IRC log of #harmattan for Monday, 2011-08-15

faenilis anyone here who can check if what I found is a browser bug?00:02
faenilis there*00:02
faeniljust need to visit a page00:02
antman8969what page00:02
Venemoall right00:03
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VenemoMADDE is still buggy regarding dependencies00:03
faenilgo to wordreference.com00:03
faeniland type the word "bug" in the search box :)00:04
Venemo_N950I was only able to build it when I took libircclient-qt-dev off the deps00:04
Venemo_N950but it otherwise works00:04
Venemo_N950I'm gonna install the scratchbox sdk and build with that00:05
faenilantman8969 keep me posted00:05
antman8969going right now faenil00:06
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antman8969seems to work. I did english to spanish. But I think I know what you're talking about. Whenever I get random browser bugs I just clear the cache and cookies... seems to fix it00:07
antman8969for me it happens most on linkedin00:07
faenildid you wait for the result page to load?00:08
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antman8969yea, I saw the definition of bug and a bunch of other stuff.... I'll try again to make sure00:08
faeniland I'll try deleting cache00:09
antman8969lol now it bugged00:09
faenilgood :)00:09
faenilI'm reporting it :)00:10
SpeedEvilCan anyone point me at the thread on the authentication-account problem?00:10
antman8969theres tons of stuff like that on the stock browser. I've been using firefox00:10
SpeedEvilI can't seem to find it00:10
faenilsecond report today, let's track them out :D00:10
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Venemothis time I installed just the harmattan scratchbox SDK (without the fremantle one)00:29
Venemoand there is no /scratchbox/login00:30
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antman8969venemo, happened to me once and I had to logout and log back in for it to appear00:45
Venemoantman8969, yeah... well, I just rebooted :P00:47
Venemoa package is ready :)00:48
VenemoZrZ, are you RzR?00:48
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ZrZVenemo: sort of,  ZrZ is to rzr what mr hyde is to doctor jeckyl00:51
faenilanyway firefox is slower than default...00:51
VenemoZrZ, all right :)00:54
VenemoZrZ, I've added debian packaging to my IRC client00:54
VenemoZrZ, do you wish to add it to your repo?00:54
ZrZsure let's do that00:56
ZrZenough waited00:56
VenemoZrZ, see /topic in #irc-chatter for URL00:57
VenemoZrZ, simple dpkg-buildpackage in scratchbox works00:57
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VenemoLOL @
ieatlint404 ?01:12
macmaNwhy, was there supposed to be something there01:14
macmaNso where's the lol01:15
Venemowell, it's still their device. they could have added a simple page with one sentence and a picture.01:15
kimjuis there such links for all other devices?01:16
VenemoI think01:16
Venemomhm, yes01:17
ieatlintyeah, but that's a portal for consumers to their devices01:18
ieatlintthe n950 isn't a device they are marketing/selling01:19
ieatlintand advertising it would simply confuse consumers01:19
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VenemoSpeedEvil, antman8969, lcuk, RST38h, alterego, MohammadAG, w00t_, GOOD NEWS: -> there is a link to a downloadable .deb :)01:20
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Venemo_N950hey TSCHAKeee01:54
TSCHAKeeehey :)01:54
TSCHAKeeesaw the link to the release, downloaded :) thanks :)01:55
TSCHAKeeedunno if you saw01:55
Venemo_N950TSCHAKeee, saw what?01:55
TSCHAKeeeone sec01:55
TSCHAKeeeVenemo_N950: and..
Venemo_N950nice, but what is this?01:56
TSCHAKeeewell, we're writing a new Orbiter for LinuxMCE, that uses QML... i'm doing specific QML for Harmattan....01:57
TSCHAKeeeVenemo_N950: LinuxMCE being a massive smart home platform that unifies lighting, media, climate, security, and telecom all under one system01:57
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TSCHAKeeeVenemo_N950: <-- demo video from 2007, using the old UI... there isn't anything else out there that encompasses our scope...01:58
TSCHAKeeethe UI you see there is Orbiter, and we're writing a new replacement using Qt/QML.01:58
Venemo_N950and what does Orbiter do?01:59
Venemo_N950the GUI indeed looks nice01:59
* javispedro wishes it was a Space Shuttle Simulator =)01:59
TSCHAKeeeVenemo_N950: well, simplest explanation, Orbiter is a remote control, but it's a lot more intelligent than that.01:59
TSCHAKeeeit is the house wide UI used in LinuxMCE01:59
Venemo_N950javispedro, are you still interested in an IRC client for the N950?01:59
TSCHAKeeerunning across multiple devices (TVs, cell phones, tablets, PDAs, etc..), all in sync with each other.02:00
Venemo_N950TSCHAKeee, mhmm, sounds nice :)02:00
javispedroVenemo_N950: until I end hardcore testing on my N950 it is rather unstable, so no apps for me for now =)02:00
Venemo_N950javispedro, what kind of hardcore testing?02:00
javispedroI've removed the compositor02:00
javispedrowant to learn =)02:01
Venemo_N950and what will that accomplish?02:01
javispedrojust researching for the time being, still playing with vsync and all the video driver bugs02:02
Venemo_N950if you happen to change your mind, see :)02:02
javispedroVenemo_N950: thanks and good work!02:03
Venemo_N950javispedro :)02:03
antman8969venemo venemo_n950, looking very good02:03
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Venemo_N950thanks antman8969 :)02:04
Venemo_N950antman8969, try it for yourself02:04
antman8969i'm trying to get on #harmattan as antman_n950 right now02:04
antman8969its a shame people will have to use the vkb tho02:05
antman8969half the screen gone02:05
Venemo_N950it plays nicely with the vkb, it's especially usable in portrait mode.02:06
Venemo_N950~seen fiferboy02:06
infobotfiferboy <~fiferboy@Maemo/community/contributor/fiferboy> was last seen on IRC in channel #harmattan, 2d 2h 17m 22s ago, saying: 'Venemo: Are you running the stock version on the N950?'.02:06
Venemo_N950GeneralAntilles, if you are still interested, please see
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Venemo_N950n950evil :)02:28
TSCHAKeeeis there a list of platformIconIds????02:31
antman8969kind of02:32
antman8969you can see them on your phone02:32
antman8969i think its02:32
antman8969I'll cehck02:32
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antman8969the ones that start with icon-m are the toolbar ones02:33
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TSCHAKeeeawesome thanks02:38
* SpeedEvil keeps wanting to tap the top-bar to open an app-list02:44
antman8969at least to see battery percent...02:45
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antman8969so I've honestly got no idea what an ident is for irc...02:51
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antman8969ident == nickserv?02:55
antman8969that seems to have worked02:55
SpeedEvilantman: completely, complretly bogus solution.02:55
SpeedEvilbme-datalogger --battery-percent|awk '{print $NF}' on a shell02:55
SpeedEviland then blow the font size up to 150 point02:55
SpeedEviland you can see it in the app switcher02:55
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TSCHAKeeedamn, I am having a brain fart05:22
TSCHAKeeeI need to right align an icon, where do I anchor?05:22
TSCHAKeeeinside the rectangle, close to the right edge05:22
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: right side to right side of rectangle?05:23
TSCHAKeeeyeah.. something like05:24
hiemanshuanchor.right = parent.right05:24
TSCHAKeee[   Some Text                    ^ ]05:24
TSCHAKeeewhere i am trying to position the carat05:24
TSCHAKeeeoh shit i should be looking at TumblerButton05:25
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: anchor it and use an anchor margin?05:25
TSCHAKeeethat does it05:25
TSCHAKeeei'm basically making a header that can pop up a context menu05:26
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TSCHAKeeeI found the up/down icon thingy05:26
TSCHAKeeeand am just trying to fudge stuff that's in MTF05:26
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hiemanshuhah ok05:29
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n950evilThis is a test of the vkbd05:45
hiemanshun950evil: hah, like it?05:45
n950evildefinately easier in landsx05:46
hiemanshuwell if you find a bug or want something added, patches are welcome :)05:46
n950evilI think I would l05:47
* hiemanshu is trying to implement /exec05:47
n950evilprefer vkbd edges a bit further from horizontal edges.05:47
TSCHAKeeecan MenuLayouts get their items from data models ?05:48
n950evilThough not your fault.05:48
n950evilno clue, sorry05:48
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: yes, look at and how we have models05:49
n950evilI added some.bits to the wiki features page, nothing novel though.05:50
TSCHAKeeeactually i did look at that05:50
TSCHAKeeehiemanshu: basically, I have a context menu, and rather than statically defining menuitems, i'm wanting to grab them from a model...05:50
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: you need to set Q_PROPERTY for stuff that you want to be able to access, Q_INVOKABLE for functions that QML can access, and then register them with qml using qmlRegisterType05:52
TSCHAKeee*nod* yeah, I'm using the bits from ListViews05:52
TSCHAKeeealready have my stuff exposed from C++ into the QML05:52
* TSCHAKeee makes a pic05:53
hiemanshuI have to run for a bit, I'll be back in 1005:53
MohammadAGshouldn't a Flickable extend when the children resize?05:54
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hiemanshuMohammadAG: yes06:02
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: hmm, whats wrong with it?06:03
TSCHAKeeethose are static06:03
MohammadAGhiemanshu, it's not for me06:03
TSCHAKeeehiemanshu: i need to get those menu items from a model06:03
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: make a repeater and get the data from the model06:05
hiemanshuTSCHAKeee: look at the ChatPage
hiemanshuMohammadAG: it does for me06:06
TSCHAKeeecompletely understood, thanks hiemanshu06:07
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Venemo_N950good morning Harmattan!10:24
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rcgmorning Venemo_N95010:38
rcgbtw this is the tree view i am currently implementing ->
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rcgthe link shows already a working version.. in the meantime i added a little bit more properties to ease the usage and handling of selections10:39
Venemo_N950hey rcg10:42
Venemo_N950rcg, check out
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rcgbookmarked :) am currently about to go to work.. will try this once i get back10:50
Venemorcg :)10:53
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rcgbrb.. the way to work is quite short ;)11:05
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Venemoso, here is the news:!/Venemo/status/103008339067273216 (and I've made a bunch of shortened URLs on lcuk's suggestion)11:09
djszapi"Sorry, that page doesn’t exist!"11:14
Venemodjszapi, probably the fault of Cassandra or whatever NoSQL db they use. it appears to me :P11:15
Venemodjszapi, see or /topic in #irc-chatter11:16
Venemodjszapi, try it :) we have a known issues section on and if you wish for a new feature, add it to :)11:23
Venemo~seen fiferboy11:24
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rcgwork work..11:24
Venemo_N950rcg :)11:24
djszapiVenemo: I am all sort of busy with catching up the work thingy after the desktop summit :) slightly different mood :p11:24
Venemo_N950djszapi, sure, no hurry :P11:25
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djszapi -> Actually, it is a feature imho.11:47
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djszapiwithout open mode, /var/lib/aegis/restok.conf is securely signed11:49
djszapiYou cannot load a module in sales devices and the sysfs is protected properly by tcb.11:51
kimjuZrZ, I know.. obs doesn't like that package. luckily it releases the builder for others to use, it just reports it as still building.12:01
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djszapikimju: c-obs does not like so many packages ;p12:02
mariobanyone trying to use --splash with the invoker? My image get rotated and scaled to landscape mode but it should be portrait12:02
kimjuI'll try a workaround (use aegis-deb-add directly, not via aegis-deb-util) when I have some time.12:03
kimjusomeone reported that change fixed few other packages adding their own aegis manifests.12:05
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ArkenoiVenemo, is character encoding configurable?12:20
djszapiVenemo: I will play with telepathy-idle and IRC a bit when I get the time.12:21
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Venemo_N950Arkenoi, afaik it's unicode12:22
Venemo_N950djszapi, mhm12:22
Venemo_N950I still don't get what's so good about telepathy-idle12:22
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djszapitelepathy is not a playground like libircclient12:23
djszapiand telepathy is already used for couple of things on this gadget...12:23
ZrZkimju: did u test it ?12:23
Venemo_N950djszapi, you can use my gui with it if you wish12:24
ZrZi mean the snapshot version of terminal ?12:24
kimjuZrZ, no, haven't had time.12:24
kimjuZrZ, ?12:24
Venemo_N950djszapi, I ttried to check telepathy-idle, but google didn't find it12:24
ZrZok i'll try to build it if i have time12:24
djszapiVenemo_N950 which google ? ;)12:25
ZrZnow i am testing Venemo irc-chatter12:25
kimjuZrZ, well, I've been using that version build locally on scratchbox.12:25
djszapifull of results to me:
Venemo_N950djszapi, it found an obsolete project page12:25
djszapi -> quite up-to-date actually.12:26
Venemo_N950redirected to telepathy's webpage which didn't have link for it12:26
kimjuZrZ, but didn't have time to try the aegis change yet.12:26
djszapiVenemo_N950: you are saying you could not find telepathy-idle by google ? :)12:27
ArkenoiVenemo, there are many non-unicode channels on irc :-(12:27
djszapiVenemo_N950: sorry, but it was 2 secs for me.12:28
djszapiI just typed telepathy-idle into google, and second and third link is the telepathy page :)12:28
w00t_it's probably more helpful to read up on telepathy in general, idle is just a connection manager (something which connects and talks protocol, afaik) for irc12:28
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meceVenemo o/12:32
ZrZit doesnt want to restart12:33
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Arkenoiis there a way to get debug log for wifi authentication on harmattan? i cannot figure out what's wrong with it and error message is as meaningful as typical nokia error messaging "something is wrong"12:39
Arkenoitypical error message even12:40
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xarcassArkenoi: you may have a look into /var/log/syslog12:42
Arkenoifailed to run MLME command, ret=-2212:49
Arkenoiwonder what does it mean12:49
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Arkenoi seems that it is that one12:52
