IRC log of #europython for Saturday, 2010-07-24

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mattiHi voidspace00:23
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zerokgood morning :-)11:26
aa_morning everyone who is still there sprinting11:46
aa_although I imagine none of them can say on irc long enough because of the network connection11:46
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birkenfeldaa_: indeed, it's curious that none of the usual suspects are in #python-dev12:27
zerokaa_: still there12:33
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birkenfeldzerok: so, did you see any core sprinters?12:46
zerokbirkenfeld: well, voidspace is still here ;-)12:47
voidspacedon't take my name in vein12:48
voidspaceseveral core sprinters12:48
zerokhehe12:48
voidspacedickinism, Ronald Ousseron, Ezio Melotti, Marin v loewis, Richard Jones12:48
voidspaceplus a bunch of folk I don't know who may or may not be sprinting on core topics12:48
voidspacebirkenfeld: where are you?12:48
birkenfeldvoidspace: coming, coming...12:49
birkenfeldvoidspace: did they order sandwiches already?12:49
birkenfeldor is there something else planned for lunch12:50
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voidspacebirkenfeld: they did order sandwhiches12:53
birkenfeldvoidspace: so we're too late for that?12:53
voidspacebirkenfeld: but I didn't as I will go to mcdonalds or something12:53
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lvhhello16:04
lvhis the delegate list online anywhere? actually im particularly interested in the names of the conference dinner attendees16:06
lvh(my table had a great guy whose name i wrote down but apparently misspelled)16:06
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lvhhttp://wiki.europython.eu/During?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=table_plan.pdf16:17
lvhfound it16:17
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aa_is there anywhere to dump slides?16:34
lvhaa_: for lightning talks?16:38
lvhhttp://wiki.europython.eu/LightningTalks16:39
lvhhttp://wiki.europython.eu/TalkMaterials16:39
aa_lvh: thanks16:39
lvhaa_: if it's about the glashammer talk i think you want http://wiki.europython.eu/Talks/Glashammer16:39
aa_lvh: it is, and thanks16:40
lvhaa_: I guessed that aa meant ali afshar16:40
lvhheuristics are awesome16:40
aa_:)16:40
aa_the traioling underscore is the IRC equivalent of a fake moustache16:41
lvhyou wouldn't look good in a fake moustache16:41
lvhyour laugh is awesome!16:41
lvhit makes me happy and warm and fuzzy.16:41
lvhyou used to be an emergency room doctor, right?16:42
lvhI bet you could make me feel okay about breaking both legs or something16:42
lvh(the painkillers help too, but the smile is an important part)16:42
aa_haha, thanks, did you catch my talk?16:42
lvhyes, yes i did16:42
aa_ah nice one16:42
lvhit was sad :(16:42
* aa_ is trying to guess who you are16:42
lvhor at least the last slide was16:42
lvhaa_: i had dinner with you!16:43
aa_aha!16:43
aa_I thought so16:43
lvhaa_: also I have tattoos of twisted16:43
aa_yes yes yes16:43
lvh(*that* narrowed it down)16:43
aa_I rem,ember now16:43
lvhand a projector ate my laptop16:43
lvhthrice16:43
aa_how did your talk go, I missed the lightning talks16:44
lvhwell, I regret that I couldn't really say anything technical16:45
lvhI didn't want to lie about features we did or did not have16:45
aa_hahah16:46
aa_you *must* lie during lightjning talks16:46
lvhbut I got a few room-wide chuckles and one gut laugh!16:46
lvhand a few positive comments16:46
aa_you on twitter?16:46
lvhyep, lvh_16:46
lvhsince some guy is squatting lvh :-(16:46
lvhIt's my fake moustache16:46
aa_well, "Never let the truth come in the way of a good lightning talk."16:46
lvhaa_: I did lie though16:47
lvhsomething about the goal of mont-e being anything other than subverting py3k from within16:47
aa_it's all good though16:47
aa_you can't subvert py3k without making it bigger16:48
lvhaa_: http://docs.google.com/present/view?id=d9wrrrq_15ch78nq9n16:48
lvhaa_: so thanks to the moratorium it's going to live until at least december (==3.2)16:48
lvhaa_: slides that are incomprehensible minus the words: slide 8 (that's what you get when you google for 'actor model')16:49
aa_so mont-e is quite a cool idea16:49
lvhaa_: the cool bit is that after rhettingers talk on monocle16:49
lvhraymond and guido were discussing potential ways of doing return-from-generators (in the context of having portable async code that looks like @inlineCallbacks, basically)16:50
lvhthe awesome part is that mont-e already does this16:50
aa_I think I am weird16:50
aa_I *hate* inlinecallbacks16:50
aa_and find the use of yield for things like the contextmanager decorator an absiolute abomination16:51
aa_callbacks themselves are sequential16:51
aa_I can't see the problem16:51
aa_these multiyields are *hideous*16:51
lvhaa_: I agree this is why I write twisted code sans inlineCallbacks16:51
lvhthere are some cases where that does become hideous though16:52
lvhhere's what it looks like in Mont-E16:52
lvhhttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/241237/16:52
lvhdefer being a keyword and part of a defer expression16:52
lvhwhich is like yield but different16:52
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aa_lvh: so the defer keywords just returns execution and does something async?16:54
aa_or does that block?16:54
aa_I bet it doesn't :D16:54
lvhof course not16:54
lvhi wrote it16:54
lvhE is the greatest language ever because it has no way of expressing blocking ;-)16:55
lvh(it has "wait on this async thing", so i guess it sort of does)16:55
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aa_lvh: so that example doesn't block, but what happens to the execution?17:03
aa_it goes off and does other stuff17:03
aa_?17:03
aa_so I guess that e only lives in a mainloop of some kind17:03
lvhaa_: Yep. Just like in inlineCallbacks17:03
lvhaa_: Sort of.17:04
lvhaa_: E has an eventloop, yes; it's generally shared over actors for performance reasons17:04
aa_and does that loop start itself when needed?17:05
lvhaa_: Yep.17:05
lvhaa_: So ordinary programs still work fine17:05
aa_that's blindingkly cool17:06
lvhaa_: ironically the thing some people wriitng twisted dislike about py3k (little regard for backwards compatibility) allowed us to do this17:06
lvhaa_: we just stopped caring about making old reactors really work17:06
lvhso we also have really pluggable reactors17:06
lvhinstead of the nasty things reactors currently have to do17:06
aa_lvh: and how abut things like gtk?17:07
lvhaa_: that would be the pluggable bit17:07
lvhaa_: we know how to do it nicely, we don't know how to do it nicely while remaining api-compatible17:07
aa_perfect17:07
aa_so basically reactor.iterate which starts itself automatically17:08
lvhaa_: something like that, yes17:08
aa_muahahahah!17:08
aa_are you on the dash/glyph hitlist?17:08
lvhglyph still likes me17:08
lvha bit17:08
lvhaa_: also dash is the person who got me into e17:09
lvhaa_: and he started writing an implementation of E in C17:09
lvhhttps://launchpad.net/ecru17:10
lvhso I doubt that would be a hard sale17:10
lvhsell? sale?17:10
aa_nutters17:10
aa_sell17:10
aa_lvh: off to play football, catch you later17:10
lvhaa_: have fun17:10
lvhtry not to get hurt17:10
aa_hah, thanks17:11
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