" was a much better name) | 22:00 | |
| Jaffa | Oh, and that reminds me - RST38h: Symbian's based on EPOC, not RISC OS. Although, without RISC OS there'd be no ARM, so no EPOC, Symbian or Maemo. | 22:01 |
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| javispedro | well, going out now. | 22:02 |
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| * b-man17 ´s DSL connection sucks :( | 22:21 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | I really wish we had type-to-find in long lists. | 22:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's such a stupidly simply usability improvement. | 22:22 |
| b-man17 | perhaps someone should write a proposal for that :) | 22:23 |
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| GeneralAntilles | There are several enhancement requests. | 22:26 |
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| RST38h | General: actually, lists also do not allow navigation with arrow buttons | 22:28 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So? | 22:30 |
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| niqt_ | hi | 22:40 |
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| niqt_ | hi, did someone this http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32951 ? I need help for it | 22:40 |
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| Firebird | GeneralAntilles, well, GTK 2.16 has it.. so if only maemo had been based off the latest... | 22:46 |
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| VDVsx | RST38h, ping | 22:52 |
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| RST38h | VDVsx: moo. | 22:55 |
| wazd | niqt_: what exactly are you looking for? | 22:56 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, what did you changed in iNes ? | 22:56 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, paste the changelog their, it's easy for the testers ;) | 22:56 |
| VDVsx | niqt_, what do you need ? | 22:57 |
| niqt_ | i'm in http://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_Developer_Device_Queue but i don't understand how i get N900 discount; which form to be filled in nokia forum? Where is real nokia mail? | 22:57 |
| VDVsx | niqt_, wait for a e-mail from Nokia | 22:58 |
| niqt_ | ok | 22:58 |
| niqt_ | thanks | 22:58 |
| VDVsx | niqt_, please that in mind that adding your name to that list doesn't means that you'll receive that e-mail | 22:59 |
| niqt_ | ok... | 22:59 |
| VDVsx | *please take | 22:59 |
| niqt_ | usually how long after the email arrives | 23:00 |
| VDVsx | niqt_, dunno | 23:00 |
| niqt_ | :) | 23:01 |
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| RST38h | VDVsx: the changelog is already there =) | 23:04 |
| Firebird | niqt_, if I recall, emails were only sent to those with 200+ karma | 23:04 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: The only significant change is to the power-save code. All the new versions I have moved into -Testing today save power aggressively, you can lock the tablet and forget about them running | 23:05 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: You can test this by running the device in development mode (the kbd backlight will indicate cpu activity) | 23:05 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, ok, so no changed in UI and usability stuff ? | 23:06 |
| RST38h | Otherwise, it is the same iNES. Well, the virtual keyboard in FamiBASIC is a bit bigger to server fingers better | 23:06 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, testing iNes again ;) | 23:06 |
| RST38h | Just install and enjoy it :) | 23:06 |
| * VDVsx hits RST38h | 23:07 | |
| RST38h | VGB 3.5.3 goes into Extras, VGB 3.5.4 goes into Extras-Testing (main change is powersave again) | 23:07 |
| VDVsx | you forget to add the bugtracker field :( | 23:07 |
| RST38h | This version has no bugtracker field, the next one will (it is already added to control) | 23:08 |
| qwerty12_N900 | RST38h: If you don't want to enable RD-Mode, echo active > /sys/devices/platform/gpio-switch/sleep_ind/state is quicker | 23:08 |
| RST38h | So far, I am adding backtracker URL manually when editing Extras package record (check VGBA,iNES,SlideRule to see that) | 23:08 |
| RST38h | qwerty: Oh, this enables the LEDs? =) | 23:09 |
| RST38h | Thanks ! | 23:09 |
| qwerty12_N900 | Yep | 23:09 |
| qwerty12_N900 | I set it to inactive as the LEDs piss me off... | 23:09 |
| RST38h | well having them on all the time is kinda creepy | 23:09 |
| wazd | niqt_: this list is not connected with DDP | 23:10 |
| wazd | niqt_: just wait for further instructions | 23:10 |
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| RST38h | niqt: Hide your radio and the gun, keep the cyanide capsule ready, wait for further instructions | 23:11 |
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| niqt_ | ok | 23:12 |
| RST38h | niqt: Have you done any development for Maemo devices though? | 23:12 |
| niqt_ | http://www.gitorious.org/+qt-maemo-developers/memberships | 23:13 |
| RST38h | Aha, this qualifies. | 23:13 |
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| niqt_ | 23:18 | |
| niqt_ | so I have to wait for instructions? | 23:18 |
| Firebird | niqt_, that list is so that a council can prioritize who will recieve loaner devices first based on priority of device necessity | 23:18 |
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| niqt_ | ok | 23:19 |
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| VDVsx | Firebird, exact, loaned devices | 23:19 |
| VDVsx | not discounts, for now | 23:20 |
| Firebird | *returned loaner devices | 23:20 |
| VDVsx | ;) | 23:20 |
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| * GeneralAntilles is going to spit in his before he sends it back. :P | 23:22 | |
| VDVsx | lol | 23:22 |
| Firebird | I think writing * was here is sufficient >_> | 23:22 |
| lcuk | using a sharpie on the screen | 23:23 |
| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 23:23 | |
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| tbf | hmm. the last FM radio posting talks about RDS support. seems the program version with RDS is not uploaded yet? | 23:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | The current receiver program doesn't do RDS, no. | 23:26 |