MeeGoBotBug 22530 maj, Undecided, ---, carsten, VERI INVALID, Cannot connect to WLAN12:52
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Stskeepsif harmattan, unlikely to be on meego.com12:53
djszapiStskeeps: except c-obs bugs.12:53
ArkenoiStskeeps, cannot find this bug in a more proper place :-(12:55
Venemo_N950so djszapi, if I had chosen telepathy idle, not only would I have to learn QML, but the workings of telepathy as well13:03
Venemo_N950I don't see the advantage13:03
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djszapiVenemo_N950: *sigh*13:05
djszapinvm, I will play with it...13:05
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radiofree_irc chatter, very nice!13:06
Venemo_N950radiofree, thx :)13:06
radiofreeVenemo_N950: it's really rather nice, great mobile irc client that works in portrait mode13:07
radiofree_i concur!13:08
djszapiVenemo_N950: actually telepathy is used for almost everything on this device regarding the connections. I highly recommend the output of dpkg -l \*telepathy\*. It might even be the story it could be somewhat embedded better into the system with telepathy-idle. As said, telepathy is sponsored by Nokia and Collabora. libircclient is just a toy. I do not see it a good way of doing things, but I have been saying it to you from the beginning...13:14
djszapiand regarding this, it is (for me) not an option to learn something if it can be better.13:16
djszapi* to not learn13:16
tommamoved cuteexplorer to projects , if someone is interested trying it13:19
Venemo_N950djszapi, I know what telepathy is13:23
Venemo_N950djszapi, and I know that the builtin messages app uses it13:23
Venemo_N950djszapi, but I don't understand what my app could benefit from it13:24
djszapilet me not repeat myself gazillion times.13:24
Venemo_N950well, you have repeated yourslef, but didn't answer the simple question13:25
Venemo_N950what would my app benefit from telepathy-idle?13:25
Venemo_N950last time I checked, telepathy-idle couldn't join channels13:25
radiofreetomma: looks good, but I think i'd prefer to be able to double tap to open folders13:25
w00t_um.. it can, Venemo_N95013:25
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w00t_and has been able to for a very long time, afaik13:26
djszapiVenemo_N950: Accounts use telepathy for almost everything13:26
djszapisame with xmpp, gtalk, skype, sip everything13:26
Venemo_N950well it can't on N90013:26
w00t_the UI may not be able to13:26
djszapialso, it is sponsored by two big companies, not a leisure time stuff13:26
w00t_but the backend (telepathy-idle) can13:26
Venemo_N950djszapi, yes, I KNOW.13:26
djszapiwhat is your point if you know this ?13:26
Venemo_N950no need to repeat yourself :)13:27
djszapiIsn't it nice to have a sponsored project instead of a toy ?13:27
w00t_from what I know of the problem, it's the same as on harmattan is the same: the UI cannot handle group chat very well/at all13:27
djszapiisn't it nice to embed it into account if it is possible, or at least try ?13:27
djszapior try to integrate it better with harmattan as much as possible ? :)13:27
djszapiconsistency is also nice with the rest.13:27
Venemo_N950djszapi, harmattan's message GUI isn't well equipped for irc13:27
radiofreetomma: selecting is nice, but it might be better if it had a separate scroll area13:28
djszapiVenemo: for personal queries ?13:28
djszapiI find it completely fine.13:28
djszapialso, the integrated account management would also be a nice thing.13:28
djszapichannels are a bit different matter, but still better integrated idea than the current13:29
Venemo_N950for personal queries, nice, yes13:29
Venemo_N950but not for channles13:29
Venemo_N950so at the end I would have needed to make a GUI anyway13:29
djszapifor the channels, not for everything13:29
Venemo_N950channels use the same gui as queries in my client, so I didn't do any extra work. :)13:30
djszapisorry, but "extra work" is a work arguement compared to the user experience for me.13:30
djszapi* weak13:30
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djszapiI like things are integrated, and I would try to make it happen that way further on.13:31
Venemo_N950if you think the user experience of my app is bad, you can suggest solutions.13:31
Venemo_N950swapping backend is no solution to a gui issue13:31
djszapiand as I said, I feel more confident with a sponsored project than with a toy from a guy who can be crashed by a car anytime.13:31
djszapiyour idea does not work with integrating imho.13:31
djszapiso it has no "solution".13:31
Venemo_N950what do you wish to integrate?13:32
rishiVenemo_N950: The decision between Telepathy and non-Telepathy is not realy a GUI issue. Or much more than a GUI issue.13:32
djszapiI agree with rishi about it13:32
djszapiit is not just gui issue, much more.13:32
tommaradiofree, yeah that would be nice... also i think i will implement possibility to open files by double tappig. those wont be so hard to implement13:32
rishiOfcourse I am biased because I hack on Telepathy Idle.13:32
Venemo_N950I just wanted a nice irc gui, and made it. what is the issue?13:32
djszapiVenemo_N950: it would be nice if the query works like messaging13:32
djszapinot a complete new Ui.13:33
rishiVenemo_N950: Your UI might be fine, but this is not just about the UI. If you are wondering why I am saying so, I can explain.13:33
djszapirishi: please do, I am interested in telepathy-idle :p13:34
Venemo_N950please do, rishi13:34
rishiVenemo_N950: With Telepathy, IM is sort of a desktop service. There is a daemon that does the actual network communication, and all UIs are clients of it.13:35
rishiVenemo_N950: eg., in GNOME 3, GNOME Shell and Empathy are both clients.13:35
rishiVenemo_N950: So if you log into your IM accounts using Empathy, and then close it, it is possible for you to still stay logged in.13:36
rishiIf someone sends a message, GNOME Shell can give a minimalistic UI for you to reply.13:36
rishiOr if you want to get a full featured client, you can again launch Empathy to continue the conversation.13:37
Venemo_N950I know, I use gnome-shell13:37
rishiVenemo_N950: Similarly it is possible to imagine that you can write click on a link on your browser and say "send it to contact XXXX".13:37
rishiVenemo_N950: Something that we often do on IRC.13:38
rishiie. copy-pasting links to pastebins, documentation, etc..13:38
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* djszapi is making notes13:39
rishiVenemo_N950: And ofcourse, having another IRC backend with its own set of bugs and quirks is sort of pointless.13:39
rishiVenemo_N950: So unless you have a really really strong case against Telepathy, I would suggest you go for it.13:39
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rishiVenemo_N950: People will love you. :-)13:39
djszapirishi: telepathy-idle supports sasl, right ?13:40
Venemo_N950okay, so there is no gnome-shell on N950... what's the point of reasoning with gnome-shell features13:40
djszapibah, that is just an example of those... :)13:40
rishiVenemo_N950: I am sure Nokia phones have some sort of shell that is not /bin/bash. ;-)13:40
djszapiwe do have.13:40
Venemo_N950rishi, yes, but it has none of the features you listed above.13:41
djszapiso all what we need actually is an account plugin.13:41
Venemo_N950no, because you do not have a decent gui.13:42
djszapibut I was always lucky with telepathy, it was easy to use their interface, at least for me.13:42
rishiVenemo_N950: I gave the example of GNOME 3 because that is what I use, you can easily map them onto Meego or Maemo or whatever.13:42
djszapiof course you need the Ui, but that is something we discussed above.13:42
Venemo_N950an account plugin would not give me the oportunity that a dedicated irc client does.13:42
rishidjszapi: The Telepathy interface is not really meant for users.13:42
rishidjszapi: It is meant for programmers who will write clients.13:43
djszapirishi: I was speaking about the API usage, indeed.13:43
djszapiaka. programming interface.13:43
rishiVenemo_N950: Your IRC client will take the stuff from the account plugin to log in. (Assuming I correctly understood what the account plugin is)13:43
rishidjszapi: Right. :-)13:43
djszapirishi: it supports sasl, does not it ?13:44
rishidjszapi: You can try. I don't know much about SASL.13:44
djszapirishi: you misunderstood the account plugin13:44
rishiFile bugs if it doesn't. Then I will look at it. :-)13:44
djszapino, the login is handled by mission control via sasl13:45
djszapiyou just ask the account to go online and it does the magic13:45
rishidjszapi: I thought the account plugin is just the UI to input a new IRC account.13:45
rishieg., Empathy offers one.13:45
djszapisasl is needed for this.13:46
rishidjszapi: Then it probably works.13:46
djszapithe account plugin will create an account in the accounts fw, and associate it to a telepathy accounts plugin13:46
djszapiand also store the password for the signon framework in the secure storage13:46
rishidjszapi: All I know is that works in GNOME. Not sure if MeeGo has something different going on.13:47
djszapirishi: I am all for a telepathy-idle based irc client :)13:47
rishidjszapi: I had the skeleton for a XChat-like client, but don't have enough time to do it alone.13:47
rishidjszapi: That was for GNOME, not MeeGo.13:48
rishiVenemo_N950: In any case, it is your project. It is not up to me to dictate what you will do. So its completely upto you. :-)13:49
djszapirishi: I might poke you about it later, if you do not mind. :p13:49
rishidjszapi: Sure. Find me on #telepathy.13:49
Venemo_N950well, if you want to implement a backend based on telepathy, please do.13:50
djszapirishi: we had a pleasant time with collabora/telepathy guys at the desktop summit, btw :)13:50
Venemo_N950file a merge request, and I will merge in your stuff.13:50
rishidjszapi: Ah, you were there. :-)13:50
rishidjszapi: So was I.13:50
djszapiVenemo_N950: I will start a new project, no worry :)13:50
djszapirishi: with Francesco, Dario and others ?13:51
djszapirishi: I was hanging at the hostel with the qt/kde telepathy guys mostly.13:52
rishidjszapi: Ok. :-)13:52
Venemo_N950djszapi, feel free to use my gui.13:52
rishiVenemo_N950: If you need help with the Telepathy Dbus API or something, I can try to help.13:53
djszapiVenemo_N950: not sure about the latest state, but I did not like the idea when you tried to zoom the screen by using char sizes.13:53
rishiBut I don't think having multiple backends for the same IRC client makes sense.13:53
djszapiI would just use pincharea, that is13:53
djszapirishi: *Nods* -> Do one thing, but do it well linux philisophy here :)13:53
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Venemo_N950djszapi, my app has no zooming at all, not sure what you are talking about13:54
djszapithen it is no go for me13:54
Venemo_N950well then please tell me what kind of zooming you need13:55
djszapiI told you more times, but you were against the idea. That is why I thought it is better if I do not ask it more and do on my own :)13:55
Venemo_N950I've been asking you to tell me this idea for a while, but you didn't have the time13:55
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Venemo_N950I am definitely not against it :)13:56
djszapiyes, you were.13:56
Venemo_N950so, what do you have in mind?13:56
djszapiyou told me that: "it is not a use case, you just allow to set the char size", that is13:56
djszapifor me it is a use case, mostly on N913:56
Venemo_N950so you wish to pich-to-zoom into the text area?13:57
lardmananyone know the magic needed to turn a Qt slot into a DBus method?13:57
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djszapiVenemo_N950: I told you telepathy-idle and this zooming from the beginning, none of them is available. It is easier if I do it myself :p13:59
Venemo_N950djszapi, you still haven't told me how you imagine the zoom feature. would a pincharea do what you wish to do?14:00
Arkenoican anyone recommend a simple accounts plugin template source to get the idea what API looks like?14:00
djszapirishi: I wanted to port konvi, but the codebase did not want it :p Ui and functionality code are not separeated, unfortunately.14:02
Venemo_N950djszapi, if I put a PinchArea over the TextArea, will that suit you or you have something else in mind?14:03
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mecewtf is wrong with my qtsdk now? I'm getting rcc/qrc_res.cpp Error 1 File not found14:30
meceah nvrmind got it14:30
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mikhasmece, you should not be using resource files14:46
mikhasconsider installing your data and qml files properly14:46
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spenapmikhas, can you elaborate on that? why you consider resources being improper?14:46
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mikhasfirst, it blows up the size of your binary14:48
Venemowho cares?14:49
Venemoit works, period14:49
mikhassecond, you cannot just update the data files separately14:49
spenapwhen would you update the data files separately? and as for the size of the binary, it of course depends on the resources' size14:53
mecemikhas, why?14:53
mecemikhas, righty. Well not using causes issues with paths and stuff.14:54
mikhasfor qml developement? all the time14:55
Venemoit just works with qrc, so why would I bother changing it?14:55
mecemikhas, I agree that it's pretty sweet to have the qml stuff open, and I do that occasionally, but for distribution on multiple platforms qrc files is much much much simpler. Much.14:56
mikhasyeah, that seems true as well14:59
meceanyway I just started a new project in qtsdk and ran into that problem (fixed it already, was a typo in the qrc file)15:00
ZrZ testing #irc on #harmattan #n950 using irc-chatter thanks to Venemo enjoy #video next step #xmpp now (#n950club)15:00
meceI'd like to be able to scp stuff into my N950 but for some reason I get Permission denied. I can scp from device (like pull), but not from home computer to device (like push)15:02
* mece knows nada about ssh stuff15:02
kimjuSage, I can't find the bug about partition alignment now. but the problem is that the SD cards have internal erase block / allocation unit sizes of 32k, 64k, .. even up to 4MB (or 8MB). if the partitions are aligned to start from these boundaries, most writes will only affect only one internal block. this happens nowadays even with new HDDs with 4k block size. with the legacy of starting the first partition at offset of 512 bytes and 4k writes you get the wo15:04
kimjueh, wrong channel.15:04
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TronicI am using QtSDK with Harmattan target but for some reason Pulseaudio symbols are not found.15:10
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TronicOh, wait a sec. Now I am getting linker errors instead.15:11
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Tronic(was missing some includes apparently)15:12
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ajalkanewhats the command you're using?15:14
KypeliThere's a bug in splashscreen: it shows initially in landscape even if no --splash-landscape is specified. Is this fixed in N9 or am I really doing something wrong?15:15
xarcassKypeli: just rotate your splash image - it works15:16
KypeliThe .png picture is in portrait.15:16
xarcassKypeli: btw, when screenshots are taken, they are also rotated.15:17
KypeliI only want a splash in portrait since that is what my app is in15:17
xarcassKypeli: I have both splash screens in my app, and I've just rotated portrait-oriented one. Now it works perfectly15:17
Arkenoioh sh*t. my phonebook is full of duplicate entries again. will i ever see google sync that does not do it?15:17
Kypelixarcass: Oh right. I'll work around this then15:18
trxnice, i created a basic qml file and set both tool bar and status bar to be invisible... what i got is TWO status bars a one tool bar... One status bar rotates as the phone rotates and the other is fixed..15:18
trxanyone had this problem?15:18
trxand one*15:19
xarcasstrx: showFullScreen() usually does the trick15:22
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trxxarcass yeah i just tried that and now i get no tool bar and only one status bar15:24
trxhow do i get rid of that status bar?15:24
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xarcasstrx: which one? top or bottom?15:24
trxtop one15:24
mecestatusBar: false15:25
xarcassin PageStackWindow15:25
xarcassonly it's showStatusBar property15:25
TronicHmm, now, how does one link pulseaudio with QtSDK & friends?15:29
TronicI've been using CMake before, no idea about qmake.15:29
VenemoCONFIG += link_pkgconfig15:29
VenemoPKGCONFIG += your_pkgconfig_name15:29
mecexarcass, righty.15:29
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djszapilbt: -> virtual memory exhausted: Cannot allocate memory15:30
mecesrsly how the hell am I supposed to run a harmattan app on my pc? failing miserably.15:34
djszapiqemu ?15:34
mecedoesn't seem to work15:35
meceI always get timeout15:35
Venemomece, try scratchbox15:35
Venemoor run on device15:35
meceVenemo, well as I mentioned earlier, I can't scp stuff into the phone unless I pull it, and I can't do that on this this piece of crap windows machine.15:36
ajalkanefirst run results in timeout, but qemu is started. Second run deploys into qemu15:36
meceand I tried to connect the phone with usb but couldn't get the networking thing to work on the computer15:36
Venemomece, does Qt Creator & SDK connection utility not work?15:36
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meceVenemo, it says I'm supposed to click automagically install networking blah blah, but that doesn't work15:37
ajalkaneoh windows...15:37
mikhasmece, install unbuntu in virtualbox?15:38
meceyeah.. I've got scratchbox working just fine in linux15:38
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Venemomece, plug your phone in and click SDK mode, then wait for a few minutes, then you can add it to Qt Creator's Linux devices section in Tools/options.15:38
mikhasthen run sdk from there?15:38
mecemikhas, I guess I could but I dont' wanna.15:38
mikhasmece, well but if you have sbox, then why do you worry?15:38
mecewell that's not here.15:38
mikhasyou can just run stuff inside sbox, no?15:39
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djszapiRzR950 kdelibs vanished from the shared repository, do you have any idea why ?15:40
mecevenemo, ok... making some progress...15:40
mecebah failed.15:41
Venemomece, you need the SDK connectivity utility on your N950 the first time you configure it15:41
mecei have that.15:41
mecebut windows didn't manage to install the "new device"15:41
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Venemowell, it works on my windows, when I happen to boot to that instead of my Fedora15:42
meceI have xp15:42
TronicVenemo: Thanks :)15:42
meceWindows can't find drivers for "N950 RNDIS/Ethernet" device15:43
mecenow I know the problem15:43
mecethere was an error when trying to install madde usb driver15:44
meceI'll try to reinstall that.15:44
mecehey does the N9 have an invisible led like th N950?15:44
alteregoOops, my N950 just ate the pavement :/15:45
alteregotook a little chunk out of one of the corners :(15:45
aslaniI managed to do the same in july :(15:47
meceok woo!15:48
mecemaking progress :D15:49
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* Arkenoi wonders if any of e7 cases will fit n950 well15:49
meceArkenoi, I doubt that. The screen/keyboard bits fit together in a very different matter on the two devices.15:50
meceok testing....15:52
mececomeon bitch, work!15:52
npmi've been carrying my n950 around in a giant sunglasses case to prevent damage15:52
meceI've just been careful. I even left it at home when I went to a blackmetal festival.15:53
npmmade a rule... no walking around with it in my pocket (since that's how i broke my n900 screen)15:53
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npmis that an n950 in a serengeti driver case, or are you just glad to see me...15:53
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Venemoand I just carry the N950 with me everywhere in my pocket.15:55
npmtoo bad google isn't buying nokia, instead they're buying motorola...15:55
npmso much for wp715:55
kimjubtw, any suggestions what to use to wipe off fingerprints from the screen?15:55
meceI use an oakey bag15:55
meceor a N900 cloth thing15:56
aslanimy t-shirt ...15:56
meceor t-shirt15:56
mece125 billion?15:56
TronicNice boost on Nokia stock. I hear that Kari Stadigh is buying it.15:56
npmthat's a good valuation for a shit company15:56
npmlooks up kari stadigh15:57
Tronic+10 % so far, in 15 minutes or so.15:57
meceis someone buying nokia?15:57
Tronicmece: Yes, and a lot of it.15:57
meceso is nokia going up due to goolerola?15:58
* Arkenoi did fell with motorcycle once with n900 in my pocket (and wearing no protective dress as it was just a short trip to a nearby grocery store). the outer pocket it was in was noticeably damaged, but n900 suffered even not a single scratch. it it was n950 i could shit bricks!15:58
meceI don't understand the market. why are the other phone companies going up like crazy?16:01
npmNokia Corporation (NYSE: NOK): traded higher by 8.58% or $0.46/share in pre-market trading to $5.82. In the past year, the shares have traded as low as $4.82 and as high as $11.75. The shares are currently trading below the 200-day moving average but above the 50-day moving average. The stock may be range bound between these two levels where the 200-day moving average of $7.84 represents resistance and the 50-day moving average of $5.7416:02
npmwould be an area of support.16:02
Arkenoidroid could be a good phone if motorola did not try so hard to lock it down with "protected bootloader" and other stupid shit16:02
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npmthe market is lemmings running off a cliff. that's all you need to understand16:03
* Arkenoi wonders what an idiot does one need to be to spend money to cause troubles to own customers16:03
mecesuccess! The child does not want to swear!!!16:07
Venemomece ?16:07
meceit's a quote from south park, but I managed to run stuff on the device :)16:08
DocScrutinizermoo maemonians16:08
meceDocScrutinizer, \o16:08
Venemomoo DocScrutinizer16:08
Venemomece, congrats, what was wrong?16:08
GAN900DocScrutinizer, all Chaosed out?16:08
VenemoDocScrutinizer, have you heard that javispedro managed to disable Aegis?16:09
DocScrutinizerscatching the mosquito bites ;-D16:09
DocScrutinizerso I'm happy I cancelled my "steam roller vs N950" live performance on Camp :-P16:10
VenemoGAN900, just 'cause you said that you were interested:!/Venemo/status/10300833906727321616:10
VenemoDocScrutinizer :P16:10
VenemoDocScrutinizer, I want hostmode already16:10
JaffaVenemo: As requested
GAN900Has anybody gotten Firefox yet?16:11
DocScrutinizerwho wouldn't, on a device with no swappable storage?16:11
VenemoJaffa, thanks very much :)16:11
JaffaGAN900: Not the most recent one16:12
DocScrutinizer>> The app's homepage on is linked to from his tweet << MEH!!16:12
GAN900The WebKit browser is profoundly wrong.16:13
VenemoJaffa, you could have linked or :P16:13
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mikhasGAN900, you have no idea about the backstory. Maybe next time we meet, I can tell you some bits.16:13
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GAN900mikhas, I can only imagine.16:14
* GAN900 conjures up evil Symbianites.16:15
RST38hGAN900: YOu called, Master?16:16
DocScrutinizerVenemo: you know what I'll do to you when I click one of those URLs and my konqueror _again_ shows a blank page with a lil blue bird, after loading 105 images...16:16
VenemoDocScrutinizer, as I said, click on or
VenemoDocScrutinizer, neither of these have anything to do with the little blue bird.16:17
DocScrutinizerand why would I frown on a nice speaking URL like ?16:18
VenemoDocScrutinizer, you wouldn't? thats' a relief :)16:18
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DocScrutinizerno I wouldn't. I fact I *hate* tinyURL and similar nonsense16:19
DocScrutinizerjust on N950 I see a justification :-D16:19
JaffaVenemo: I link to the tweet which links to that. The tweet is the announcement, AFAICS :-p16:19
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DocScrutinizertweet? WTF is a tweet? :-P16:20
VenemoDocScrutinizer, this nonesense is easier to type into a mobile16:20
VenemoDocScrutinizer, otherwise I agree withy ou16:20
DocScrutinizerthen we are all on same page regarding this :-D16:21
Venemoyeah, definitely :)16:21
RST38hBTW, has soeone collected ALL links to harmattan based projects into a single page?16:21
DocScrutinizer...just because friggin N950 is missing cross app c&p16:21
VenemoDocScrutinizer, it can C&P, just not into the browser.16:22
DocScrutinizerRST38h: awesome suggestion16:22
RST38hpreferably not hosted on meego.com16:22
DocScrutinizerwhy not?16:22
VenemoRST38h, make a
Venemoand also move all harmattan-related shit under
DocScrutinizeror s/meego/maemo/16:23
RST38hDoc:no, I meant it16:23
DocScrutinizerbut still keep the /harmattan/*16:23
DocScrutinizera public html based bookmarks page - awesome16:24
DocScrutinizeresp since "bookmarks" in harm browser are a hoax16:25
Venemoare there even bookmarks in harmattan browser?16:25
Venemoif there are, I wasn't able to find 'em16:25
DocScrutinizer"add to apps"16:26
Venemobut I don't wanna add to apps16:26
Venemojust to favorites16:26
DocScrutinizerwhat's called "desktop shortcut" in fremantle16:26
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DocScrutinizerjavispedro: moo16:26
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: thanks for
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RST38hmoo, javispedro16:27
Venemohey TermanaN95016:27
RST38hjavispedro: <-- multitouch should be supported in these binaries16:27
TermanaN950Venemo, irc-chatter interface looks good16:28
TermanaCould use a better name though :p16:28
Venemothanks TermanaN950 :)16:28
javispedroDocScrutinizer: sadly you see on it how there are two independent I2S ports, one for BT and one for radio16:29
javispedroDocScrutinizer: if you understand it in a different way, do tell :)16:29
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: I'll have a look into it16:30
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* javispedro has been since a few days ago officially pessimistic about fmrx on the N950.16:30
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: sounds like mega clusterfsck :-S16:30
DocScrutinizerGIVE US SCHEMATICS!!!!!!!16:31
javispedrothere's an additional problem16:31
javispedrothere have been many revisions of the n950 seemingyl16:31
javispedroand fmrx has been moved around like crazy16:32
DocScrutinizerhow could you tell?16:32
javispedroso if you ever get schematics, you will always want to know whether they are the right version or not.16:32
javispedroDocScrutinizer: comments in board-rm680* files16:32
* DocScrutinizer points Nokia to OM Neo FreeRunner schematics, which for a good reason have "cumulated" in the name16:33
DocScrutinizerIf there'd been major schematic schanges, I'd even have added separate detail figures for A4, A5, A6 hw rev16:34
javispedroeither way, as far as I can guess from the kernel about the current hw: bt I2S connected to SOC, FM_EN line connected to a SOC GPIO, and analog output connected to AUX twl input16:35
DocScrutinizerbut on OM it was sufficient to mark component values like "A4: NC; A5: 1uF; A6: 100uF"16:35
Venemo_N950javispedro, what does that mean in layman's terms?16:41
javispedroVenemo_N950: no fmrx audio, only RDS.16:42
Venemo_N950what is RDS?16:43
javispedrobecause I've not been able to find anything in the AUX input.16:43
SpeedEvilRadio Data System16:44
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Venemo_N950and what use is it?16:44
SpeedEvilIt's a few bits/second of flags and text about the current channel.16:44
SpeedEvil'this channel is also broadcast on xx.x MHz, and this is a traffic announcement'16:44
SpeedEvilSo your radio can switch to alternate transmitters, and to traffic announcements if you want it to.16:45
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DocScrutinizer""just playing: Heino - jaja so braun..."16:45
DocScrutinizerhighly useless if you can't get the audio this info is all about16:45
javispedroso, things left to try: whether the FM I2S is connected to another McBSP port in the SOC without being marked as such in the kernel (no idea without schematic and not very probable)16:46
javispedrowhether we are doing something wrong with the twl codec mixer and we are not properly capturing the AUX input.16:46
SpeedEvilIf it talks over I2C, isn't there a signal indication on the chip?16:46
SpeedEvilSignal level?16:46
javispedrothe chip actually has a few protocols16:47
DocScrutinizeraiui you can actually mux I2S16:47
javispedroHCI, I2C16:47
SpeedEvilIf you look at that, and it's not present - game over.16:47
DocScrutinizerone master, multiple slaves16:47
SpeedEvil(if it's tuned right)16:47
javispedroSpeedEvil: it works, I can even get RDS as said16:47
SpeedEvilSorry - I diddn't read scrollback.16:47
SpeedEvilAny indication of the sensitivity?16:47
SpeedEvilAre you right up against a transmitter/16:47
DocScrutinizergood enough16:48
SpeedEvilOr is it more normal.16:48
javispedroDocScrutinizer: using HCI you can completely ignore the Nokia driver and configure the chip the way you want (for example set the I2S registers to your pleasure)16:48
javispedrobut obviously, I'm not going to bang the registers randomly ... need guidance.16:48
DocScrutinizerok, the options:16:48
SpeedEvilI assume we don't have a datasheet?16:48
DocScrutinizerI2S is "muxed", or we didn't find the right config anyway16:49
javispedroSpeedEvil: part of it:
DocScrutinizeror we got some McBSP input "somewhere else" (codec)16:49
DocScrutinizeror we got an analog signal path16:49
DocScrutinizereither to codec or directly to amp16:49
SpeedEviljavispedro: ah16:50