| RST38h | General: Why such hatred towards a piece of plastic with few chunks of silicon? =) | 23:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, not the plastic, the next owner. :P | 23:28 |
| RST38h | The next owner is probably going to be whoever grabs it from the dumpster before it is destroyed | 23:29 |
| TomaszD | do you also get appalling audio quality with the fm radio? or is it just my device | 23:29 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: Using headphones? | 23:29 |
| TomaszD | rst38h doesn't matter | 23:29 |
| TomaszD | I mean yes with headphones plugged in | 23:29 |
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| RST38h | Headphones act as antenna | 23:30 |
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| RST38h | Anyone knows if MPlayer package has been optified? | 23:31 |
| qwerty12_N900 | rst38h: It has not | 23:32 |
| RST38h | pity...will probably fill up my / :) | 23:33 |
| TomaszD | rst38h I know, even with that knowledge it doesn't help | 23:33 |
| TomaszD | maybe it has to be switched from local to dx mode or something | 23:34 |
| RST38h | I would try turning off BT/WiFi, just to see what happens | 23:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, erm, Nokia's going to be recycling returned protos to more developers. :) | 23:34 |
| lcuk | nice! http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/11/01/2033242/Appeal-For-Commuter-GPS-Logs-To-Aid-Electric-Cars?art_pos=1 | 23:34 |
| RST38h | General: Sounds like a better idea than I thought | 23:34 |
| TomaszD | rst38h you can't turn bt off with running radio | 23:34 |
| RST38h | TomaszD: Really? Heh =) | 23:35 |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, cool but how do you know | 23:35 |
| TomaszD | rst38h yep for some reason | 23:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, from paying attention to the Talk thread. | 23:35 |
| TomaszD | but I doubt any interference takes place anyway | 23:35 |
| TomaszD | bbl | 23:36 |
| RST38h | Well it is the same chip | 23:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | TomaszD, audio quality with both receiving and transmitting is great. | 23:36 |
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| tbf | GeneralAntilles: good news. would have been a shame if those protos just would get shredded. | 23:39 |
| VDVsx | GeneralAntilles, well, if you return yours in Sep, dunno if Nokia will bother to loan it again :P | 23:42 |
| EspadaV8_L | how do you ask nokia if you can loan a phone? | 23:43 |
| lcuk | tbf, they wont be shredded, nor recycled, nokia is building a transformerseqs robot and it needs body parts | 23:43 |
| lcuk | it will put down a layer of devices as a flat surface and move via selectively vibrating itself to hover just over the surface of whatever | 23:44 |
| VDVsx | EspadaV8_L, ask for a loaned N900 ? | 23:45 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: Oh, they moved on from dogs, then? | 23:45 |
| lcuk | of course | 23:46 |
| EspadaV8_L | VDVsx: yeah | 23:46 |
| EspadaV8_L | i was able to get one through work, but do they loan them out to 'normal' people | 23:46 |
| VDVsx | EspadaV8_L, yes | 23:46 |
| VDVsx | special people :P | 23:47 |
| EspadaV8_L | i'm special :-D | 23:47 |
| VDVsx | EspadaV8_L, so you've already one, don't need other, right ? lol | 23:47 |
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| EspadaV8_L | had one | 23:47 |
| VDVsx | S/other/another/ | 23:47 |
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| EspadaV8_L | only on a 2 week loan, had to return it after about 10 days, if that :( | 23:48 |
| VDVsx | EspadaV8_L, here's the queue for the next loan: http://wiki.maemo.org/Fremantle_Developer_Device_Queue | 23:48 |
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| TomaszD | GeneralAntilles transmitting is fine here, receiving is awful | 23:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | TomaszD, local interference? | 23:50 |
| TomaszD | location-independent | 23:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe the headphones you're using? | 23:50 |
| TomaszD | I do have a device from a batch before the summit | 23:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | As do I. | 23:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | It works fine. | 23:51 |
| TomaszD | hmm. no N900 label too? | 23:51 |
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| TomaszD | I had two devices for a while, the summit one also had terrible receiving quality if I remember correctly | 23:53 |
| TomaszD | this is really annoying, especially if you say that it works fine for you | 23:53 |
| lcuk | hey qwerty12_N900, this should interest you http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/11/01/2131249/BitTorrent-To-Build-In-Transfer-Throttling-Ability?art_pos=1 | 23:53 |
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| VDVsx | TomaszD, mine works fine too | 23:54 |
| qwerty12_N900 | lcuk: My ISP does not throttle me :) | 23:54 |
| lcuk | i meant for transmittion | 23:54 |
| VDVsx | TomaszD, are you using a summit proto ? | 23:54 |
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| TomaszD | vdvsx no, batch just before the summit | 23:56 |
| TomaszD | and I think I know what the problem is | 23:56 |
| TomaszD | the microphone on the headphones is active | 23:56 |
| VDVsx | without the n900 label right ? | 23:57 |
| TomaszD | can anyone check and just blow into the headset mic while the radio is on? | 23:57 |
| TomaszD | vdvsx correct | 23:57 |
| TomaszD | long story | 23:58 |
| VDVsx | TomaszD, I've one of this too | 23:58 |
| VDVsx | same for GeneralAntilles | 23:58 |
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| EspadaV8_L | VDVsx: hmm, think i'll pass adding myself to the list, they all seem more needy than me | 23:59 |
| TomaszD | so what the hell is wrong with mine... I'll try recording it this week and put it up online for you guys, I think noone believes me :P | 23:59 |
| VDVsx | TomaszD, do you got noise or is other issue ? | 23:59 |
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