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SpeedEvilOr it's connected to some of the ports already tried, but the driver isn't properly selecting them due to inadequate testing/coding of bits that are unused.16:51
javispedrothat's why I thought initially16:51
DocScrutinizerhmm, might go under "config"16:51
DocScrutinizerGIVE US SCHEMATICS!!!!!!!16:51
DocScrutinizerhell, it'd be more sensible to RE a motorola device than this one16:52
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DocScrutinizerat least less insulting16:52
javispedrothe kernel _does_ say (found it in something that is power management related, go figure) about the analog path via AUX, so that should be the most probable option.16:53
Venemo_N950DocScrutinizer, you mean, a google device?16:53
Venemo_N950as they must bought motorola16:53
DocScrutinizeras there we KNOW we are on our own, while Nokia claims they *support* community for N9(50)16:53
javispedromaybe we could ping someone about this16:53
javispedrohow was the FMRX stuff solved on the N900?16:53
javispedrothe initial situation was similar16:53
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: try tero kojo16:53
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rm_workso, confirmed there IS an FM receiver chip?16:54
DocScrutinizerin the end it might have been for exactly this reason why he suggested I shall get a N95016:54
rm_workbut not yet clear whether it will do both RX/TX?16:54
RzR950and emitter16:54
rm_workah, TX is confirmed?16:54
DocScrutinizerrm_work: not confirmed if it will do RX even16:55
rm_workwell, not confirmed it will DO it16:55
RzR950there is a thread on the forum16:55
rm_workbut that the chip is present and hooked up16:55
javispedrotx is pretty much out of the question also16:55
fiferboyDocScrutinizer: Tero isn't at Nokia anymore, is he?16:55
RzR950the pb is the antenna16:55
DocScrutinizerTX has no antenna16:55
javispedrobecause it has the same problem as fmrx plus no antenna.16:55
DocScrutinizerTero? I thought he still is16:55
rm_worknothing a little soldering can't solve :P16:55
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javispedroactually it has a problem worse than fmrx, because fmtx requires _a DIFFERENT analog path_.16:55
javispedro(OR, the same digital path -- but it is probably not connected...16:56
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* DocScrutinizer <---- idiot16:56
RzR950maybe a hw mod could fix it16:56
DocScrutinizernot tekojo16:57
fiferboyDocScrutinizer: Tero is ex-Nokia16:57
javispedroex-nokia? :(16:57
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rm_workRzR950: yeah that's what i was thinking... solder a little antenna on there... problem solved? :P16:57
DocScrutinizerTero *is* ex afaik16:57
w00t_he left a while ago16:57
rm_workat least *that* problem16:57
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DocScrutinizerjavispedro: konttori16:58
meceis there a list of available icons somewhere? To use as ToolIcon icons?16:58
DocScrutinizer(my name subprocessor didn't boot yet)16:58
DocScrutinizerit's always been crap anyway16:58
RzR950usually antenna are on the jack cable16:59
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fiferboymece: I haven't seen one17:01
DocScrutinizerRzR950: nope17:01
DocScrutinizeronly for RX17:01
fiferboymece: I usually just recursively grep for names that look like what I want :(17:01
DocScrutinizerand that one is confirmed for RX on 95017:01
RzR950for tx where are antenna placed on n90017:02
javispedroRzR950: internal17:02
DocScrutinizersmall antenna inside17:02
javispedrotrying to describe the steps to configure alsa card#0 (aka twl) to capture from aux analog inpu17:03
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: ok, we got I2S plus analog for RX and TX17:04
DocScrutinizeron chip17:04
javispedrodevelsh, alsamixer -c 0, press F4, set "Analog" volume to max using arrow keys, enable Analog Left AUXL and Analog Left AUXR using spacebar17:04
javispedrothen move to the right until you find TX1 and set it to "Analog" using arrow keys (this part is hazy)17:05
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javispedro(note: obviously this breaks phone until reboot)17:05
javispedro(which is one of the reasons I'd prefer the I2S path being connected..)17:06
javispedroand to capture, arecord -Dhw:0,0 -fS16_LE17:06
RST38hwhat evil magic are you performing on that n950?17:06
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javispedroRST38h: trying to guess if fmrx will ever work or not17:07
DocScrutinizerOperate BT.17:07
DocScrutinizerSend an FM ON command via the HCI.17:07
DocScrutinizerIf FM is switched off, first send an FM_OFF command.17:07
DocScrutinizerThen, send a BT_OFF command.17:07
DocScrutinizerIn shared mode, the operation of the FM Enable should be performed in the following sequence:17:07
DocScrutinizerFailing to turn the FM core off before the BT core results in the FM remaining on.17:07
* javispedro kicks DocScrutinizer 17:07
javispedroDocScrutinizer: we can choose not to use shared mode, as we can access the chip via I2C.17:08
javispedroeither way, shared mode works. I can tune via HCI.17:08
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javispedrobut no audio.17:08
DocScrutinizerso make sure FM is properly turned on17:08
javispedroin non-shared mode it's enough to assert FM_EN17:08
DocScrutinizernever believe crappy DS17:09
CaCO3does anybody know if it is possible to get the "" from QML installed under Linux?17:09
CaCO3they seem not to be in the SDK17:09
javispedroDocScrutinizer: "The FM primarily shares the Bluetooth HCI interface. This solution also has a dedicated I2C interface,17:10
javispedrobut it is not typically used." -- yet that is what the stock Nokia driver uses ;)17:10
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: seems like time for "N950 exploded" ?17:11
javispedroDocScrutinizer: not sure I have the eye to see something from it.17:11
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: my scanner did a good job on N900 ;-D17:11
DocScrutinizerGIVE US SChem.....blaergh!17:12
dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: back in the game i see...17:12
ajalkaneCaCO3: yes, compile qt-components from gitorious17:12
javispedroI want my FMRX! =)17:12
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: yoh, javispedro killed the grendel17:13
CaCO3ajalkane: thanks. Do you know of any prebuilt ones (Ubuntu or debian)17:13
DocScrutinizerall hail to javispedro17:13
RST38hjavispedro: you mean, you are still listening to fm radio? =)17:13
javispedroDocScrutinizer: also thank lizardo's post, as he has provided the path for custom kernels17:13
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DocScrutinizerbeen "offline" for a week17:14
DocScrutinizerLOL tmo17:15
javispedrothat is probably more useful for USB host than my method, unless you can fully add host as a kmod (doubtful ;) ).17:16
ajalkaneCaCO3: search kate alhola's blog, prebuilt for ubuntu in forum nokia ppa17:17
CaCO3ajalkane: I just realise that I have them already installed, how ever they still do not get found :(17:17
CaCO3in /usr/lib/qt4/imports/com/nokia there are 2 folders: extras1.1 , meego17:18
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CaCO3is it possible they are not complete? (means nokia keeps some of the components propretary)17:20
fiferboyCaCO3: QtSDK doesn't use that directory, you have to simlink those into your QtSDK structure17:20
GAN900DocScrutinizer, Tero's with somebody else.17:20
DocScrutinizerGAN900: I know17:20
DocScrutinizerI mixed names17:20
fiferboyCaCO3: ln -s /usr/lib/qt4/imports/com ~/QtSDK/Desktop/Qt/474/gcc/imports17:21
fiferboyCaCO3: Is what I did17:21
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ajalkaneCaCO3: i had to rename extras1.1 to extras for it to work17:22
fiferboyAlso keep in mind extras 1.1 is not on the device, so anything using those components won't work on the N950 (with our firmware)17:23
CaCO3yup, I know, I am using 1.017:24
CaCO3I made the symlin, but it still cant be found :(17:24
ajalkanealso, as fiferboy said, they must be under the correct gcc that is used17:24
CaCO3and why is it under gcc? I use python, there is nothing to be compiled17:24
CaCO3also, it actually should work native with the qmlviewer17:25
fiferboyCaCO3: Are you using Qt Creator in the QtSDK?17:25
ajalkanedid you rename extras1.117:25
CaCO3yes and yes17:25
CaCO3but I write the qml files with a plain editor and use qmlviewer to test it17:26
CaCO3it works finde, until I now want to use the
fiferboyCaCO3: The system QML viewer? Or QtSDK?17:26
CaCO3didnt know there is one in qt creator (at least never found one)17:27
fiferboyCaCO3: Ok, I wasn't sure (I don't use qml viewer)17:28
fiferboySo the system one should pick up extras without needing to simlink it anywhere17:28
CaCO3yup, I guess so17:28
CaCO3I am wondering why it is labled extras1.117:28
CaCO3I symlinked it to extras as well as to extras1.0, but no success17:29
fiferboyMine is called extras.1.117:29
CaCO3I am actually not the only one with this problem:
CaCO3post 3217:29
ajalkaneyou can try replacing in extras all references to 1.1 to 1.017:31
dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: well make sure not to upgrade your device. I'm pretty sure that's going to get plugged.17:31
DocScrutinizeryeah :-//17:32
ajalkaneie all qml files and qmldir17:32
dm8tbrofc you can just do the manual dance from now, manual filesystem copies from other devices or unpacked fiasco17:32
CaCO3ajalkane: I dont thin k this would work, because I also tried "import 1.0"17:32
DocScrutinizerwhich again defeats the whole purpose of developing hostmode for the 'masses'17:32
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dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: the connector defeats it for the masses, full stop. :/17:32
DocScrutinizerno, there are adapters17:33
javispedrodm8tbr: at this point I doubt it will be plugged. Either way, how it is handled will tell much about what we should expect.17:33
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ajalkanewhat qt libs are installed on your system? maybe they're too old17:34
dm8tbrwell the adapters are pretty non-standard though17:34
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CaCO3ajalkane: I have an up to date Ubuntu Natty, so I dont thinks that should be a problem17:35
CaCO3ajalkane: can you create a file main.qml with only the line "import 1.0" in it? And then open it with qmlviewer?17:38
ajalkanei've never used qmlviewer and can't test now, at work. Works with my C++ app and qt 4.7.417:39
CaCO3hmm, ok, anyway, thank you very much for your time!17:39
DocScrutinizerjavispedro: (plugged) In my book we (devel community) got two options now: either keep it low profile, hoping for nobody @ Nok caring about it, or B) NUKE aegis OFF THE PLANET so epicaly that Nokia would look stipid to even keep it in N9 firmware17:39
DocScrutinizer+l s/i/o/17:40
RST38h(B) will never happen17:40
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RST38hNokia does not care, Harmattan does not even exist for most of its high-ranking managers17:41
RST38hSo, (A)17:41
* javispedro agrees.17:41
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javispedrothough we will see.17:41
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: they are as nonstandard as they were for N900 - still USB hostmode for N900 is one of the most popular and appreciated "apps" ever17:41
Arkenoiis there .deb that automates nuking aegis already? :-)17:41
dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: do we know how many real users it has?17:41
dm8tbrI mean I could install it too, but it would be pretty much useless, the download counted though17:42
DocScrutinizernot exactly, but the videos "hostmode on N900" at youtube as zillion17:42
dm8tbrcolour me unconvinced then17:42
DocScrutinizerthe threads are under the 100 longest ever on tmo17:42
DocScrutinizerthere are even *donations* :-O17:43
DocScrutinizer(some xx$ sigma)17:43
dm8tbrI don't doubt there are real users, still how many did go to the length of procuring an special adapter through mail-order and then use it remains unknown17:44
dm8tbrit's like with my postings how to attach to the UART on Archos devices17:44
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: on N9 we got no uSD slot... So hostmode becomes *essential* for a lot of usecases17:45
dm8tbryes, but will it be practical?17:45
dm8tbrI know it is possible.17:46
DocScrutinizerif Nokia doesn't spoil soup17:46
dm8tbrbut to which lengths will the average joe have to go?17:46
hardaker2quick speed-up devel hack:
DocScrutinizererr what?17:46
hardaker2(that I just wrote up)17:46
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djszapilbt: -> Can you give me a helping hand about it ?17:47
DocScrutinizeraverage joe gets a F-F USB, installs hostmode app, plugs in his digital cam during holiday, and selects "hostmode" from appstarter, to upload photos to flickr17:47
dm8tbra) install custom kernel that breaks a few things by putting device in open mode: I'd see maybe 30% people do that if you're optimistic17:47
djszapilbt: I have seen that sort of error message more times recently in case more packages.17:48
dm8tbrb) procure special adapter through mail order: let's say you lose about 70% of the former people here17:48
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: that's exactly what I've been talking about ALL THE TIME17:48
djszapiputting into open mode is actually one liner :)17:48
DocScrutinizerNokia killing it with aegis17:48
javispedrodm8tbr: you do not need to enter open mode on the N900 nor order the adapter via mail, it's pretty much a F2F one17:48
djszapi1 line only, that is17:48
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dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: sorry to delusion you, aegis part in this is rather small17:48
kimjudjszapi, and that line is?17:48
dm8tbrjavispedro: we're talking harmattan aren't we?17:49
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: on N900 not many users were concerned to install powerkernel17:49
javispedrodm8tbr: but the only problem in Harmattan is the introduction of Aegis.17:49
djszapikimju: am I your guest for a beer ? :p17:49
DocScrutinizermany didn't even notice hostmode came with new kernel17:49
dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: n900 is _completely_ different target audience17:49
SpeedEviljavispedro: And not selling the n95017:49
lbtdm8tbr: sorry, at work. Log a bug and prod me later :)17:49
dm8tbrlbt: huh?17:50
kimjudjszapi, ?17:50
lbterr djszapi17:50
javispedrodm8tbr: sorry but I side with DocScrutinizer here, just look at all the overclocking threads and the average IQ there.17:50
DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: I give a sh*t about target audience, as I AM NOT target audience of N917:50
djszapilbt: right ;)17:50
djszapikimju: if I tell you :p17:50
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dm8tbrjavispedro / DocScrutinizer - sorry, but I have to diagnose you with a severe case of WHOOOOOSH.17:50
dm8tbrI don't question feasibility for your likes17:51
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* javispedro sighs and gives up17:51
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DocScrutinizerdm8tbr: I wonder why you initially joined harmattan hostmode project then?17:52
kimjudjszapi, well, I can buy you a beer if you provide a simple way to get the device into open mode :)17:52
djszapijavispedro: you were not here, but your scream about a "serious" bug is actually a feature...17:52
dm8tbr14:51:08< dm8tbr> I don't question feasibility for your likes17:52
djszapiwhich is not available in sale devices....17:52
dm8tbrDocScrutinizer: c.f. whooooooosh17:52
djszapi* sales17:52
djszapikimju: add this line: "memset(&valinfo, 0, sizeof(valinfo));" after valinfo.kmod_init   = (val & KMOD_BIT)         ? 1 : 0;17:52
javispedrodjszapi: remember the part about "we are sure this is intentional"17:52
djszapiit is not intentional in sales devices, no.17:53
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javispedrothat would mean sales devices would not have the ability to flash a kernel, load new kernel modules, or use develsh.17:53
javispedroso I disagree.17:53
kimjudjszapi, ah, saw that on the tmo thread. I thought you had method to do that without changing the kernel.17:53
javispedro(for my sanity)17:53
* DocScrutinizer ponders to already /part again17:54
djszapijavispedro: so you expect guarantee for custom kernels from Nokia haha funky17:54
javispedrodjszapi: that's how it has been on all previous devices so far.17:54
javispedroand that's what was promised years ago17:54
djszapiwhat ?17:55
djszapisupport for any kernel on a device ?17:55
djszapiyou must be joking.17:55
javispedro_custom_ kernels on any maemo devices.17:55
kimjuthis is not a maemo device.. :)17:55
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javispedronot any kernel obviously ;)17:55
djszapikimju: that might be the way of doing it I think so.17:56
djszapijavispedro: sorry, I do not know what you mean.17:56
hardaker2grr...  what's the #ifdef for meego?17:56
hardaker2can't find it17:57
javispedrodjszapi: by the way, on that error log, have you seen ./kgraphicswebview.moc:79: error: no matching function for call to 'KGraphicsWebView::selectionClipboardUrlPasted(const KUrl&)' ?17:58
javispedrodjszapi: there might be a mismatch between the header and cpp file17:58
djszapihardaker2: there is something here, but I do not know whether it is a custom or system-wide define :p
djszapiI can imagine it is custom.17:58
djszapijavispedro: nope17:59
djszapithat has nothing to do with that.17:59
djszapiit is an automoc issue, actually.17:59
djszapiif you check out, that is a signal, it has no definition ion cpp....17:59
djszapi* in17:59
hardaker2djszapi: will test, thanks.18:00
hardaker2(yeah, that doesn't work)18:01
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djszapiI think someone already complained about it so that it is missing.18:02
dm8tbr*sigh* DocScrutinizer really needs to learn that there may be diverging opinions and that they don't necessary mean hostility, sometimes even are meant well...18:04
SpeedEvilAs do some others.18:06
RST38hHey, dm8tbr, are you a psychiatrist or something?18:06
RST38hAnd if so, will you mind doing a class on non-violent confrontation as a way to solve problems?18:07
RST38hLike right now, right here? =)18:07
hardaker2yep, here's the bug:
dm8tbrRST38h: just referring to my previous discussion.18:07
dm8tbrRST38h: nice troll...18:07
RST38hOk, so no psychiatrist?18:07
djszapihardaker2: yeah, mm: Should be available with the next Qt SDK update (the one that will also have Creator 2.3).18:08
hardaker2but, um, I need it now!!!18:08
dm8tbrRST38h: no18:08
hardaker2I wonder if there is an ifdef for "arm"18:08
djszapithere is18:08
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hardaker2because then you could rule out the others and be left with that.18:08
hardaker2know what it is by chance?18:09
hardaker2(I was just about to go grep headers)18:09
dm8tbrRST38h: and i fail to see why i need to be one to have an opinion18:09
djszapiI am looking into this :p18:09
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* GAN900 hands every one in the room a basket of fresh fruit.18:10
ajalkaneexamples have ifdef __arm__18:10
hardaker2yeah, QT_ARCH_ARM didn't actually seem to be caught.18:11
hardaker2__arm__ doesn't get caught either.18:12
Tronicaegis-developer-mode --relaxed-exec says Error: Permission denied18:12
TronicMaybe this is because I have installed software from Store?18:12
sebashardaker2: #ifdef __ARMEL__ seems to work here18:12
hardaker2different problem.18:12
hardaker2ifelse's weren't working18:13
hardaker2nested in the else it worked.18:13
hardaker2and when done that way, both __arm__ and __ARMEL__ work18:13
javispedroTronic: you need to run develsh first18:14
djszapiI am desperately asking, is there any alternative for c-obs ? :p18:15
javispedrodjszapi: you mean you cannot reproduce that problem in scratchbox or madde?18:16
Tronicjavispedro: Ah, I thought that being root was enough (I know, bad assumptions, when it comes to aegis).18:16
djszapikimju: I mean a system with which I can build and distribute18:16
djszapithe autobuilder from wasn't really reliable too.18:17
kimjuobs seems to build things ok, it just what happens after the build that's the problem for me.18:19
djszapiit is really no go we have been stuck for more than 1 month with kdelibs18:20
djszapiand there is no prospect about it it is getting better.18:20
djszapiand it forgets distributing packages for days and so on.18:21
djszapiI was thinking about that to write scripts that uploads it my web storage or so.18:21
djszapi* to18:21
djszapiI do not see any progress on its stability.18:22
javispedrodjszapi: did you read my comments in #meego on OBS using -j4 by default?18:23
javispedroI do not know if this could cause problems in automoc though18:23
javispedro(cause I do not know how automoc works)18:23
javispedrobut if seems like a random or unexplainable problem then it's probably because of this.18:24
djszapiI do not care about meego :)18:24
djszapiyeah, sure "random" or "unexplainable", but the my concern is that there is /no/ progress18:24
djszapiand it makes me sad.18:24
javispedrowell there is no visible progress indeed.18:25
javispedrobut it's august :)18:25
djszapiI was asking the OBS guy taking the presentation at the desktop summit about it, but apparently, I did not get any useful answer, unfortunately.18:25
djszapiit seems to be not a high priority for them to support harmattan, that is18:25
djszapiyes, august hacking time for students and employees, so it should work...18:26
djszapias for me, it seems a simple script helps much more than c-obs for now :)18:26
djszapiit could all be much nicer if we could directly distribute on the c-obs without building for emergency cases, like this....18:28
djszapiwe should not even have any custom script with "third-party" web service.18:28
javispedrothat was one of the usecases for non-free in the old autobuilder18:29
javispedrosome people who couldn't get their packages through the builder uploaded directly there18:30
javispedrowhich is why I will always say we need a non-free repo.18:30
djszapikdelibs is completely free18:31
djszapithe files are also uploaded properly (source-wise)18:31
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djszapiI do not need closed stuff really.18:31
djszapibut I need an opportunity for direct distributing until the system cannot simply work.18:31
djszapifeel free to propose any better, I am open for any idea, that could help..18:32
javispedrojust in case, you could try adding forcing a serial build18:34
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djszapiI do not know what that is.18:34
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djszapiso 20 hours for kdelibs ? :)18:35
djszapisorry, no, that is no go :D18:35
javispedrobut no idea what automoc fails on remote then18:35
javispedroit is probably the same automoc that is on scratchbox18:35
djszapiit is not about automoc18:35
javispedroso what's failing?18:35
djszapithat is a different issue (do not ask why it appeared just right now)18:35
djszapithe current one is a separate issue, not sure how to solve this one....18:36
djszapibut this one is not the main point.18:36
djszapiit is fixable with lot of time waste.18:36
* javispedro has no idea what is broken then18:36
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javispedroeither way, one thing we should probably poke X-Fade about someday is to setup the x86 HARMATTAN target18:37
djszapisee ? That is the thing, and that is why we need to have direct distribtion until the system is broken18:37
djszapi* while18:37
javispedroto eliminate all qemu-caused problems.18:37
javispedrodjszapi: but what is broken? :)18:37
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javispedroI've been able to diagnose and/or consistently reproduce all of the problems I've had with it so far.18:38
djszapisee this one, this is the real isuse:
djszapiok, please deal with kdelibs18:38
djszapiand see you in 3-4 weeks :)18:38
djszapiI could also manage almost /all/ the other issues, but this18:38
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dm8tbrrandom guess: out of memory?18:39
djszapithat would cause kernel boooom18:40
djszapiso everything else would fail, but other packages are building fine in paralel.18:40
javispedrodjszapi: can you capture and pastebin a successful build log of the library?18:42
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djszapijavispedro: no sorry, I will be quite frankly with you:18:43
djszapiI have spent 1 month from my life with it and so many builds and try. I lost all my sake.18:43
MeeGoBotBug 22650 cri, Undecided, ---, maemo, NEW, Direct distribution opportunity while c-obs cannot simply work18:43
dm8tbrdjszapi: not necessarily, a properly set up system will starve processes without killing itself18:45
javispedroit actually builds succesfully18:45
dm8tbrdjszapi: btdt18:45
javispedro/usr/bin/make -f debian/rules dhmk_run_install_commands DHMK_TARGET="install"18:46
javispedroit fails during install target18:46
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djszapijavispedro: yes.18:46
javispedrotherefore if it is able to build webkit without a problem I'd say out of memory is out of the question18:46
djszapidm8tbr: sorry ?18:46
javispedrounless it is out of disk space18:46
djszapijavispedro: out of space would show up in any package afterwards18:46
javispedrodunno, vm gets killed18:47
djszapialso, no space left is a typical error message on linux systems.18:47
dm8tbrdjszapi: you said that running out of memory would ' cause kernel boooom' - this is not necessarily true18:47
javispedrowhat you need is someone to login on the VM at that moment and give you a shell18:47
javispedroit should not be that hard18:47
javispedrobut I can empathize about how it seems extremely difficult to get that done by the staff.18:48
djszapijavispedro: I do not see any better option than distributing directly.18:48
javispedrosadly I have to give a BIG NO to binary distribution18:49
javispedrobecause for me it's as good as a non-free.18:49
djszapinot really..since it would work that way.18:49
javispedrothe bug can be fixed and will be fixed.18:49
djszapiwe have been waiting for 1 month.18:49
djszapino progress, not even expected.18:50
djszapiyou can "nicely" say that, but imagine that how many kde developer could write and port their applications in the meantime.18:50
djszapi1 month is fairly a lot of time for a community, like KDE.18:50
javispedroI do not think that is a problem then18:50
dm8tbror we could clone the setup18:51
javispedroyou can just setup a private repo for the time being18:51
javispedro_everyone_ is doing it eitherway for the time being18:51
djszapijavispedro: I cannot distribute directly to c=obs....18:51
djszapithat is what I am asking....18:51
javispedrooutside of COBS18:51
dm8tbrit should be possible to copy the harmattan targetg18:51
javispedroeither way, most of the COBS staff is in #meego18:51
javispedrothis conversation should be held there.18:52
dm8tbrtest on own obs instance if it happens18:52
djszapijavispedro: However I do not connect to #meego, that is for sure :)18:52
javispedroor even test ocs build locally18:52
djszapiand well...lbt is here anyway18:52
dm8tbrdjszapi: did you try local build using osc?18:52
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djszapijavispedro: you mean osc, not ocs....18:52
djszapido not be confused, they are rather different things18:53
djszapidm8tbr: yes, local osc works as I said gazillion + 1 times here ;)18:53
dm8tbrdjszapi: then it's pretty sure a hardware/setup/config constraint18:53
javispedroor a parallel thing ;)18:53
djszapiI still stick by: the nicest solution is to have direct distribution for the time being, of course only just for emergency cases with sysadmin approvals.18:53
javispedrothere's no emergency18:54
javispedroit's not like the community client app is already done and users are already missing the KDE apps18:54
djszapijavispedro: do not troll :)18:54
djszapi1 month is emergency enough ;)18:54
javispedrodjszapi: developers can use your private repo _outside_ of COBS18:54
djszapior well, feel free prove me wrong :)18:54
djszapiand make it work ....18:54
javispedrodevelopers can even even use a package uplaoded somewhere18:55
djszapi"...users are already missing the KDE apps..." -> Yes, they are. I talked to a lot of kde folks in Berlin.18:55
djszapithey indeed really missed them.18:55
javispedroI had a similar situation with SDL when OBS had no nokia-binaries18:55
dm8tbrdjszapi: do you and the kde folks see a way to drum up some donations to beef up COBS?18:56
javispedroso what I did is to hang it up on a directory on my server and refer people to it18:56
djszapi"...developers can use your private repo _outside_ of COBS..." -> sure, but you just missed the word "nicest" in my sentence ;)18:56
djszapiso then again, c-obs was designed for this even if it is hilariously non-working.18:56
lbtwe need details and someone to spend some time pinpointing the problem18:56
djszapistarting X different services out there is really inconsistent.18:56
djszapilbt: give me access18:56
djszapito the server18:57
javispedrolbt: do you think it would be hard to provide a sshd to the vm when it's stuck that way?18:57
djszapior someone trustworthy.18:57
lbtyes it would be hard18:57
javispedrootherwise debugging this is probably extremely hard considering it happens during install time and considering also the size of hte package.18:57
djszapilbt: please progress progress progress18:57
dm8tbrlbt: is it possible to export the 'harmattan' target? :)18:57
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lbtso the bug report is useless18:57
dm8tbrI'm asking for several reasons obviously18:57
lbthow much of kdelibs builds?18:58
djszapilbt: we are discussing the same issues like 1 month ago18:58
lbthave you uploaded partial source?18:58
djszapithere is no progress18:58
lbtand done a bisect?18:58
javispedrolbt: all of it builds, it fails during install target18:58
javispedrowhich is the rather weird part18:58
lbtjavispedro: not in bug report18:58
djszapijavispedro: not entirely true18:58
djszapijavispedro: it sometimes fails with the same job timeout during the build18:58
javispedroso it's RANDOM??18:58
javispedrothat's interesting18:58
lbtso you don't actually know (despite detailed logs... ) what's happening?18:58
lbtand you want me to fix it?18:58
djszapilbt: who else would fix it if you do not give access to us ? :)18:59
djszapiso we cannot debug it ?18:59
* javispedro now _really_ suggests forcing -j118:59
lbtjavispedro: indeed18:59
lbtthat's the kind of thing18:59
lbtnarrow it down for me18:59
lbtyou can build w/o install... does that work18:59
lbthack the makefile18:59
djszapiwhat ? :D18:59
lbtinstrument it better19:00
javispedrothat's what I'd normally do.19:00
djszapithen again, it is not black and white19:00
javispedrobut I can understand that it is quite hard with a package that is larger than webkit.19:00
djszapiit is a very colourful issue, like the rainbow19:00
djszapiI cannot say it fails during the "install".19:00
djszapiI saw all sort of issues about it.19:00
djszapiI cannot really narrow it down to you, sorry.19:00
djszapiI should have access to the PC and debug it, that is.19:00
djszapior someone with access should debug it.19:00
javispedrodjszapi: thinking that you could spawn a script that does a ps ax every 5 seconds or so19:01
javispedroor every few minutes19:01
javispedroso that it would be run during the lock and you'll have some info19:01
djszapijavispedro: please do it if you have time.19:01
lbtjavispedro: thanks... can you try and educate djszapi on debugging 101 :)19:01
djszapiI do not think it is two minutes, not even 2 days19:01
javispedrobut this would mean OBS would not kill the job, so an OBS admin would have to kill it ;)19:01
lbtjavispedro: you have abortbuild19:02
djszapinot sure what ps ax would help....19:02
javispedrodjszapi: it would be something at laest.19:02
djszapilbt: no we do not have on the webinterface actually.19:02
lbtdjszapi: aw19:02
lbtuse osc then19:02
djszapijavispedro: yeah, sure I can do a lot of useless things :)19:02
javispedrodjszapi: add a find $PWD  command to see what's being copied, etc.19:02
dm8tbrlbt: again, is it possible to clone the harmattan part of COBS to an private OBS?19:02
djszapijavispedro: but I already did for one month, so ....19:02
javispedrodjszapi: if you did not do this stuff what did you waste the month in?19:02
djszapisome fresh blood help needed.19:02
lbtdm8tbr: is that the same issue?19:03
dm8tbrlbt: no, but I'm trying to work towards something here :)19:03
djszapijavispedro: go for it if you think it is not as time wasting debugging as hell ?19:03
javispedroyes, it is time wasting.19:03
javispedrothere's no helping there.19:03
dm8tbrlbt: the idea would be that then I can set that up (I need it myself anyway) and toss djszapi a copy so he can 'look inside' as he demands19:04
djszapiI do think it would be easier to have access to the PC19:04
djszapiand check the commands directly.19:04
djszapiwould be way muuuuuuuuch faster19:04
dm8tbrlbt: see what IU mean?19:04
javispedroyes, but seems that is not available (why it is not available I won't understand, but hey ...)19:04
djszapiif the relevant person (whoever it is) can do it.19:04
javispedroeither way.19:05
javispedrothe -j1 thing must be tried19:05
djszapithat means 20 hours for one try.19:05
djszapithat is really no go debugging.19:05
djszapihaving access and check the things is at least 4 times faster.19:05
djszapiwhich is 15 hours spare in this special case.19:05
javispedroit's just a day, cmon.19:06
javispedroI can think of 3 things that would cause a random failure, parallelization errors, qemu errors, and hw errors.19:06
lbtdjszapi: go talk to the devs who build kde on suse OBS .. get one of them to show you19:06
djszapiyeah, but it is easier to do during night than dealing with it every day19:06
djszapiI would really like to do different things than getting into it every day19:06
djszapisince I need re-think a couple of things which is not 2 minutes, like doing it in one step19:07
djszapilbt: they have no experience with Harmattan, I guess ?19:07
javispedrooh, that is a interesting, grab kdelibs from the Suse OBS (even if it is an RPM) and submit it to ours19:07
djszapiharmattan cannot handle rpmS ....19:07
djszapiit is a debian based system...19:07
javispedrosubmit it to meego19:07
djszapiand yes, we grabbed the proper debian packages, but again, it is not a packaging issue...19:08
djszapimeego != harmattan19:08
javispedrodebian != harmattan19:08
lbtgo and fill in the bug report with a clear analysis of the problem19:08
djszapicompletely different environment, and strictly speaking, it is already there...19:08
lbtnot "It does not however work"19:08
lbtno opinions19:08
javispedrodjszapi: and kdelibs worked for the meego target?19:08
djszapilbt: I cannot say more without access19:08
djszapijavispedro: well, there are packages available.19:08
djszapibut I heard it was also very painful over there.19:09
javispedroso it's not a hw problem.19:09
javispedro(aka, not a memory problem, not a disk space problem...)19:09
djszapinot true19:09
djszapiit is a completely different environment, you cannot filter out that easily.19:09
javispedroit is not that different.19:09
djszapiagain, it would be much easier with monitoring directly...19:09
javispedroboth use qemu. both run on a xen vm.19:10
javispedrobut use the linux kernel and probably the same version of the linux kernel :)19:10
djszapisee ? These are really time wasting ideas that volunteers do not normally have.19:10
djszapiit is even a lot of time in paid job.19:10
djszapiand no, it should not work that hard, seriously :)19:10
javispedroit's fun19:11
javispedroI find myself usually in the opposing side.19:11
djszapigo have a fun then ? :)19:11
javispedrodjszapi: so now you understand why I dislike Aegis? it's a time waste for me.19:11
javispedrowhen I have to change the Debian packaging of portmap because aegis won't let me run it as is, well, it is a time waste.19:12
javispedroI'm a volunteer after all.19:12
djszapiaegis is a cakewalk19:13
* mikhas gets popcorn19:13
djszapibut do not hijack it :)19:13
djszapijavispedro: I will give a try with -j1 after figuring out the debian things, BUT, I will be your guest for a beer, if it does not work :)19:13
djszapior maybe 2 :p19:13
djszapijavispedro: rpc timeout is also a very common situation, say 70-80 %19:16
djszapisometimes for days without being able to do anything.19:16
djszapiHow should I debug that one ? :)19:16
javispedrohopefully that improved since the recent downtime19:16
ArkenoiIs there a package that includes luit? As running arbitrary binaries is tricky i'd better have a package. A package with kernel module disabling aegis will fit as well :-)19:16
djszapiyou cannot load kernel modules without open mode and if you have open mode, you do not have issue with aegis...19:17
djszapiso the second idea makes no sense :)19:17
djszapijavispedro: it happened after that maintenance, actually.19:17
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djszapidpkg-buildpackage -j1 -> this will not work :)19:18
djszapiI cannot really modify that, just from the rules / dh_install file I guess.19:18
javispedrowhat does the rules file look like?19:18
javispedroyou have several options, namely export MAKEFLAGS=-j1 , AND/OR add -j1 to $(MAKE) cmdlines, AND/OR override DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS19:19
kulveI'm trying to create a sharing plugin but I don't know how to customize the account setup. Now it just asks for a username and a password and I don't need either.. Any hints where to look?19:19
javispedroalso add .NOTPARALLEL: to debian/rules as last target in file19:19
javispedroah, debhelper ..19:21
djszapiit is not cdbs, that would go crazy....19:21
djszapicdbs + sb -> oooouch :)19:21
javispedroseemingly you need to add19:22
javispedrodh_auto_build --max-parallel=119:22
javispedro(note: indent with tabs)19:23
djszapibefore install and after the configure19:23
Arkenoidjszapi, there is no easy way to switch to open mode, right?19:23
djszapiand before the auto test I guess19:23
djszapiArkenoi: there is19:23
djszapione line19:23
djszapiread back19:24
javispedrothat is lizardo's trick basically :)19:24
djszapijavispedro: Could you review please ?
javispedrodjszapi: also add the .NOTPARALLEL: target just below that one19:24
djszapilooks like pkg-kde-tools auto-enables parallel builds19:24
Arkenoidjszapi, cannot find it, if it is really one line, could you please repeat it?19:25
djszapiArkenoi: same backlog thing for me19:25
djszapiafter: "valinfo.kmod_init   = (val & KMOD_BIT)         ? 1 : 0;" ->  memset(&valinfo, 0, sizeof(valinfo));19:25
djszapijavispedro: it might be almighty because of pkg-kde-tools :)19:25
djszapiand the thing is that I do not find anything to turn that off19:26
javispedroyou could ask the author about it19:27
javispedroeither way, I think the NOTPARALLEL thing might be more interesting19:27
djszapiwhy ?19:27
djszapiyou already tried to set the paralel to 119:27
javispedroNOTPARALLEL disables parallelism inside debhelper itself and the debian/rules file19:28
javispedrothis fixed Gtk+ OBS builds19:28
djszapithis one ?
javispedroyes, exactly19:28
Arkenoidjszapi, is there a way to do it on running kernel, without installing my own?19:29
javispedroArkenoi: you have to do my trick19:29
Arkenoithat's what i was asking for -- is it already packaged with .deb :-)19:29
javispedrono, it's not19:30
javispedroany different kernel version will break it19:30
javispedroand potentially crash such kernel =)19:30
djszapiArkenoi: no way, from userspace, no.19:31
Arkenoiwhich kernel is in the version that is distributed with OCF?19:31
javispedroArkenoi: the correct one :)19:31
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djszapijavispedro: should I change any settings on my obs repository ?19:31
javispedrodjszapi: do not think so.19:31
Arkenoijavispedro, could you please uname -r,19:32
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hiemanshu_N950ssl works now \o/19:32
Stskeepswe have a new build?19:33
javispedrono, I don't know why he's asking ;)19:33
Arkenoihmm, mine is 2011290119:33
djszapijavispedro: osc is fragile :019:33
javispedrodjszapi: yes, I did not like it.19:33
javispedrobut I also dislike the web interface so :)19:34
djszapiuploaded....see you in 20 hours about it.19:34
* javispedro goes see if he has any money left in wallet for beers19:34
Arkenoiand aegis does not allow running arbitrary binaries when told to via devel-sh as advised19:34
javispedroArkenoi: where did you get this kernel from? is yours a device program?19:35
djszapirunning binaries without packages do not make too much sense on Harmattan. That would pretty much mean, there is no aegis defense as it was designed.19:35
djszapijavispedro: anyway, thanks, I am very pessimistic about it, so I think it does not help, but I have no idea about what else I should try out.19:36
alterego700 quid for a 64G N919:37
alteregoI blame elop19:37
javispedrodjszapi: let's see :)19:37
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alteregoHow can they justify another 200 quid for 48G of storage ..19:38
javispedrohey, Apple does it.19:38
Stskeepsalterego: not very cheap storage i think19:38
alteregoHrm :/19:39
alteregoDon't think I can justify buying an N9 at all anymore.19:39
Stskeepsi'd buy an n9 if the reception is better19:40
alteregoI think it will be better than the N950, if that's your benchmark .19:41
Stskeepsit's not satisfying my daily-usage criteria so19:42
alteregoYeah, it doesn't work particularly well for me ..19:42
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Stskeepsi felt a little like 'death grip' ..19:43
javispedroStskeeps: btw, you think there's a chance to get the source of the harmattan xserver-xorg-video-fbdev? heard anything about it?19:44
Stskeepsjavispedro: it's quite close to what we have in meego, i think19:45
djszapijavispedro: bingo:
javispedrosimilar but there has been a cleanup (according to debian/changelog) and seemingly introduces a crash19:45
djszapiit is sighy-ish :)19:46
Stskeepsi'm really not involved with harmattan, so :)19:46
javispedroso the binaries and the source not really match any longer :)19:46
djszapisorry ?19:46
javispedroStskeeps: I understand, I only hoped it could have a change if Meego was to get the new version soon :)19:46
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javispedrodjszapi: that was for Stskeeps, sorry.19:47
alteregomeego is getting wayland :P19:47
javispedrodjszapi: about OBS, I cannot fetch the logs seemingly =)19:47
javispedrodjszapi: probably the build did not even start yet :P19:47
Stskeepsjavispedro: i'd say 'possibly', but let's see.. the problem with the newer fbdev-sgx from meego pov is that it needs some patches to xorg we can't do..19:47
djszapijavispedro: sorry ?19:48
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javispedrodjszapi: it says "Status: Updating" and no log19:48
djszapirpc timeout, yes.19:49
djszapias said 80% of the time19:49
javispedrogive it more time19:49
djszapior even a bit more. This is something I cannot do anything with ....19:49
Stskeepsjavispedro: and in 1.3 we're more likely to go to wayland..19:49
djszapimore time :D :D :D19:49
djszapijavispedro: well, just fyi if you see it first, it is a mic2 rpc issue19:49
djszapiyou cannot do anything else than abort and re-build.19:50
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javispedroStskeeps: ah well, so either Nokia gives it or nothing I guess.19:50
javispedrowell, it's not that important.19:50
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Stskeepsjavispedro: we might have it for the Meego-on-n950 stuff, let's see, just landed after a holiday in sweden so :)19:51
javispedrohehe :)19:52
djszapijavispedro: so thing is that it might work in few days, maybe not, no guarantee. Work as in it starts doing anything19:53
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javispedrodjszapi: yeah... no idea why it happens... I remember it has happened to me but after an hour or two it usually started moving19:54
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djszapiI have not seen bigger pain than c-obs yet around Harmattan :d19:55
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djszapijavispedro: and we are back to the original idea, direct distribution would solve all thsi crap.19:57
djszapiI always get back to this idea after a lot of wasting hours, days, weeks.19:58
javispedrohey, we have been years with the autobuilder :)19:58
djszapithere are not enough people behind c-obs, it cannot work this way in theory.20:00
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djszapiI am about to get rid of c-obs and publish things on my webservice. That could actually work with some simple own script.20:01
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lbtIf there are any sane KDE devs around could they help djszapi with a basic bug report. He's having problems :
MeeGoBotBug 22650 cri, Undecided, ---, maemo, NEED, Direct distribution opportunity while c-obs cannot simply work20:07
lbtdjszapi: you really need to get your act together.20:08
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javispedrolbt: I do wonder what's the current status though:20:09
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lbtdjszapi: Please go and learn how to prepare a proper bug report before asking me for any more help. I've spent a long time pointing you in the right direction - the least you could do is show me a small amount of respect and put *some* effort in. Thanks20:09
lbtjavispedro: yep - I have no doubt there is a problem20:10
lbtbut I don't have time to do the diagnostics myself20:10
lbtI need the developer to isolate the section of the log, determine repeatability. that kind of thing20:11
* GAN900 dies from irony20:11
javispedrolbt: but that does not seem like a KDE problem20:11
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lbtjavispedro: no... it's not20:11
javispedrolbt: sorry, I meant to say, that does not seem something we could fix by editing the package20:11
javispedroI mean the current problem20:11
javispedroit seems to be hung without a log20:11
lbtjavispedro: no, agreed20:11
lbtjavispedro: so... what happens if you exit the build prior to that point?20:12
javispedroaccording to djszapi the only way to get it unstuck is to abort and retry repeteadl20:13
javispedrothis "Status: Updating..." thing has happened to me in the past, usually fixed by itself in a few hours20:13
lbtso it now sticks without building anything...20:13
lbtOK .. so this is a different bug repott20:13
javispedro(when the package builds in like 6 minutes)20:13
javispedrolbt: yes, sorry.20:13
djszapilbt: seriously, I have no idea what you are talking about. I cannot get more information than this with my brain. If you think it is not enough tell me what to do to help you...20:13
lbtif the bloody report had actually said that20:13
djszapilbt: the report said more times ?20:14
djszapiyou did not actually even read the first line of the first post. That bugs me a lot.20:14
javispedroforget about the bug report, we'll fix that later20:14
djszapianyway, answering there in a "former" way.20:14
javispedrofor now, enumerate the problems20:14
lbtdjszapi: your report sucks20:14
lbtit's useless20:15
djszapithanks kindly.20:15
lbt"We have been trying to build kdelibs for more than 1 month"20:15
lbtno... I'm serious20:15
lbtgo follow that link and learn something20:15
djszapilbt: do not be tiresome please.20:15
lbtdjszapi: you're pushing it...20:16
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djszapilbt: so many times I mentioned all the issues here, you never really helped, have not even tried. I do not have the sake to spend right now to collect the logs, but all the issues were reported to you here.20:17
djszapiAlso, I might be silly, but I have no more ideas what to try out about an rpc timeout and apparently nobody had here....20:17
* javispedro crashes Xorg again, dammit.20:18
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lbtso if your bug report had said "Once the build is scheduled it enters 'building' state and no log output is produced" ... *that* would be a clear bug report20:18
javispedrolbt: sadly I do not know why it happens and we'd have to use the deadly word "sometimes" in that bug report =)20:19
RzR950djszapi, i see your still active on that20:19
lbtjavispedro: but I was expecting some "out of memory" or parallel build issue from all the chat20:19
lbtnot "it doesn't start"20:20
lcuklbt, djszapi - there must be a way to cure this and communication is important.  we are all professionals here.20:20
lbtlcuk: read the bug report and tell me I haven't tried20:20
lcuki know lbt20:20
lcukdjszapi, i understand kdelibs is a big build20:21
lcukwhere on the obs is it (link please)20:21
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lbtlcuk: good point .. that link isn't in the bug report20:21
lcukthanks javispedro20:21
lcukdjszapi, the link says it is currently building20:22
javispedrosadly, downtime for now probably due to the extra load :)20:22
lcukhow long on average before you get a failure?20:22
javispedrolcuk: look at the logs, they are not there. my magic 8-ball says the build did not start yet.20:22
lcukthat was why I asked on average20:22
lcukfor my small builds I can usually find errors in a matter of minutes20:23
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lcukis it usual for kdelibs tweaks to take hours per iteration?20:23
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djszapilcuk: how should I know ?20:23
lcukdjszapi, well you are the caretaker of it20:23
djszapicaretaker != have any idea.20:23
lcukhow long do you  twiddle your thumbs after setting a build going20:23
lcukyou start a build running20:23
lcuklike baking a cake20:23
djszapimy idea is to get rid of c-obs. That is the only simple way.20:23
javispedrolcuk: the problem is that we do not know what is it doing at the moment20:23
lcukhow long is it in the oven for20:23
djszapilcuk: come on, be serious.20:24
javispedrolcuk: otherwise a build should be expected to take ~5hours. since this one is not parallelized for debug reasons, ~20 hours20:24
lcukdjszapi, I am very serious20:24
lcukcompilation of projects is analogous to baking20:24
lcukyou want a nicely baked build at the end of it20:24
lcukand usually you know how long it takes in the oven..20:25
djszapilcuk: try to understand, I have zero clue at this stage, even it is said "it is not a proper bug report", still no clue, you can repeat it, still not clue20:25
djszapisee ?20:25
lcukdjszapi, not really - does obs simply not build the packages ?20:26
djszapican you see there anything ? Have you actually checked the link out what more people pasted ?20:26
djszapilcuk: you were here so many times when I pasted these issues, completely different stages when it died.20:27
lcuki know20:27
djszapiso what communication issue ?20:27
lcukhas the obs managed to give you binaries out the other end?20:27
javispedromany bugs in a single report issue ;)20:27
djszapiI do not really know what is going on. You can say that I am silly, I take it, I am.20:27
djszapibut I have no clue.20:27
lcukno djszapi you are not silly - this is linux we try and help each other20:28
lcukand I know obs has been a bit of a mare, but you are using it - has it given you any binaries out of the other end at all?20:28
lcukor has the struggling with each step been why you got to file bug 22650 today20:29
MeeGoBotBug cri, Undecided, ---, maemo, NEED, Direct distribution opportunity while c-obs cannot simply work20:29
djszapilcuk: would I be here if I have working binary kdelibs packages ? :)20:29
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lcukwow djszapi :D20:30
djszapiWould I have been mentioning for 1 month, if it had produced output binaries ? :)20:30
lcukyou have loads of builds in your project20:30
* lcuk has only 220:30
lcukand one of those fails20:30
rzrMohammadAG: I built cli-f-s it's in repo now, thx20:30
lcukdjszapi, so you kindof know how obs works - you have used it to build a whole load of (what I assume) are dependencies?20:30
djszapilcuk: c-obs is dead :D20:31
lcuktis just resting.20:31
lcuknorwegen blue servers20:31
lcuklbt, thanks for that link20:32
lcukdjszapi, you have put more projects through obs than I have seen others20:32
lcukyes your kdelibs is not yet building20:32
lcukbut bloody nora you have a greate cache20:32
djszapiit is so pointless if my final purpose (kdelibs) does not work20:32
djszapiso many wasted efforts.20:32
lcukdjszapi, not really20:33
javispedrolcuk: that's why I empathize -- kdelibs is probably one of the largest packages that will pass through the autobuilder.20:33
djszapijavispedro: you are actually wrong ;)20:33
javispedroit's larger than webkit after all. remember the problems webkit had in the original autobuilder20:33
lcukand probably one of the most awesome20:33
lcukit has to say20:33
djszapiyou have not seen workspace and runtime yet ;)20:33
djszapithat is about more times to build than kdelibs.20:33
javispedrodjszapi: I'd be surprised20:33
lcukdjszapi, well by the time you get to those, you will be an expert ;)20:33
lcuknow, can you ping me when kdelibs build restarts20:34
djszapino, I do not care about c-obs20:34
lcukand i will try best to help follow it20:34
djszapiI will write some script tonight, and get rid of this crap20:34
javispedroso, do we think that the best approach for the current situation is to kill the build and restart?20:34
* javispedro would have suggested to wait20:34
lbtjavispedro: there is no build20:34
djszapijavispedro: wait for what ?20:35
lcukcan I ask a question20:35
djszapijavispedro: wait more hours for the known timeout ? :)))20:35
lcukwhat does kdelibs actually do?20:35
* lcuk ducks20:35
lbtjavispedro: this is an OBS bug ... but it was so badly reported that I thought it was a kde build bug20:35
djszapilcuk: it is the base libraries for the whole kde project.20:35
lcukdjszapi, right20:35
djszapiapart from the pure Qt support libraries. It has plasma, kdecore, kdeui, webkit and others.20:35
javispedrolbt: happened to me, but it eventually starts (~2hours or so)20:36
javispedroso no idea20:36
lbtjavispedro: hmmm it could be pulling stuff from w/o a cache?20:36
djszapilbt: you keep blaming me, but what should I report to you ? Could you tell that ?20:36
javispedrolbt: that would explain why it takes longer for packages having many more deps like djszapi's20:36
javispedrolbt: so I like it20:36
djszapiIt is not I am not reporting more because I am laizy, I do not know what to report.20:36
lbtdjszapi: "Once the build is scheduled it enters 'building' state and no log output is produced" ... *that* would be a clear bug report20:37
lbtdo you see20:37
lbtclear. To the point20:37
djszapijavispedro: yes, debian has at least 5-6 packagers for just kde.20:37
lbtnot rainbows20:37
lbtnot "missed opportunities"20:37
djszapilbt: but I wrote it ?20:37
djszapiI even sent a link ?20:37
djszapior well, actually my 10 fingers are not enough how many times I told it to you here and sent a link.20:38
lbtdjszapi: do you know how much crap I deal with every day?20:38
djszapiI guess the same as with me.20:38
lbtWhy the hell would I bother remembering your problems too then?20:38
lbtthat is what bug reports/backlogs are for20:38
djszapilbt: you do not remember one time ok, not remember 2-5 times, but 20-30 times ? :)20:39
lbtso if you point me at a nice clear bug report... it helps me get back to the context.... recall the problem and work on it20:39
lbtyeah ... but sadly for you eventually I hear "buzzzzzzzz"20:39
djszapiI poked you every second day about kdelibs in the last 1 month.20:39
dm8tbrcommunity is when all sides work proactively together20:39
lbtand because there is no rigourous report... I can't do much when I get time20:39
lbtit doesn't hit my 'bug list'20:39
lbtso.... nothing gets done20:40
djszapiyou now have a bunch of things in that thread, you can think and swallow them.20:40
djszapiI would say the first step is to fix the rpc t imeout thing.20:41
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lbtnope... closing it.  If you want you can raise a clean report. If it is decent I'll look at it. I'm currently working on it anyhow.20:41
djszapiwould be way muuuuuuch easier to debug the /real/ issue20:41
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djszapiI will write the same things in a new report as well anyway20:41
djszapibut yeah, we can duplicate bugs, if you want to.20:42
lbtFeel free.20:42
djszapijavispedro: anyway, I am off to home, thank you for your help.20:44
djszapiI hope I can manage my script tonight and get rid of this crap :)20:44
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lbtrm_work:  thanks :)20:44
rm_workyeah >_<20:45
lbtjavispedro: so eventually you get an rpc timeout...20:46
javispedronot me, that's him20:46
javispedromy builds eventually go through20:46
lbtyeah... kdelibs20:46
lbtbut take a *long* time to start?20:46
javispedronext time I'll reproduce I'll grab the stopwatch :)20:46
lbtX-fade mentioned something ... we think there's a version mis-match issue. It seems to pull the entire harmattan dev env down for every build20:47
javispedroit's not _always_ though. Maybe, following your theory of downloading packages, there's a cache per pubworker?20:47
lbtthere should be20:47
lbttoo much crap on apps recently .... both my last weekends had zero H time20:48
lbtI have not built *one* harmattan package :(20:48
* javispedro now fears filling that feature request about the x86 harmattan target ;)20:48
javispedro(but I do think having the x86 target would help discard qemu issues during builds)20:48
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lbtthat's a very sane request20:50
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GAN900Has anybody encountered any more Components hurdles they'd like better documented in an Improved Qt Components Widget Gallery application?21:11
TSCHAKeeewe should have a header bar component in there21:11
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fiferboy(I hope) missing components isn't what GAN means, but undocumented component features21:22
* RST38h moos21:23
RST38hGAN: I stopped counting my hurdles after some point21:24
javispedroGoogle is worse every day21:25
javispedroI just googled for "tabco" wanting to know what the fuss is about and the first result was about "tobacco"21:25
TSCHAKeeeTomacco. ;)21:26
rzrtomma: ping21:27
RST38hjavispedro: yes, they are starting to make assumptions about your intentions21:27
RST38hjavispedro: never a good idea for people whose intentions differ from the crowd21:28
SpeedEvilargh - teeny scratch on the camera window - thankfully not over the camera.21:33
SpeedEvilSome slip-on cover would be awesome.21:33
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: got your "coffin"?21:33
tommarzr, pong21:36
rzrtomma: fire!21:38
rzrtomma: i failed to build your package21:38
rzrtomma: I am trying again now21:38
tommauploaded compiled package there too21:39
rzrwhat are the benefit over gitorious ?21:40
javispedroI see a bugtracker for a start21:41
tommabugtracker and posibility to release something there21:41
javispedroseemingly is a pretty standard Trac setup21:41
rzrgarage is based on gforge no ?21:42
javispedroso it competes with, not gitorious21:42
rzri would not depends on a single corporation w/ all my respect to nokia21:43
rzrbut its not that important21:43
javispedrowell if they're just hosting21:43
javispedroat this point the future is more dubious21:43
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tommarzr, yeah problem is that it is building it with dpkg-buildpackage...21:45
tommadefault creator debian_harmattan/rules does not have configure and build stuff21:46
tommathey need to be uncommented21:46
rzrthat's what i thought , will u fix it , or should i try ?21:47
tommathere are those two lines which say "uncomment this to build wihtout qt-creator"21:48
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kimjulbt, does obs do any checks to the contents of generated .deb before publishing it?21:51
rzrdont think so21:53
kimjuI tried to find out why the building of the terminal package hangs. the original rules file adds _gpgsig into the deb along with the _aegis. if I disable that, the package gets published.21:56
javispedrokimju: did you find where it hung on the logs?21:56
kimjujavispedro, nope, the final output of the build log is the same in ok and failing cases.21:57
kimjualso it seems that aegis-deb-util regenerates the control.tar.gz inside the .deb, while aegis-deb-add just adds the _aegis file. I'm now retrying with -util, without the _gpgsig part.21:58
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lbtkimju: no, just publishes it22:04
kimjuthen I really wonder why this happens.. :o22:05
djszapijavispedro: still stuck at the same step after 1-2 hours :)22:05
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javispedrodunno if to leave for a day or abort it already :P22:12
djszapiI cannot actually abort it, on the webinterface at least.22:13
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kimjuand it hangs again. so, running aegis-deb-util, that replaces control.tar.gz and adds _aegis hangs. running aegis-deb-add that just adds the _aegis works. running that and a python script (that in turn runs ar) that adds _gpgsig hangs again.22:20
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* lbt looked at djszapi's problem... turns out the code is badly packed and the project has debugbuild enabled. OBS worked first time when I made a simple test project, copied in the package and built against djszapi's home.22:48
lbt"dpkg-source: error: File /usr/src/packages/SOURCES/kde4libs_4.6.95-0.debian.tar.gz has size 319988 instead of expected 312932"22:48
lbtso djszapi .. try disabling debugbuild in your home...22:49
djszapithat is not really the problem.22:50
lcukdjszapi, one step at a time!22:50
antman8969so anyone else see the tabco campaign today? (fusion garage)22:50
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djszapiwhat you might actually need to check out is the "original" case, before trying to upload the package with the "-j1" option.22:50
lbtThe code package isn't relevant at this point. That appears clearly in the logs.22:51
lbtthe issue is getting the build to start22:51
djszapinot really sure what you mean22:51
djszapithe "original" link we showed you is about a build crap.22:51
lbtso djszapi .. try disabling debugbuild in your home...22:52
lcukI am brewing the kettle, who wants one22:53
lbtjust had a mini-FAB :)22:53
antman8969lbt, did anyone ever look into the missing MDeclarativeCache header on the harmattan target in obs? Is there a bug report I can file somewhere?22:53
Venemodjszapi, do you have 5 minutes for me now? :)22:53
djszapinope, about to sleep22:53
djszapiI would just like to disable the debugbuild whatever it is for...22:53
Venemodjszapi, could you ping me tomorrow then?22:53
djszapilbt: it is for ... ?22:53
rcgantman8969: actually i compiled an application that uses MDeclarativeCache22:54
rcgor what do you mean?22:54
lbtbottom left select the all/all square and pick 'disable'22:54
djszapiit has already been disabled in the shared community repository anyway22:55
djszapiand it did not work there either22:55
djszapiso not culsprit...22:55
antman8969rcg, if you got it to compile and you #include <MDeclarativeCache>, thats what I was hoping would happen22:55
* lbt walks away22:55
antman8969rcg I was trying to compile a few weeks ago and it wasn't found22:55
rcgi used #include <applauncherd/MDeclarativeCache>22:56
antman8969interesting, thanks. I'll try it out this afternoon22:56
djszapilcuk: sorry, but what did you mean by this "djszapi, one step at a time!" ?22:57
rcgantman8969: and i put applauncherd-dev in Build-Depends: in the debian/control file22:57
lcukdjszapi, well lbt spent time investigating your problem and asked for you to try something22:57
antman8969rcg: right22:57
djszapilcuk: it has already been tried out as I pointed out22:58
lcukwhilst it may not be the problem, he was trying to dig through and make a clean build22:58
djszapinext "step", please :)22:58
djszapilcuk: my report has also been closed as invalid.23:02
lcukdjszapi, the build log
lcukhas the problem lbt said23:04
djszapilcuk: sorry, I do not care about c-obs.23:04
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rzrdjszapi: u said that months ago already :)23:05
djszapirzr: I did not care too much about it recently, yep :)23:06
djszapilet us continue it :)23:06
rzranyway the pb is kdelibs is that orig != dsc23:06
rzrin h:r:h23:06
djszapisorry ?23:06
djszapiCould you please form round sentences ?23:07
rzrdpkg-source: error: File /usr/src/packages/SOURCES/kde4libs_4.6.95-0.debian.tar.gz has size 319988 instead of expected 31293223:08
djszapimmm, seems you have no idea what is going on, so:23:08
djszapiI tried to upload a debian file today with -j1 and I forget to re-generate the sums. It is really not the problem and it happened few hours ago. It is now corrected, but then again, it is a few hours  fresh issue, and not really the original issue which has been happening for one month!23:09
lbtrzr: are you having any OBS problems building kdelibs other than the "size 319988 instead of expected 312932" which (as I'm sure you know) is a simple packaging error23:10
lbtok.... are you OK doing the sane bug report approach and analysing it?23:11
rzri know, as i did not upload that one  I reported the error to djszapi23:11
djszapiplease do not report this since it makes no sense23:11
djszapiwe are discussing this issue, but the real issue...23:11
djszapi* not discussing23:11
* lbt notes the value of having maintainers whose packaging you can rely on for a community repo... :)23:11
rzrtalking about that , any news on a official community repo ?23:12
lbtwell, Surrounds:Testing is there.23:13
djszapinothing for ages23:13
djszapiit never really worked.23:13
rzrwho take cares of it ?23:13
djszapinobody :D23:13
lbtI'm asking people in the community to propose some simple policy to decide that.23:13
djszapiyeah, for more than 7-8 months with so much care...23:13
lbtMy gut feel is we identify crucial missing pkgs23:13
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rzrok i am not hurry if it's better than what we're doing :)23:14
lbtlike cdbs type thing...23:14
djszapicdbs is a history.23:14
rzrnot it's not23:14
lcukdjszapi, you have pushed many packages into obs already23:14
lcukare they available for others to make use of?23:14
lbtand get those somehow 'sponsored' by some of the strong DD types ... basically if a package has a DD 'in the background' then I think that's sane23:14
djszapirzr: yes, it is. debian mentors do not really advise it, ask them.23:14
djszapilcuk: look, c-obs is dead :D23:15
lbtwe shouldn't re-invent the wheel23:15
djszapilcuk: I am afraid my vote is for back23:15
djszapilike so many people proposed it previously here, already.23:15
Venemowhy don't we just create a harmattan-extras on repository.maemo.org23:16
djszapiwe could do that, yes. It cannot be much worse than c-obs.23:16
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lbtVenemo: do you know what a substitution cipher is?23:17
djszapifrom what I see here, a lot of negative feedbacks about c-obs.23:17
lcukdjszapi, do you smile about anything? :P23:17
Venemolbt, I have no idea.23:18
mikhaslcuk, end of month. the paycheck.23:18
rzrdjszapi: i dont agrea23:18
lbtit's what turns "harmattan-extras on" into "Surrounds on pub," .... same meaning... different letters23:18
djszapilcuk: sorry ?23:19
mikhasdjszapi, compared to OVI store, which doesnt even list a N9/N950 yet …23:19
rzrobs is far for perfect, but i am kinda fan of having a such tool like ubuntu build service those are brillant23:19
mikhasif we want to distribute software, then c-obs is the only real alternative right now, no??23:20
djszapirzr: which does not work ?23:20
djszapimikhas: no23:20
djszapiactually it is not an alternative to distribute kdelibs, or what are you watching ?23:20
lbtrzr: I'd like it if you could identify the most fundamental packages in your area and make a list of them ... just 5-1023:20
mikhasok, I didnt follow the discussion around kdelibs23:20
djszapithen please stop staying insane things :)23:21
djszapi* saying23:21
rzrlbt: well i dont know your priorities23:21
lbtthen we can start an email thread about packaging and ... most importantly.... maintaining them23:21
lbtrzr: the ones that occur most in the build-deps but aren't in harmattan23:21
djszapilbt: we do not need rules until the system actually works.23:21
rzrbest would to set up popcon to know that23:21
djszapitry to make the system works first23:21
djszapiand then people can consider using it ...23:21
lbtjust a gut feel - not an analysis23:21
lbtno, not apps23:21
lbtlibraries or tools23:22
rzrwell hard to tell i can have a look though23:22
rzrlbt: libtls would help i think23:22
lbtas I say, I think someone mentioned cdbs.... which may well need a patch for H23:22
lbtyes, things like that too23:22
djszapino, cdbs does not need any patch23:23
rzrgtk :)23:23
lbtthen we can start by saying "these 5/10 pkgs" go into Surrounds23:23
rzr libbox2d-qml23:23
lbtautomake yes... lets hold back on mega stuff like gtk unless we have some gtk maintainer23:23
rzr python3-defaults23:24
lbtequally python is 'big'23:24
lbtand there's a meego-python team23:24
rzri'll dont ask for mesa :)23:25
lbtso they should be involved in making a 'default' version for the community23:25
lbtactually it's a good point ... mesa is part of HW adaptation23:25
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mikhasI want Vala.23:26
lbtmikhas: is there a vala-meego group? part of meego-gtk ?23:26
mikhasbut then again, one can just ship the generated C code …23:26
mikhaslbt, I wouldnt consdier Vala as part of GTK+23:27
lbtrzr: OK ... so I'm off to do some work ... don't drop them here... do an email23:27
rzri'll stop here to let other ask :)23:27
lbtand remember... 5-10 only23:27
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lbtthe hard part isn't listing all packages in OSS ... it's picking just a few to start with23:27
rzrtell me your email i'll cut and paste this chat session23:27
mikhaswhat is the maintenance effort really?23:27
rzrlbt: what about packages i use every day like tmux or rsync ?23:28
lbtrzr: cut'n'paste ... not really. Put some thought in23:28
lbtit's not about you... it's about setting a base for the community23:28
djszapimikhas: what do you mean ?23:28
lbthome:rzr is for your "I want" code23:28
lbt(for now)23:28
lbtmikhas: ask again in 18months23:28
rzrlet me suggest to create a wiki page about that community repo23:29
mikhasdjszapi, I can only speak for GNOME libs, but so far everything that was autotool'ed was rather easy to "maintain"23:29
djszapirzr: there is already one actually.23:29
mikhasif that means updating from upstream23:29
rzrurl ?23:29
lbtrzr and mikhas did you ever read :
djszapimikhas: I do not see how it is different to any distribution, especially debian. In this particular case, I think it is even easier.23:29
lbt(especially the linked pages)23:29
mikhaslbt, this was discussed back in Dublin already, no?23:30
rzri'll put my 5/10 list item to start and pple may vote on them and we'll start in a week or so23:30
lbtmikhas: oh yes... and guess how much effort got put in by (! lbt & xfade) ?23:30
rzrlbt: not yet that's the page i've never found better now than never23:31
lbtbut now we have a device and some movement...23:31
djszapiwe always had devices, n900, tablets, etc23:31
lbthopefully the thought behind it may make some people look at the situation with maemo extras and think a little23:31
rzrlbt: can we use that page to list those 5/10 packages ?23:31
lbtrzr: sure... I propose some kind of action plan page.23:32
lbtthose pages are about the reasoning ... try not to mix things up too much23:32
rzrnot that soon i'll prefer to read all the boring linked pages :)23:33
lbtthey're full of wit and insight!23:33
mikhasI probably have a too simple view on these matters, so you wouldnt want my input anyways.23:34
lbtif you consider my points and take the time to respond then of course I would. If you don't take the time to read a carefully thought out proposal... then no, not so much ;)23:35
djszapithe system must get stable first anyway.23:35
mikhasI dont think my simpl view on these matters would change. I'd prefer a simple solution that works now and increase the difficulty iteratively ;-)23:36
mikhasBut you want the whole QA and whatnot working from day 1.23:36
mecehmm qtsdk managed to generate svg and png icons and make the thing in control file, but how do I do that when I change the icon?23:36
lbtmikhas: in other words you are saying "I don't know what you said but it's probably wrong"23:36
lbtOK ... so that's coming down on the "not so much" I'm afraid...23:37
mikhasIt doesnt sound very convincing.23:37
djszapiI think about that with mikhas. Full of QA from the minute first can kill the purpose.23:37
djszapi* agree23:37
lbtNo, I don't want the whole QA from day 1. But I don't want a steaming pile of mixed up junk either.23:37
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djszapiwe are here for leisure time, and it is not a paid job for us. I do not think 100% QA is a good idea. It can just frigthen the so few enthusiasts way - including myself.23:38
lbtWhich, btw, is not useless... just not a good baseline to use when you aim for a reliable system23:38
djszapi* away23:38
lbtit's *great* for hacking ! :D23:38
lcukthe main thing about qt23:39
lcukis that less cruft by default23:39
djszapithat is the thing, yes we are hackers, not a company.23:39
* lbt off for a bit .... bbl8r23:39
lcukin the maemo days, it was possible easily to throw stuff at autobuilder and be in -devel23:39
mecelcuk, I want that for n9/5023:42
mecewhy does this svg icon show up so fugly in app grid?23:42
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rzrlbt: i'll think about what you suggested , but i started this entry in case of someone what to join this task :
rzr100% QA is needed soon or later23:46
rzrlike debian23:46
rzrthat's what make the distro so streinght23:46
rzrarg how do you speel that word23:46
djszapiI prefer the sane habit over the dogmatic bunch of rules.23:47
rzrI need a spellchecker too :)23:48
djszapiand at any is a dream world since the first step would be to fix c-obs.23:48
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djszapiand I am still not sure c-obs is the best place of doing this.23:48
rzrdjszapi: enough time for chatting , we'll need to RTFM :)23:48
djszapieh ?23:49
djszapiI think it is a good idea to try out, and we can have a good comparison.23:50
djszapiso we can choose which one fits better for Harmattan.23:50
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